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Thread: 3 axis welding clamp
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3rd Feb 2020, 11:27 PM #1Most Valued Member
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3 axis welding clamp
Had this emailed to me and thought I'd share it. We all know what it's like trying to hold and tack 3 pieces of metal all square to each other at once. Nigh on impossible, so hopefully this will help.
https://www.homemadetools.net/forum/...um=email&utm_cTo grow old is mandatory, growing up is optional.
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4th Feb 2020, 01:13 AM #2Golden Member
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I would make one of those if I had a three axis clamp to be able to get it tacked together square
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4th Feb 2020, 07:30 PM #3
For reference, there's a few commercial styles of these around. That being said, you'd be 300 clams lighter to go in and buy one.
Saw one at a metal shop a few weeks back. And it didn't look too sturdy either.
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4th Feb 2020, 09:08 PM #4Philomath in training
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I made up a 2D version some time back. Material can clamp to the inside or the outside; Al to avoid spatter issues
P1040784.JPG
It gets used occasionally but for the most part if I'm making a square frame I'll tack the corners and then check across diagonals rather than use something like this, or a magnetic square.
Michael
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6th Feb 2020, 10:34 PM #5Most Valued Member
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I may well be a grumpy and negative old boily, which I'll leave up to the individual to decide, but every time I look at clamps of this type, I walk away asking WHY?
Tacking up a square frame is dead easy using the method that MichaelG outlined - tack corners, check diagonals, tack once more on each internal corner and quickly recheck diagonals then weld as required. If you need to add a vertical member, then simply sit the vertical member in place, find the longest corner by squaring in two directions, tack that corner, square the member in one axis and tack, square the member in the other axis and tack. At this point, either weld off all joints or tack the tie bars between the members if it is a table of similar before welding off. Simpler, quicker and more accurate than any clamping system I have seen.
If people took the time to learn to cut accurately and tack up accurately in sequence then they would be far better off than relying on clamps and guides to do the work for them.
I have used magnetic clamps/guides in the past and continue to use them to this day, but only to rest material on when building larger frames and working alone.
If it works for people, then that's fine, but I reckon most would gain greater benefit from some skills development with a view to not relying on tools such as these. As an example, the techniques I mentioned can transfer to triangular, pentagonal, hexagonal and whatever shape you can conceive. The 3 axis clamps can only do square and rectangular shapes, which I admit is arguably the majority of what people fabricate, however there is a whole wide world out there and who knows what your project may be tomorrow or next week? .
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6th Feb 2020, 11:22 PM #6Most Valued Member
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We have a couple of "Boily's" that make a large production of making a 3 axis item. I made square jigs for them to clamp stuff to and they still manage to get it wrong. Trying to hold and tack seem to be a real problem for them, they need someone to hold the piece and the square so that they then can tack it. The pieces in question are 50 X 50 duragal approx 900 long, so it's not as if it was heavy RHS or columns!!!
KrynTo grow old is mandatory, growing up is optional.
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7th Feb 2020, 01:50 AM #7Most Valued Member
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Yep, I hear you loud and clear, somewhat similar to the performance some of them put on when it comes to bending pipe - the scrap pile is larger than the completed component pile.
I can understand apprentices and back yarders having issues with tacking and distortion, but if it's your trade and you've got some experience under your belt then you should have some idea you'd hope.
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7th Feb 2020, 07:29 PM #8Most Valued Member
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These "boily's" welds to me are atrocious, seen better on here from someone with NO experience. When I weld the RHS into a "T" I can get nice neat almost flat welds, these blokes welds are very lumpy and with porosity. To hide the porosity they just spot weld over the tops of it!!!!!
I've had non tradie welders do a FAR better job with similar material.
I read you loud and clear about the pipes. Worked with another "boily", our job was to make some gates out of pipe with mitred corners, he did the cutting and I was to weld them up. One end fitted fine, the problem was when the other end was put in place there would be a gap anywhere from 5-10mm on the top. This was on 25NB galv pipe in the days before MIG welders. Had seen some of his other work when he went out on his own, BLIND FREDDY, could have done a lot better job, we were called in to rectify his work, which was again atrocious. Pipes were bent with more curves in them than a Hula Girl.
I didn't do an apprenticeship in any trade, and was taught to be proud of whatever work you did. Nowadays it seem like no one cares about the quality of their work.
Sorry to offend you Blind Fred.
KrynTo grow old is mandatory, growing up is optional.
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7th Feb 2020, 11:09 PM #9Most Valued Member
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Yes, no good having trade papers without standards.
In a previous workplace, we serviced the transport industry and it became quite embarrassing when truck owners would forbid our foreman to touch their truck. I wouldn't let him touch a billycart either!
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7th Feb 2020, 11:19 PM #10China
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I remember way back in the seventies I was working for the company that made ATCO huts, among other things whenever they wanted new boiler makers, even if they were qualified tradesmen they had to pass a series of welding tests before thy would be hired, it was quite eye opening to see the number of so called boiler makers that could not weld and were sent on their way.
Just as a side note I remember the welders wearing full chrome leather jackets using 5/16 rods, by lunch time in summer the guys would change the jacket because they were literally dripping wet
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8th Feb 2020, 12:36 AM #11Most Valued Member
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Thanks China, maybe I should get the boss to do the same, make them do several welding tests.
As Karl mentioned having papers means nothing. I've had several jobs, where I said right up front that I don't have any papers etc., was told as long as you can do decent welds, that's all we care about.
KrynTo grow old is mandatory, growing up is optional.
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8th Feb 2020, 10:06 PM #12Most Valued Member
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9th Feb 2020, 01:18 AM #13China
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I would not be surprised there were a quite few workers on the site, as for the burns OHAS was a very different game back in the seventies
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10th Feb 2020, 07:50 PM #14Most Valued Member
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That's why International Catamarans (INCAT) do not employ sheet metal workers or boilermakers by choice. During their major expansion during the early to mid nineties, they preferred employees were butchers and carpenters from what I've been told by a close source. INCAT had their own training school affiliated with TAFE and taught their employees the way they wanted them to weld and fabricate. The welders were also modified to have only two basic settings, thick or thin, as that took care of maintaining weld parameters.
The down side of this of course was that your employability elsewhere was almost zilch.
One of the biggest failings of Boilermakers that have not been exposed to working as coded welders is that they usually think they know better and will not follow a procedure sheet. Sometimes, no matter how good you think you are, you have to paint by numbers.
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10th Feb 2020, 08:30 PM #15Most Valued Member
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You're right Karl, some don't want to be told, they think they know better.
Today was a good example, loading a sheep ramp onto the trailer, we make the ramp part separate, then load it onto its own trailer which is all ready made.
Instead of having a trestle at the back and lifting the front by a sling,and sliding the trailer under it. They proceed to take away the rear trestle, so it's sitting on the ground, then lift the front and push the trailer under it. They get so far, that it won't go any further, so the sling comes off, and the fork comes to the back end to lift it, insert a short piece of pipe, with the intention of rolling the ramp on a bit more. The slings are attached to the lifter again. The fork ended up coming to the back end about 4 times.
What should have been a 20 minute job took 3 of us nearly an hour. It's getting to the point where I'll refuse to help them, I have enough trouble as it is without injuring myself more.
I wonder if writing down the procedure will help?? Maybe not as they still think they know better!!!!
KrynTo grow old is mandatory, growing up is optional.
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