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  1. #1
    BobL is online now Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Default Mist Coolant systems

    Gents, following on from Krisfarms post in The "Latest projects" thread, I thought I would start a new thread on this topic.

    Look on ebay I see a basic fluid/air mixer like this one starts at around $10
    https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Cutting-...AAAOSwytJaN5F7

    Screen Shot 2018-05-31 at 8.36.09 am.png

    Those that look like Kris's mixer look like have needle valve controls at the mixed and look like this cost a bit more
    https://www.ebay.com.au/p/Mist-Coola....c100005.m1851
    Screen Shot 2018-05-31 at 8.35.46 am.png

    Does anyone know of any others?

  2. #2
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    BobL
    I just posted a reply back on the other post. I would definitely pay the bit extra and go for the twin needle valve mixer.I did look at some that had adjustable nozzles as well but after using mine for a while now I do not think that would be needed.
    Bob

  3. #3
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    Noga mist unit, Fogbuster.


    If you can afford them

    Ken

  4. #4
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    Default

    Are the misting systems supposed to be better? You would assume that a solid stream of fluid would have more cooling capacity?

    Cheers,

    Steve

  5. #5
    BobL is online now Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pumpkinate View Post
    Are the misting systems supposed to be better? You would assume that a solid stream of fluid would have more cooling capacity?
    Have a read of this, //metalworkforums.com/f65/t1210...40#post1935481
    Last edited by BobL; 24th Nov 2018 at 12:26 PM.

  6. #6
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    BobL
    I will be interested in your coolant system build and what you think of the results using it.For my mister system I only use very clean ATF oil mixed with a bit of kerosine just to dilute it a bit. 250 mls kero in 1500 mls ATF. I found this allows me to achieve a very fine mist. By using clean mix I have not had any problems with nozzle clogging.Reusing sump oil may create a problem.I have built a couple of chip/oil guards for my mill that can be removed easily ie no tools required.One guard is just a piece of heavy vinyl sheet 400*300mm that is held in place at the back of the vise with two magnets and can be height adjusted or removed as required, the other guard is a piece of polycarbonate sheeting that I folded up to suit my mills vice and it just drops in place behind the two washers in the end of the vise. I use these mostly when fly cutting to contain the oil and chips.
    If any oil gets spilt on the floor a few sheets of newspaper soak it up.
    Bob
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #7
    BobL is online now Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Quote Originally Posted by krisfarm View Post
    BobL
    I will be interested in your coolant system build and what you think of the results using it.For my mister system I only use very clean ATF oil mixed with a bit of kerosine just to dilute it a bit. 250 mls kero in 1500 mls ATF. I found this allows me to achieve a very fine mist. By using clean mix I have not had any problems with nozzle clogging.Reusing sump oil may create a problem.
    Sure your system makes a lot of sense. I will try both new and used ATF but I will clean up the used ATF first. I'm not sure if I will try ATF in my sump - I might just leave regular coolant in that for a while. If ATF was to be used in the sump an in line filter will probably be needed. Then it comes down to how often any filter will need cleaning or replacing and at what point does this become more of a PITA than cleaning out a WSO sump.

    I have built a couple of chip/oil guards for my mill that can be removed easily ie no tools required.One guard is just a piece of heavy vinyl sheet 400*300mm that is held in place at the back of the vise with two magnets and can be height adjusted or removed as required, the other guard is a piece of polycarbonate sheeting that I folded up to suit my mills vice and it just drops in place behind the two washers in the end of the vise. I use these mostly when fly cutting to contain the oil and chips.
    Good idea about the guards for some processes. I already have one on my lathe which works really well with WSO coolant.

    If any oil gets spilt on the floor a few sheets of newspaper soak it up.
    I'll need to start saving the community newspaper as we haven't been getting a regular newspaper for many years. However, I do have access to lots of sawdust and have used that to contain oil floods in various places. Several times my large chainsaws and chainsaw mills have spilt their bar and chain oil guts in the back of my my van. That stuff is super sticky as it contains a heap of tackifier. I pull everything out of the back of the van and chuck in a couple of buckets of sawdust wait for 30 minutes and then park the van up hill and hose it out - works a treat.

  8. #8
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    Hi Bob
    From what l can see ATF costs about the same as some threading and cutting oils ($30-$40 for 4 litres)
    Unless you are getting your ATF for free, why would you use it rather than threading or cutting oil?
    Maybe l missed the bit about cheap ATF?
    l like the idea of not using soluble oil, it certainly doesn't smell good when it gets old.
    By the sound of it, 4 litres would last a long time using your method.
    Anyway l have ordered a mister to give it a try.

    Pete

  9. #9
    BobL is online now Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petip View Post
    Hi Bob
    From what l can see ATF costs about the same as some threading and cutting oils ($30-$40 for 4 litres)
    Unless you are getting your ATF for free, why would you use it rather than threading or cutting oil?
    Maybe l missed the bit about cheap ATF?
    Used ATF oil is free since mechanics pay to get rid of it and can be used in a flood coolan system as is.
    However used ATF is unlikely to work in a mister unless it is filtered which I am prepared to experiment with.

  10. #10
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    Hi Pete
    After using water based coolants for a couple of years and finding rust developing under my mills vise, plus the mixture going rancid in my lathe and mills tank, I had to find an alternate. A good friend of mine who was an industrial chemist suggested trying the ATF oil as it is one of the best grades of oils made. I use second hand ATF oil in both my mill and lathe when using a flood supply. I asked my local automatic transmission service shop if they could save me some of the cleanest oil.I offered to pay him but he said no payment needed as he had to pay to have it removed.I originally ran this through a filter system that I rigged up and then cut the filter open to see how it looked inside, there was hardly anything visible inside it. So now all I do is store a 20 litre drum of used oil for a couple of months and only draw off the top.This is probably a bit of an overkill as well as I am sure there are plenty of small metal particles in any coolant that has been used in any metal cutting operation.
    On my misting systems I originally used virgin ATF oil mixed with a bit of kerosine I did this as the needle valves in the control unit can be adjusted down very finely and I did not want any blockage. This worked perfectly. Last week I tried a mix of used ATF/kerosine in my misters and so far it has worked just fine as well.I am sure other oils could used in these misters as long as they are of a low viscosity.
    Bob

  11. #11
    BobL is online now Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    My Mechanic promised me 20L of used ATF last week but he forgot to tell his assistant that I needed it and all his waste oil got bundled off to the waste oil disposal centre. When I asked the mechanic about it he directed me to an Auto transmission specialist about 10km away and they had hundreds of litre of waste ATF but
    - it was all stored in oily (on the outside) 50L oily drums (ie not easy to handle)
    - it contained quite a bit of other oils as well ie regular gearbox oil.
    - all of the oil in the drums was surprisingly dirty - it looked like over used engine oil to me. Each drum was probably contaminated by just one or two vehicles worth of ATF that had gone waaaay past their change by date.

    They did allow me to collect about 10L of reasonably clean ATF direct out of a pickup auto tranny they were emptying which is better than nothing. So it looks as though its not quite as easy as I thought. I have gone back to my mechanic and will ask him to collect any cleaner used ATF into a container I will supply to him.

  12. #12
    BobL is online now Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    After much mucking about I have finally set up my mist cooling system.

    The messy photo below shows the air supply starting top right corner with a with a brass tap plumbed into the retic comp air line (1)
    I will turn this tap off when I finish the milling job.

    R is a small regulator to drop the air pressure a bit.
    T is a small tap that I will use to turn turn the air pressure off at the job
    IMG_3275.jpg

    Closer up view of regulator and Mixer M
    IMG_3276.jpg
    Above you can also see the black 3/8" air line and the small (5mm) transparent ATF line heading to the mixer (M)
    Sorry the mixer is hard to see but it's one of these from ebay
    One input is for the compressed air and the other for the fluid



    This shows the air/ATF mixer and the brass delivery nozzle. The other darker blue flexible coolant line is for ATF flood cooling.
    The white beaker was just collecting the coolant to measure the flow.
    I ran it for five minutes and it collected 2mL of fluid.
    IMG_3278.jpg

    This shows the 1L ATF reservoir I'm currently using - at the rate of 0.4mL/min it will last 42 hours but on some small jobs I should be able to get double that.
    I decided to use new ATF in the first instance and diluted it with kero the same was as krisfarm.
    IMG_3279.jpg

  13. #13
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    Does the mist cause respiratory problems from breathing in fine vapour?
    Gold, the colour of choice for the discerning person.

  14. #14
    BobL is online now Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Quote Originally Posted by .RC. View Post
    Does the mist cause respiratory problems from breathing in fine vapour?
    Shouldn't be too bad as nearby I have an up to 1600 CFM extraction/ventilation fan I can employ.

  15. #15
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    Very interesting, I can see how mist cooling would work really well on my shaper, which like most shapers is not really suitable for flood cooling systems.
    Another project to add to the list that I already don't have time for.

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