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  1. #16
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    N.W.Tasmania
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    This is a strange mix of thread standards if this is a metric tap set. It has several coarse thread taps' heap of metric fine thread taps and at least one metric special. If a buyer bought these for general common use then I think that they would be disappointed with the range included. Metric fine threads are generally rare let alone a metric special, and with only three coarse taps That I could see, it doesn't appear that useful. Perhaps there were many more out of frame in the picture.
    Thanks Chris for your tapping chart, it looks well organised and pretty useful, and here is a link to a ready reckoner of threading info, which I have posted here in times past. I will put it in again for people who may not have seen it earlier.
    Tap drill size calculators

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada
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    257

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    Baron you can take the pointy hat off and come out of the corner. Everyone makes a little goof now and then. Be happy you weren't doing old style book keeping and went to the wrong column while doing your taxes.

    Can't say how it is for you gents but here many machine tooling suppliers give tap drill charts to their customers, both pocket and wall chart sized. If you have access to one ask them and they may very well give you one. Some are cardboard and some are plastic making them very handy to hang on the wall. There are others with fastener, metal, pipe and tube information. It's out there for the asking and the worst thing that can happen is they say no.

    Putting multiple tap and die sizes on the same box with one or the other is the epitome if cheap. I think I would be looking for better.

    Pete

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Gulfview Heights, Adelaide
    Posts
    70

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    BSP is very common for plumbing fittings in Australia.
    I think the tap you are looking for is 1/4" BSP (19 TPI).

    These taps come in 2 different thread styles - either a taper thread or parallel. Both are 19 TPI.

    regards,
    Paul

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Mackay North Qld
    Posts
    5,899

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    Quote Originally Posted by davekwok View Post
    Attachment 394211

    I am lost for understanding what to pick for tapping a hole that is 1/2 inch 20 tpi. My set seems to serve bother system. But then it seems to be only metric. The second tap from the right seems to be the right one 1/2 NF20. But how could a tap serve both metric and whitworth system. I guess that it is M14x 2.0 pitch.

    How to read it correctly?
    If I understand correctly what you are saying you are having a bad time of it understanding the differences between the two BASIC thread systems.

    Imperial based up feet and inches has references to pitch measuring against the imperial system -TPI -Threads per INCH .

    So 1/2 x 20 refers to 1/2 inch diameter by 20 TPI -Threads per inch.The Sutton chart says it is Unf 20 TPI equates to 7/16" AND 1/2"
    So I am positive that you need a NF /UNF 1/2" by 20 TPI tap

    If converted into Metric that would be 12.7 x 1.27 pitch ( there's no such tap size) and that's no where near 14mm x 2.0 mm unless my maths have gone bad.

    The thing is to remember for METRIC that you discount thoughts of TPI for metric and use the term pitch -that's distance between EACH thread crown point.
    Yeah,I know there's also angular differences 55 degrees imperial and 60 degrees of the thread points but can't suggest how a home diyer hobbyist might pick them.

    To avoid any more confusion for you,with the case packaging , could I simply suggest labeling the sockets for each tap tool /die if they are surfaces are legible.

    I used a white paint marker and fine indelible marker both from the newsagent.
    If not too illegible ,use the markings actually marked on the tap or die.
    I tried engraving shanks of the taps and dies but most were too hard to leave a legible mark. You might spray that in some sealer as oil degrades the ink marker writing.

    Grahame

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    York, North Yorkshire UK
    Posts
    5,042

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    Hi Guys,

    You could always "Electro Pen" etch the size on the shank !
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    melbourne australia
    Posts
    2,934

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grahame Collins View Post
    So I am positive that you need a NF /UNF 1/2" by 20 TPI tap
    Unlikley if he's tapping a hole for a plumbing fitting. It will almost certainly be BSP or NPT.
    Chris

  7. #22
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Picnic Point, Sydney
    Age
    74
    Posts
    138

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    I've been tapping holes for over 60 years & thought I knew most threads so could someone please tell me what the hell a metric special is?

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada
    Posts
    257

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    Comes with fries and a big soft drink!
    Pete

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    312

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    Snapey, its anything that the supplier doesn't carry as a line item and can then charge an arm / leg for but the Engineers Black Book lists a heap of Metric Special Pitches. Alan

  10. #25
    BobL is online now Member: Blue and white apron brigade
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
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    6,524

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ropetangler View Post
    This is a strange mix of thread standards if this is a metric tap set. It has several coarse thread taps' heap of metric fine thread taps and at least one metric special. If a buyer bought these for general common use then I think that they would be disappointed with the range included. Metric fine threads are generally rare. . . .
    At the risk of repeating what has already been said several times, but perhaps to further clarify, the picture posted by the OP is just part of a generic T&D case used by Hare and Forbes.
    Screen Shot 2021-10-05 at 8.29.06 am.png

    The same case is used for imperial sets as metric sets.
    Imperial set: https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/T015
    Metric Set: https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/T014

    The Imperial set includes both UNC and UNF T&Ds and the metric set also includes regular and fines.
    After a while you can tell what is what just by looking at the taps.

    I have both of these sets and the items are all fairly well marked so there is no confusion.

    I find I'm using the metric fines much more than I though I would, mainly when threading into thin (<3mm) sheet.
    The table top for my thin kerf abrasive table saw is made of 2mm stainless held together with M4 and M6 fine CS socket screws
    guard2.jpg
    Attached Images Attached Images

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Mackay North Qld
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack620 View Post
    Unlikley if he's tapping a hole for a plumbing fitting. It will almost certainly be BSP or NPT.
    What I replied to, was in davewoks post 1 and that was before he got to talking about plumbing.

    Its only in post 14 does davewok get to referencing plumbing.

    Quote Originally Posted by davekwok View Post
    It is frustrating that I want to tap a hole to fit a nozzle. it seems plumbing fixtures are commonly used with imperial system.
    We are forced to make assumptions which may be incorrect about what davewok might know and what he does not know about taps and dies.

    New members and infrequent posters have this problem with many posters who often don't supply enough information/ details to obtain the answer they seek .

    davewok wants to drill and tap a hole in something to fit a nozzle.

    What sort of nozzle? Do we assume garden hose nozzle. Could it be some other sort of nozzle.? Fuel pump nozzle on a farm ,maybe?


    I would assume that because normally there's any amount of easy available fittings from bunnings or the like stores, it is not a project to fit a hose nozzle to a reticulated household system.

    Please davewok give us more elements of your project. Truly it shall make a whole lot easier to help you.

    Ie : I would like to drill and tap a hole in a xxxxxxxxxxx to take a standard 1/2' BSP hose nozzle. It is to fit to an oil storage tank ???

    Is 1/2"BSP the right tap thread to use?


    With a little bit more information we can get the difficulties sorted out.

    Grahame

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    melbourne australia
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    2,934

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grahame Collins View Post
    New members and infrequent posters have this problem with many posters who often don't supply enough information/ details to obtain the answer they seek .
    Agreed. But you said:

    Quote Originally Posted by Grahame Collins View Post
    So I am positive that you need a NF /UNF 1/2" by 20 TPI tap.
    Why were you positive given you acknowledge there is a lack of information? My reply to you was to reinforce that we are far from being in a position to make a positive recommendation to davewok.
    Chris

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
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    Revesby - Sydney Australia
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    54
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    523

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snapey View Post
    could someone please tell me what the hell a metric special is?
    Any metric which is not standard coarse or fine?


    e.g. Any 7mm, M18x1.5 (spark plug) M10x1.0 (spark plug), M100x2.0

  14. #29
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Picnic Point, Sydney
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    74
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    138

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    Quote Originally Posted by nigelpearson View Post
    Any metric which is not standard coarse or fine?


    e.g. Any 7mm, M18x1.5 (spark plug) M10x1.0 (spark plug), M100x2.0
    I wish I could understand the thinking behind giving you a tap that you'll never use. BTW, did you get my PM?

  15. #30
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    melbourne australia
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snapey View Post
    I wish I could understand the thinking behind giving you a tap that you'll never use.
    I suspect they get them cheap then bundle them up and put them into a generic box. Perhaps they are overruns from a special order? Caveat emptor.
    Chris

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