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  1. #31
    djay Guest

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    dear gregoryq
    thanks for the reply . i have tried to take a pic but with no luck to blurry so i did one up. please let me know if you cant see it.
    do you think a single phase motor swap would be a better idea????

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    The Fabulous Gold-plated Coast.
    Age
    69
    Posts
    2,251

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    Does it say 415 star(maybe a symbol that looks like "Y") or 415 volt delta?

    Greg

  3. #33
    djay Guest

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    sorry Greg but the only things on the tag is what i copied . i just went and double checked.
    is there any were else it could be....

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Armidale NSW
    Age
    52
    Posts
    915

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    Quote Originally Posted by gregoryq View Post
    Static converters are widely regarded as crap on the U.S. forums that i read.
    I use a static phase converter (home made) in my workshop for a total of 11.5hp of motors (simultaneously) and find it excellent (also cheap and simple to use) - but I am running 240V split phase (480v) and have only run motors on it.

    As for your problem djay, you will need to determine if your motor is delta or wye configured (as Greg is getting at). If you motor is wye configured (at 415V) then it can normally be configured to run 240V delta. However if it is configured 415V delta then I think you will be stuck.

    As Greg asked, is there a "Y" or a triangle (delta) on the motor nameplate?
    Cheers.

    Vernon.
    __________________________________________________
    Bite off more than you can chew and then chew like crazy.

  5. #35
    djay Guest

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    no nothing like that at all. i just went out again and had a look all over it. is there any other way of telling?? i have sent teco a email and gave them the details so hopefully they will be able to tell me. thanks for your input...

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    The Fabulous Gold-plated Coast.
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    69
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    2,251

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    Yeah that is what I'm getting at. My comment about static converters being poor is largely due to most equipment has more in play than just a motor. since your application is that simple, a static may work as Vernon obviously has had good luck.

    Vernon has also correctly mentioned the voltage. You can connect a 415 wye (or "star") wound motor to 240 v delta (still three phase). Often the terminals are present in the terminal block, otherwise you or a motor shop can pull out the delta windings and re-configure the motor. Obviously this is not a job for the beginner.

    As far as converting to single phase I can't comment as I don't know about reversible single phase motors...I do know that they are out there, just no details.

    Another other option is to verify your static's output is correct 240v three phase, then step up via a three phase 240-415 volt transformer. This option is probably more theoretical than practical given the likely price of such a thing here. If it was me I'd be looking to get your existing motor on 240 volt delta.

    Greg

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Blue Mountains NSW Australia
    Posts
    408

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    dear fossil.
    i hope you can help. iam new to this forum i have recently bought a phoenix 5-8hp static converter from the u.s. i bought it to run my car hoist (screw type) 5hp. the diagram they sent was crap. http://www.appliedindustrialmotors.c...cSC%5B1%5D.gif iv tried endlessly to contact the but with no luck . i was reading that the u.s have 2 hots both at 120v is this the case? iv ask a few lecos and no one wants to help.. i have included pics of the converter and the hoist . i hope you can help as iam just about to turf it. thanks alot
    djay.
    Hi djay,

    The converter you have will likely not cut the mustartd, whatever you do. It is very likely that the capacitors will be underated for use in Australia. If you decide to purchase a single phase 4kw motor for your hoist, bear in mind that you will require a hefty single phase supply to start and run it under load without motor burnout concerns.

    What size supply do you have where you are? I would personally lean to 100amps or more single ~ to supply a motor of that size without troubles.
    A 4kw 4 pole sinlge phase motor will cost a packet. You would be best to check out your supply before burning one out.

    Good luck.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Armidale NSW
    Age
    52
    Posts
    915

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fossil View Post
    The converter you have will likely not cut the mustartd, whatever you do. It is very likely that the capacitors will be underated for use in Australia.
    I would tend to agree with Fossil if the converter was configured for 120V input, but it should be ok if it was designed for 240V input (i.e. split phase in the US, that is 2 x 120V). But as has been mentioned you will still need to configure your motor to run off 240V 3~ and not 415V 3~.
    Cheers.

    Vernon.
    __________________________________________________
    Bite off more than you can chew and then chew like crazy.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Blue Mountains NSW Australia
    Posts
    408

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    I received the following PM from Red2611.
    I cannot find a way to attach images to a PM reply, so am answering the question here.

    Hi Fossil
    I have just purchased a few 3 phase machines but only have single phase
    I was wondering if i could get a copy of your schematics and parts list to built 1 the same as yours please
    Would be greatly appreciated

    Red2611
    I have modified my schematic that I originally posted to reflect the changes made during construction.... ie, the use of the pony motor was dispensed with in lieu of a large start cap. Please bear in mind that the cap sizes as shown are not to be taken as gospel. I do not in fact have these quoted sizes in my system, rather I have experimented with various combinations of caps to achieve the desired result for my circumstances.

    OK..... now to the schematic....
    The start/run switch (S1) toggles power between the start cap and idler motor through contactors. Initially, it is placed in the start position, and then the momentary power on button (S2) is depressed. This latches the main power contactor (K1) 40amps) and supplies power through (S) 40amps) to the start cap (K2) 500uf, and through the start cap to winding (A) of the idler motor.
    After the start cap has bought the idler up to speed..... 1/4 second in my case, the start/run switch (S1) is moved to the "run" position. This simultaneously opens the start cap contactor (K2) and closes the idler contactor (K3) 40amps), removing power from the start cap and supplying power to the now spinning idler motor.
    System shutdown is by the N/C (normally closed) stop switch (S3), which unlatches the main power contactor (K1), removing power from the system.
    It may look complicated, but it is in fact a very simple start circuit. Please don’t print and use these instructions until after tomorrow when I will go over what I have written for any errors. I’ve had a few wines tonight.

    Fossil

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    near Rockhampton
    Posts
    6,216

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    Well I got a commercial phase converter installed today...I had to run a 10hp motor so my choices were limited...This was quite expensive (far cheaper than what the electricity company wanted though) but should hopefully last a very long time....

    [media]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v606/OzRinger/phaseconverter003.jpg[/media]
    http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...nverter008.jpg

  11. #41
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Traralgon
    Posts
    1

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    Thanks Fossil
    i will give it a go
    red2611

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Oatley NSW
    Age
    69
    Posts
    257

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    djay,
    I have been reading your post and offer the following suggestions;
    From what you have posted so far i belive that the Teco Motor would be a star/delta type (4 Pole), it would have under the terminal cover a six point connection ( six terminals) and this is where it is connected as either a star connection or delta connection. If you can take a picture of the Terminal Block this would be helpful.
    There is a connection style called Steinmetz Connection, attached is a diagram on how this is connected, it comes from a Leroy Somer manual.
    Another method would be to use a VSD Variable Speed Drive, this can work from your single phase outlet connecting to your motor, this would be the better method. If you go this way the drive you select would have connection diagrams so you can wire it and if you have troubles in doing that we can help here in the forum.

    Regards,
    Keith.

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Blue Mountains NSW Australia
    Posts
    408

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    Thats a good looking unit .RC.

    Does it have a step up transformer for 415v output? Are you on 240v 1~ supply or are you rural 480v?

    I suppose it cost $6k or so.

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    near Rockhampton
    Posts
    6,216

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    It has a 240 to 415 step up transformer...I only have 240V single phase here, all the other better stuff is available and only 400m away but 400m in electricity company terms is $15 000.

    The phase converter is a demo model so I got a 20% discount on it, otherwise I would have got a smaller model...Converter cost was $3800 + 10% GST so it was $4180 plus freight as well ...plus installation...

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Longwarry, Victoria
    Posts
    9

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    Richard,

    We are stoked to hear that your converter is up and running, allowing you to run your three phase equipment. Ben let me know that you sent him through an e-mail. Just to reiterate to you Fossil, we do two different models of each size on our range, one for 240 with a step up tranny and one for 480 with a step down transformer. For all converters over the size of 11kW we require for a customer to have the 2X240V inputs (480V).

    Please feel free to let us know via e-mail if any problems do occur Richard, we will be happy to help, and as you know it is covered on your warranty. Best of luck for the future with your machinery.

    Kind Regards,

    Tom Fraser
    Phase Change Power Converters
    (03) 5629 9799
    [email protected]

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