Thread: Help Me Pick A Milling Machine May 2022

Hi Guys, More questions from me!

As you may have seen I am wanting to buy a lathe. During my research I have seen numerous old prices for lathes that are still currently available, Doing some crude maths it seams they are going up by 10-15% per year if not more(one was nearly 30% in 18 months)

So on my wish list for the shed has been a milling machine. I cant see why these would not be going up by a similar amount or more so I have decided to look into making it happen at the same time as the lathe before they increase even more.

Now I have even less knowledge about milling machines than lathe's so bear with me. Hopefully I have learnt something from the previous thread so I can give you more information to begin with.

So my hobbies are old motorcycles and RC cars, So things I can see me using the mill for are.
Precision location drilling using a DRO, Things like RC chassis, engine mounts, etc
Milling small rc parts out of aluminium
Milling large bracketing for motorcycle
Milling welded repairs of motorcycle parts (probably least likely and not a deal breaker if I cant.)

So like the lathe I want to buy in store which does limit my options in WA

As I see it with my budget and wanting DRO I have the following 3 to choose from.

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/M138D $3465

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/M140D $4785 Which is the same as 46B plus-
Larger machine worktable with more travels
Tapping function switch to allow you to control the required depth when tapping holes
Coolant pump system
Fabricated stand

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/M141D $6094 Which is the same as 47B plus-
1000 x 240mm
X-Axis auto power feed
Z-Axis power up/down
Scale on Z-axis

For me doing RC Chassis I can see the advantage of the bigger table and travel but dont know I need the largest table or the auto feed so thinking middle one is best value for me.

Sorry for the long post, Just trying to put my thoughts into words to refer back to and to give you as much info as I can

Thanks for reading and any advice is appreciated

Chris

If your budget runs to it, take the 141.
You dont need the bigger table.. Until you do
Remember that as your capability, both in tooling and skill, grows, so will your desire to do different things with the machine
You do actually need power feed, you just dont realise it yet because you havent spent enough time turning cranks on a manual table to realise how awesome they are.

Those little HM mills are quite capable machines for what they are. I have a 2008 vintage HM45.

Hi Chris.
Make it easy for us to look at your links. You need to use the icon that looks like the earth with an infinity sign on it. It inserts the website's URL as a clickable link. Otherwise we have to cut and paste the link into a new browser window.

Pretty much what Racingtadpole said. I would go for HM-48B as it has a bigger table, stand, power feed. The power feed is so handy when you are taking repetitive long cuts.

As others said the bigger table you will find invaluable, they can never be too big. Allows you to do a far greater range of machining if you have the space to support and clamp it down.

The things I don't like about the 141D though, which while a nice machine is over priced for the size IMHO, is it's an MT3 taper, and has a geared head. It'll be noisy as the clappers in use. Although a bit more expensive, something like this as just an example in my view is far better, with an NT30 spindle and belt driven (although changing speeds could be a PITA):

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/M577

Just my 2 cents though.

Regardless, I'd recommend having a serious think about the sort of stuff you might want to do now and in the future, and whether a more capable machine would be of more value to you, and to aim for as high as possible, I made the very costly mistakes early on of under estimating just how much use I would get out lathes, mills, etc, and ended up paying waaaay more to end up with what I should have bought in the first place.

Owning 6 CNC machines of progressively larger sizes may sound cool, but when you only really use one of them (the biggest one), it's a somewhat costly exercise. ;-)

Originally Posted by aarggh

As others said the bigger table you will find invaluable, they can never be too big. Allows you to do a far greater range of machining if you have the space to support and clamp it down.

The things I don't like about the 141D though, which while a nice machine is over priced for the size IMHO, is it's an MT3 taper, and has a geared head. It'll be noisy as the clappers in use. Although a bit more expensive, something like this as just an example in my view is far better, with an NT30 spindle and belt driven (although changing speeds could be a PITA):

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/M577


Just my 2 cents though.

Regardless, I'd recommend having a serious think about the sort of stuff you might want to do now and in the future, and whether a more capable machine would be of more value to you, and to aim for as high as possible, I made the very costly mistakes early on of under estimating just how much use I would get out lathes, mills, etc, and ended up paying waaaay more to end up with what I should have bought in the first place.

Owning 6 CNC machines of progressively larger sizes may sound cool, but when you only really use one of them (the biggest one), it's a somewhat costly exercise. ;-)

Yeah but upsizing is the cost of doing business really.

If it's a serious machine it won't have a Morse taper spindle and I'd argue it'd not have a R8 spindle either. Been there done that. I still have a B/port with R8 but it gets little use really.

Traveling ATM but I've never been impressed with any of those milling machines. However - if you're going to buy new, you're limited to what people are selling new so - shrug.

I'm going to take a look at current offerings at H&F once I reach Sydney.

PDW

Given the fairly large price increases on new machines, and the lack of stock across the board for most of them, I'd actually argue a good second hand Bridgeport or similar machine might be far better value (and use) in the current climate?

I would be interested in the pros / cons of spindle choice: MT vs R8 vs NT* ?

Especially interested in potential upgrade path when getting a larger mill, I would prefer to keep using existing tooling rather than start all over again.

Are all Bridgeport R8 or was there other options? What kind of spindle do you typically find on older Deckel / Maho manual mills?

Thanks
Frank

My smaller mill is an MT and I hated using it, doesn't hold the cutters as securely as it should depending on the cutter and what it's doing. My big mill has an NT40 spindle, and with an ER40 collet chuck I can use any size cutter up to 26mm shank diameter, which is pretty much everything. I've never had an R8 but have friends who have, and they've been less than excited over it, with one of them stripping or damaging the spline in use.

In my view NT30 or NT40 (or BT) really is the best. Rock solid fitting and good range of tooling.

Anything actually branded Bridgeport will be R8 (unless pre J head, then MT2 although thats very old)

Newer deckels are 40 taper but have an external 22mm burgess thread for the drawbar so do not use normal 40 taper tools without modification

Older deckels use MT4 with the same 22mm buttress thread. These heads look quite different so are easy to pick from a photo

Mahos and most other euro stuff of the middling sizes uses SK 40 (just regular 40 taper but with a 16mm internal drawbar thread) some stuff like schaublin 13s use SK30.

My aciera f5 uses 40 taper but the drawbar is complicated so can't use imperial CAT40 in the horizontal spindle

Bridgeport clones / regular turret mills will use r8 or 30 taper in the small sizes and 40 taper in the big sizes.

The only other things I can think of are aciera f3s that use W20 or little import machines using MT2 and MT3.

Morse tapers are steep and have a tendency to stick in the spindle but are not inherently terrible, just tend to be on lightly built machines that get pushed outside their envelope.

Yay lack of standards!

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

Hi Guys,

My Chinese Optimum BF20 clone has an MT3 spindle taper, and for the size of the machine I have no problems with it ! I've had more problems with plastic gears and crap DC motors. A decent collet chuck for tool holding is vital.

R8 has some advantages the tools are a good size, rack up well and don't weigh a ton. I like having draw in collets that stay flush with the spindle nose.

Overall 40 taper is the best balance in one single machine at price versus general capability.

I have bought and sold a lot of machines because I'm a compulsive dingleberry but the one id have back in a flash is the r8 Bridgeport.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

Hi Guys,

My Chinese Optimum clone has an MT3 spindle taper and for the size of the machine I've not had any problems with it ! I've had more problems with plastic gears and crap DC motors. Though I do agree that a decent collet chuck for tool holding is vital. One of the nice things is the Morse taper ejecting mechanism, saves trying to bash the daylights out of the bearings when removing the tooling.

Can you have R8 tooling with a power drawbar? I mean some kind of belleville spring solution with pull studs on the tool or am I confusing things here?

Cheers
Frank

Most of the r8 power drawbars i have seen use an air impact to just run the normal threaded tools, never seen r8 running a pullstud.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk