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  1. #1
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    Default Old iron, identification?

    I was lucky enough to be given some old iron, which is one of two metals, either Double Griffin, or Durax.
    It would be very handy to know for sure which it is, so any way to do it without specialist gear?

  2. #2
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    If you know it's one of two dissimilar materials (from what I can gather from the internet, Double Griffin is tool steel and Durax is just 1040), a simple hardness test might be enough. Or you could send a sample off for analysis and you'll get a full composition breakdown. No idea how much it'd cost though.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptrott View Post
    I was lucky enough to be given some old iron, which is one of two metals, either Double Griffin, or Durax.
    It would be very handy to know for sure which it is, so any way to do it with specialist gear?
    Yes.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by elanjacobs View Post
    If you know it's one of two dissimilar materials (from what I can gather from the internet, Double Griffin is tool steel and Durax is just 1040), a simple hardness test might be enough. Or you could send a sample off for analysis and you'll get a full composition breakdown. No idea how much it'd cost though.
    220 vs 201 Brinell. Not a massive difference. Assuming you mean a punch type test wouldn't I need a known sample to compare?

  5. #5
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    You only need a comparison sample for absolute measurement (how hard is it), for comparative measurement (which one is harder) you'll see straight away. An automatic centre punch might give an indication, but with the difference being so small it might be too hard to tell just by looking.

  6. #6
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    Probably easier to do a grinder spark test if one is tool steel and the other low carbon steel.

    Michael

  7. #7
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ptrott View Post
    It would be very handy to know for sure which it is, so any way to do it with specialist gear?
    To answer your question,yes,there are ways of doing it with specialist gear. One way would be to get one of these:

    xrf gun.jpg

    XRF Scan (1).jpg

    Would it be economical, I doubt it.

  8. #8
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    Default

    I don't know about the durax but here is the specs for double griffin from an old Eagle and Globe steel handbook.

    If it helps.



    Eagle & Globe.
    Double Griffin- shock resisting steel. AS1239/ AISI spec: S100A.
    C .35
    Si .2
    Mn .3
    Cr 1.75
    Ni 3.5
    Forging range 850-1100 C
    Annealing temp 750 C
    approx. annealed hardness (Brinell) 220
    hardening temp. 850-950 C
    quenching medium: air-salt-oil
    tempering temp. range: 0-550 C
    working hardness, Rockwell 'C' 40-51
    Applications: Ni-Cr shock-resisting steel. Punches, shear blades, chisels, snaps, wedges.

    Grahame

  9. #9
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    I didn't realise the original post was ambiguous.
    I only have ONE type of steel, which is ONE of the metals Durax OR Double griffin,
    which is why I would need a known sample of either to do a simple hardness test.

  10. #10
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    ptrott

    From your OP I realised that you had one piece of metal and you did not know what it was.

    I gave specs for the double griffin as we had chisels from it in the seventies and had a general idea of its hardness,but couldn't remember the specific number.

    Ok double griffin is 40 to 51 Rockwell C and that converts to 375 to 495 Brinell

    Durax 1045 converts to Rockwell 20 C but listed as 223 Brinel. Here is the link to check

    https://www.engineersedge.com/hardness_conversion.htm

    A cheap way to gauge the hardness is with a set of hardness testing files. - knifemakers use them - look them up on Ebay.

    Much cheaper but way less accurate but should get you there would be to centerpop some known mild steel and then your lump of steel.
    If the pop gives approximately the same mark -its Durax 1045. If it flattens the end of the pop it is double griffin.

    Please take some pics if you can so we can all learn something.

    Around $190 dollars for a set of six if you buy Japanese made or $40 odd if you buy chinese.

    Grahame

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grahame Collins View Post
    ptrott


    ..........Much cheaper but way less accurate but should get you there would be to centerpop some known mild steel and then your lump of steel.
    If the pop gives approximately the same mark -its Durax 1045. If it flattens the end of the pop it is double griffin.
    Grahame
    Had a few goes at it today, and I can't see any difference in the punch marks on it and cold rolled, certainly didn't dull the punch point, so I am going to call it Durax.
    Thanks for the input people.

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