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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Melbourne
    Age
    35
    Posts
    1,522

    Default

    I know that Purcell and the machinery dealer Demco were owned by the same extended family I think.

    Sent from my Nokia 8 Sirocco using Tapatalk

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rosebery/Eastlakes
    Posts
    115

    Default Low gear and selector dog update

    Yesterday I got stuck in and removed the spindle in order to attempt the salvage of the selector dog. I was successful with the removal process and am working things out as I go as I have no workshop manual or other documentation.. I digress..

    As you can see the selector gear is heavily worn. The gear has 2 key ways machined into it so I might be lucky enough to rotate the gear to utilise the additional key way in order to access good teeth. The other option would be to build up the damaged teeth with some silicon bronze and get them machined to restore their profile. I'm favouring the first option at present.

    20190713_170406.jpg20190714_124410.jpg20190714_124453.jpg



    I removed the low gear and selector dog and set about trying to separate them. Thankfully the welds were poor and with a some careful grinding and a couple of sharp blows with a rubber mallet I was able to liberate them!!!

    20190713_175837.jpg 20190713_180048.jpg


    A couple of the corners of the drive dog teeth on the low gear broke off in the process and so I might try building them up with silicon bronze.

    20190713_180505.jpg20190714_124214.jpg20190714_124229.jpg


    All told, after a bit of a clean up they don't look too bad and I think they'll be fine for my purposes.

    20190714_124144.jpg20190714_124128.jpg

    Flo

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Melbourne
    Age
    35
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    1,522

    Default

    What are the gear specs? I'm sure you can just buy a stock gear or get one made. No way repairing that will be cost effective. Good job saving the collar.

    Sent from my Nokia 8 Sirocco using Tapatalk

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Norwood-ish, Adelaide
    Age
    59
    Posts
    6,541

    Default

    I agree. Good save.
    Hard to know what came first - some gorilla swinging on the handle, mashes the teeth so the lathe is welded 'in range', or the welding is done for some reason and the gear gets mashed up when someone tries to change it.
    I think the silicone bronze to build up the clutch teeth should work. For the gear, I half agree with Ralph - I would not waste time building up and then machining. For a gear that size, I'd just make a new one.

    Michael

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rosebery/Eastlakes
    Posts
    115

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by caskwarrior View Post
    What are the gear specs? I'm sure you can just buy a stock gear or get one made. No way repairing that will be cost effective. Good job saving the collar.
    Hi Ralph,

    The gear is approximately 2" diameter by 2" long, 18 teeth with a 5/8" (0.625") bore.. It doesn't look to be anything special. I do have the option of trying to mount it using the alternate keyway which might give me access to good teeth .. And I was fortunate that the welding job was terrible..

    20190714_124453.jpg

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rosebery/Eastlakes
    Posts
    115

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael G View Post
    I agree. Good save.
    Hard to know what came first - some gorilla swinging on the handle, mashes the teeth so the lathe is welded 'in range', or the welding is done for some reason and the gear gets mashed up when someone tries to change it.
    I think the silicone bronze to build up the clutch teeth should work. For the gear, I half agree with Ralph - I would not waste time building up and then machining. For a gear that size, I'd just make a new one.

    Michael
    Hi Michael,

    Yeah I have no idea... the backstory for this lathe must be interesting as there is obviously a reason for the welded clutch/collar.. still I'm very happy that I was able to separate it and I think the silicon bronze repair for the clutch should work.

    I agree re the gear.. it doesn't look to be anything special. I might just try rotating it to use the other keyway.. I think that should give me good teeth.. otherwise a new gear will be on the cards.. Mind you with the spindle out the best time to change it is now..

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rosebery/Eastlakes
    Posts
    115

    Default

    Since I have the headstock open and the spindle out I'm wanting to pull everything out and have a good look at it. I tried to remove the intermediate shaft (my terminology) but it won't budge. I have removed all machine screws that I can see which could be restricting movement and given the ends of the shaft a couple of decent blows with a hammer and brass drift. The bronze bearing sleeve (bushing) at the change gear end appears to be worn eccentrically which could indicate a slight bend in the shaft. I need to replace this sleeve and check the shaft as the wear and subsequent oil leakage will only get worse with continued use.

    20190716_204355.jpg20190716_204447.jpg

    20190716_204512.jpg20190716_204546.jpg

    The machine screw on the left of the picture is only engaged by a couple of threads and is not interfering with the shaft. I have also removed 4 machine screws from the 2 spacer collars between the big gear (which I'll call gear #1) and the gear next to it (gear#2). Each spacer is secured by 2 machine screws located 180 degrees apart. I can't see any other fasteners (pins, screws etc) that need to come out. Looking in the gap between the spacers I can see a key which obviously locks the gears onto the shaft but what am I missing? I don't believe that the gears would be an interference fit on the shaft and yet when I hit the shaft with the hammer and drift it barely moves an sounds pretty solid. I'm loathe to really belt it as I fear breaking something..

    Any suggestions?

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    York, North Yorkshire UK
    Posts
    6,439

    Default

    Hi Flo,

    Carefully check for a second grub screw below the first !
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kyabram. Vic
    Posts
    632

    Default

    As JB said. Hardinge used 2 grubs screws most if not all the time.

    Ken

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rosebery/Eastlakes
    Posts
    115

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BaronJ View Post
    Hi Flo,

    Carefully check for a second grub screw below the first !
    Hi BaronJ,

    I thought I had looked but will definitely double check tonight when I get home..

    Flo

    Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rosebery/Eastlakes
    Posts
    115

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Toggy View Post
    As JB said. Hardinge used 2 grubs screws most if not all the time.

    Ken
    Hi Ken,

    There didn't appear to be 2 screws in any position as each screw was quite long (15-20mm) and was bevelled at the contact end to mate into a receptacle- similar to a hydraulic fluid nipple. Having said that I will have another really good look as the shaft won't budge.. something is definitely stopping it..

    Flo

    Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Melbourne
    Age
    35
    Posts
    1,522

    Default

    I have had problems in situations like this with burrs raised by people gronking down on the set screws with the shaft out of alignment, this gaulling can lock things solid and can be really hard to deal with.

    Can all the gears wiggle back and forward?

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rosebery/Eastlakes
    Posts
    115

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by caskwarrior View Post
    I have had problems in situations like this with burrs raised by people gronking down on the set screws with the shaft out of alignment, this gaulling can lock things solid and can be really hard to deal with.

    Can all the gears wiggle back and forward?
    The #1 and #2 gears (the 2 biggest gears) are locked solid but the spacers between them as well as gears #3 and #4 can wiggle on the shaft..

    I have tried tapping the big gears around their periphery with a brass drift to try to unseat them but no success as yet..

    Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Melbourne
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    35
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    Default

    So can you spin the shaft and gears at all? is everything stuck in terms of rotation or just end float?

    If the shaft wont rotate in its bronze bushings i think youll have to get drastic, I would consider tapping a hole in one end for a slide hammer. Or make a puller. I prefer a strong but gentle force to hammering anything, I see one of the bushes already has dings in that might be holding the shaft in.

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rosebery/Eastlakes
    Posts
    115

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by caskwarrior View Post
    So can you spin the shaft and gears at all? is everything stuck in terms of rotation or just end float?

    If the shaft wont rotate in its bronze bushings i think youll have to get drastic, I would consider tapping a hole in one end for a slide hammer. Or make a puller. I prefer a strong but gentle force to hammering anything, I see one of the bushes already has dings in that might be holding the shaft in.
    The whole shaft assembly rotates freely as it should but the 2 big gears are locked onto the shaft with nil apparent end float. The 2 smaller gears exhibit some end float as do the 2 spacers.

    The bushing at the bed end of shaft ( the one with the dings) can migrate and is able to be removed whereas the worn bushing at the change gear end is fixed.

    And like you I'd prefer to press things rather than hammer I just don't quite know how to tackle it..

    Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

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