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Thread: Mill/drill manual or info.
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26th Feb 2021, 11:13 AM #1Member
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Mill/drill manual or info.
Hello, I have purchased a chinese drilling/ milling machine which Is a zx32 made in i think 1970 going by the date on the contacters only. Its 3 phase and very heavy/solid i found out. Does anyone have one that could help with some operating info. The machine appears to be complete and has no coolant setup but smells of coolant from its past so I'm unsure how that was before me. I don't have 3 phase so it's going to be a vfd and hoping to retain the switches if possible to keep it original. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks Brett.
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26th Feb 2021, 11:47 AM #2Senior Member
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I'm guessing it's a round column mill/drill clone of the Rong Fu RF-30 / 31 / 32 / etc. - try looking for a manual for those and see if it's the same as what you have.
Photos would help otherwise.
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26th Feb 2021, 02:09 PM #3Member
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This may help, took a while to work out adding pics.
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26th Feb 2021, 07:35 PM #4Diamond Member
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I did a Google search and ended up with this result https://www.traverscanada.com/belt-d.../p/87-115-929/ and this is the link to the manual https://www.travers.com/images/art/8...929_manual.pdf In the manual the part numbers have 'ZX32' in them. I couldn't get the TECH Manual to download. Have a look at the HM-32 as well https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/m121 . Like J.C. said the Rong Fu RF32 could be the same.
All The Best steran50 Stewart
The shortest way to do many things is to do only one thing at once.
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26th Feb 2021, 08:07 PM #5
ZX32 Manual PDF.
Hi Hards2U, Guys,
I don't know if the forum will take a 7.5 Mb PDF file, but I'll try to upload it, if not PM me an Email Address and I'll mail it to you.
Apparently not 5.25 Mb limit.
Both those links are to the same manual, but the name is wrong on the "Tech" one.Best Regards:
Baron J.
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26th Feb 2021, 08:09 PM #6Member
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26th Feb 2021, 09:56 PM #7I break stuff...
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Not sure you're going to be able to retain all the switches in their original functionality looking at that - although you should be able to use them to control a VFD at least for forward/reverse and E-stop....
Struggling to work out exactly what's going on with that control panel. How many positions does the rotary switch have, the dots seem to indicate that there are 5 (including the middle position) - but the fact that only 3 are marked red suggests otherwise?
The location of the little pictures is a bit strange too - at a guess, one click left of centre is milling/drilling mode (I think those are supposed to be an endmill and a drill bit). But then on the right you seem to have a tapping mode (maybe it jogs rather than latching to run?), and the location of the picture seems to suggest it's two clicks right of centre...
The 4 push buttons down the right hand side have me stumped though, at first glance they look like forward/reverse selectors, but why 4 of them? Unless they're lights, not buttons? The only way I can see that making sense if they're buttons is that two of them work on 'mill/drill' mode, as a latching circuit (one push and it keeps running), and two work on 'tap' mode as jog buttons (spindle only rotates while you hold the button). Would be a peculiar way of doing it, but not out of the realms of possibility.
How many contactors does it have in the electrical box, and what's the motor data plate say (is it a two speed motor, particularly)?
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27th Feb 2021, 09:58 AM #8Member
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I have my doubts i can keep it original but I'll try to. The way I see it is 5 position switch gives 2 speed for mill/threading drilling and one of them is for a jog option. This is when the push buttons are used as momentary switches either forward and reverse ? There are 2 contractors that would be forward and reverse i think and another which has a preset dial and im guessing that is for the jog maybe.
It is 2 speed on the plate.
Thanks Brett.
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27th Feb 2021, 12:02 PM #9Most Valued Member
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Mill/drill manual or info.
The one with the dial is usually a thermal overload breaker.
See if you can get a good photo of the wiring diagram.
Steve
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27th Feb 2021, 01:50 PM #10Member
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Is this clear
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27th Feb 2021, 05:21 PM #11I break stuff...
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Pretty sure K13 is the rotary switch, and looks like it changes between star and delta as at least one option. And I think, although I'd have to ponder it a bit more, that in star it's cutting out some of the windings in order to give you a slower speed for 'tap' mode.
1C and 2C are fairly obviously the forward and reverse contactors, and they are controlled by QA1 and QA2, which are interlocked. I think QA1 and QA2 are two of the pushbuttons. I think QA3 and QA4 are probably jog buttons...
So following on from that, the two lower contactors in the picture of the electrical box (closest to the fuses) are likely going to be forward/reverse. Pretty useless with a VFD. Top left is a transformer, looks like it has multiple taps some of which aren't used, could be useful depending on what else you do. Top right is probably as OxxAndBert says, a thermal overload (JR on the diagram). Maybe useful, if you want a mechanical protection in addition to the overcurrent protection in the VFD.
I reserve the right to be wrong.
The two speed motor may cause you some issues with the VFD. People don't seem to have much luck in getting both speeds to work well, although I can't see why it shouldn't work. Most of the time I think people just hook up the high speed side, and dial it down with the VFD if they want low speed.
In theory you could remove the forward/reverse contactors, and hook the VFD up to the input of JR. Then use one push button for "Forward run" input to the VFD, and one for "Reverse run", and wire the E-stop to the VFD as well. Leaves your rotary switch functionality as it was, and just leaves you with two redundant buttons (although depending on the VFD, you might be able to run them as jog inputs). Problem with that is that at one speed range or the other, the VFD settings will be off, but retaining the thermal overload might at least keep you from frying the motor? Probably some other potential issues as well, like the theoretical problem of having mechanical switching downstream of a VFD. You've also got no stop setup in that situation other than the E-stop...
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27th Feb 2021, 05:53 PM #12Most Valued Member
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I’ll have a proper look later, but in this situation you’re probably better off to leave the contactors and control circuits there, remove all the 3ph input/output from them and just use one set of contacts on each to signal the VFDs FWD and reverse run.
The jog will still function as currently all it does is provide momentary contact for the contactors while you hold the button in (not that I’ve ever used the jog on my own mill).
You lose the high/low speed switching but have variable speed control via the VFD.
VFD gets wired directly to the motor using whichever (high or low speed) connection arrangement you choose - but then it only ever uses that connection.
My TOS mill didn’t have the 2 speed motor, but otherwise it’s set up as I described.
You could also do as J&H described, but IMO it’s a lot more work and more complex.
Steve.
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27th Feb 2021, 06:11 PM #13Member
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A bit to consider and many thanks for the detail from all. I will have to think about what I need and study the wiring to better understand my options. I like the look of the switch arrangements which makes me want to keep it as it is even if some things won't be functional, and that doesn't matter at all. I like the idea of keeping the push buttons for forward,reverse. I need to learn how a vfd works and them I will hopefully get it going correctly. Just more time and money needed as it always will be , I need to stop buying shed stuff.
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27th Feb 2021, 08:43 PM #14Most Valued Member
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I can’t make out the motor plate to see what power rating it is, but would assume it’s 3hp or less.
I’m also assuming that it’s 415v input for the 3ph as it’s unlikely to be anything else.
My suggestion would be to grab one of the Ecogoo 2.2kw 240v input 400v output VFD’s from AliExpress. Under $150 delivered, but they do take a few weeks to arrive.
For a start forget about the original wiring and control switches.
The VFD will give you the same voltage the motor was originally running at, so then you just need to connect up the windings for (most likely) the high speed motor configuration, wire it up directly to the VFD, then program the VFD with the appropriate current settings etc for the motor.
At that point you should be able to start/stop the motor directly from the VFD control panel and vary the speed, in both fwd and rev.
The mill is usable at this point.
Next step is working out how to control the VFD from a 3 way switch fwd-off-rev.
Buy a low voltage switch to test with and get that working.
You can continue to use the speed control on the VFD control panel or work out how to do it with a separate potentiometer.
The final step is to work out how to use the original control and contactors to act like a 3 way switch, then use that setup to replace your physical 3-way test switch.
As I said earlier, you basically rip out all the original 415v wiring, use the 240v control side to switch the contactors and find a set of contacts that is closed when fwd is selected, and a set on the other contactor that is closed when reverse is selected.
Hopefully that makes some sense in general terms now.
Steve
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27th Feb 2021, 11:17 PM #15Golden Member
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The wiring diagram looks as if the motor is a pole-changing (Dahlander wound) 2 speed motor, and the two speeds would usually be shown on the motor plate, with the high speed being twice the low speed.
With motors like that running on mains power it seems to be OK to switch speeds with the motor running, at least for low power motors. If running it on a VFD you can still use the two speeds BUT, to avoid damaging the VFD, speeds should NOT be switched with the motor running.
I have two machines with motors like that running on VFDs, and all works well. If you have a manual two speed switch (as I have) it's just a question of remembering to switch speeds only when the motor is stopped.
The value of using both speeds is no loss of torque across the speed range. As it happens I mostly leave the VFD output set at 50Hz.
The setup is fairly basic on my machines - no spindle reverse was provided as designed and I have not added it (on the mill with feeds, they only work if you run the spindle forwards.)
BillLast edited by WCD; 27th Feb 2021 at 11:25 PM. Reason: added a sentence
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