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2nd Mar 2021, 05:42 PM #1Gear expert in training
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W20 collets with a 2mm thread pitch?
Found a dodgy collet (.001" runout) at work today from our Mikron hobbing machines and I'm trying to find some replacements.
We had some made several years ago (this is one of them), but we've had other issues with them as well with the threads being too tight in the drawbar so if we can just buy some off the shelf it would be preferable.
All the key dimensions say it's a W20 (diameters, lengths, nose taper, keyway, 45/5 degree buttress thread) except the thread pitch; standard W20 is 1.667mm (1 2/3, yeah, it's weird), ours are 2mm pitch. I'm confident nothing has been modified because we have factory collets with the same thread and 3 machines can't all be wrong.
Is this a standard collet of some description, or did Mikron decide that they wanted to be just different enough to make life difficult?
We could make new drawbars to suit normal W20s, but that's not being considered as a practical option at this point unless we absolutely have to (and we don't).
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2nd Mar 2021, 06:06 PM #2Senior Member
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It sounds like the collet is a Deckel standard at 2mm pitch which is what the S20 uses and the same 45/5 degree, which would make sense as probably easier to find rather than the odd Mikron pitch. There is a DIN # for the Deckel collets but don't remember what it is right now. Alan.
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2nd Mar 2021, 06:11 PM #3Gear expert in training
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Thanks! That at least gives me somewhere to start
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2nd Mar 2021, 06:24 PM #4Most Valued Member
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I believe the deckel collets are the same as a w20 except significantly longer. I have a schaublin catalog ill check as well
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2nd Mar 2021, 06:40 PM #5Gear expert in training
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Looks like Deckel is the right thread but wrong taper; they use 17.5°, W20 uses 15°. Also waaaaay too long
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2nd Mar 2021, 08:00 PM #6Most Valued Member
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I can only find one collet in the whole schaublin catalog with a 2mm pitch. L20 but they have a long body. 122mm.
Specs attached
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2nd Mar 2021, 08:02 PM #7Most Valued Member
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That catalog is pretty recent. Schaublin seem to have obsoleted a lot of manufacturer specific collets like p22 which my UW1 takes.
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2nd Mar 2021, 09:49 PM #8Diamond Member
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I'm pretty sure Nickolas hacko watches in Sydney recently bought a nos mikron from somewhere, they may know where you can get collets. pretty sure i saw it on their instagram https://www.instagram.com/nicholashackowatch/?hl=en
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2nd Mar 2021, 09:58 PM #9Gear expert in training
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Can't see it on their insta and their site says they recently got a CNC Affolter hobber (wish we had one of those)
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2nd Mar 2021, 10:34 PM #10Gear expert in training
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Did some more digging.... Mikron T90 Lathe - Anglo-Swiss Tools
Both the tool-maker’s lathe and the mill employed the same 20mm collet which appears to be identical to the standard Schaublin W20 (W20-4) collet, however it is slightly longer and employs either a 1.25mm or 2mm pitch thread. These collets were only used on Mikron machines and are virtually unobtainable on the second hand market, and new are very expensive (£60+) and only available in a limited number of bores.
You just HAD to be special, didn't you Mikron...too good to use an industry standard...
Mikron engineers: "Hey, there's a 20mm collet standard that'd be perfect for our machines."
Mikron designers: "You know what would be funny? To make collets that look just like those, but change a critical feature that no one will notice until they try to use a standard one."
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2nd Mar 2021, 11:09 PM #11Most Valued Member
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P22 which i need are also almost identical to w20 but have the drawbar thread on the inside instead of outside and use a trapezoidal thread.
I would love to give someone a clip over the ear for that.
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2nd Mar 2021, 11:10 PM #12Most Valued Member
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Being close to w20 im sure schaublin would run you some off for $$$ no problem.
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2nd Mar 2021, 11:26 PM #13Gear expert in training
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Hardinge used to make them, might contact them about it.
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3rd Mar 2021, 11:40 AM #14Golden Member
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Had a quick look through one of my collet catalogues and a 351E (K20) sounds like it might be close to what you're chasing.
K20 Collet.png
Try contacting one of the German collet manufacturers (SZM Spannwerkzeuge or Schlenker)
Not going to be cheap but quality never is.
Cheers,
Greg.
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3rd Mar 2021, 12:01 PM #15Gear expert in training
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I appreciate the effort, but not even close; wrong thread, wrong nose taper and wrong length
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