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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
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    Default Rolling rings from 8mm rod

    Hi all
    I make a few African drums and they use steel rings to tighten the skins.

    A few years ago I bought a Planetary Ring Roller that does a great job making rings with 6mm steel rod. But I often need to use 8mm rod.
    A similar tool cost around $1,000 and that is more than I can justify for occasional jobs.

    So I wind the long rods around a circular form that is similar to the diameter that I need. It works but I would like to be able to do a neater job and be able to get the diameter closer to the particular drum that I am making.

    I was hoping someone could point me in the direction of a supplier of materials I could use to make my own rolling machine, advice on construction or a supplier of a more affordable machine.

    Thanks
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    Scally
    __________________________________________
    The ark was built by an amateur
    the titanic was built by professionals

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
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    Newcatle
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    Default Ring Rolling options

    In my search for an affordable ring rolling machine I have come up with a few options.

    Hare & Forbes have small sheet rolling machines that have grooves for rolling round stock. I haven't been able to get any useful information from them regarding rolling 8mm rod. I gather it is intended for thinner gauge wire. It would be nearly perfect if it would roll 8mm or if I could replace the long sheet rollers with heavier rod rollers.

    I also asked them if they could supply rollers for 8mm rod for their sheet roller of the 6mm planetary ring roller that I have. They do sell the same roller. No reply so far.

    There are several home made ring rollers on Youtube that are similar to the Kaka pipe roller in one of the attached pics.

    I think I could make my own if I could find the rollers.

    Does anyone know where I could find them in Aus?
    Scally
    __________________________________________
    The ark was built by an amateur
    the titanic was built by professionals

  3. #3
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Default

    I would not expect H&F to know what end of the handle to hold let alone the info you are after about their gear

    The other option is to get a larger radius groove turned by a metal turner in the H&F roller. However I don't think that is a long term solution as that set of rollers may not last long bending that diameter rod. To ease the effort required by the rollers a full annealing of the rod should be undertaken. They are probably too long to do this with an oxy but it could be performed using a BBQ briquette fire. This would also form a nice blue metal oxide layer on the steel.

    A set of rollers would also not be that hard to make by a metal turner.
    Last year I made a machine and rollers to flatten bandsaw blades, across the blade.
    see post #17 on this page //metalworkforums.com/f65/t1954...roller+bandsaw
    As I am a slow metal worker it took me a long time but I would expect a pro to knock these up very quickly.

  4. #4
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    Default

    I made one years ago to roll 20NB Sched 40 pipe. Works fine - I've used it to roll 12mm rod so 8mm would be real easy. You do need to consider what the minimum ring OD is going to be before you start making bits though.

    The whole thing was fabricated out of some 150mm parallel flange channel welded into a T shape and the rollers were fabricated from hard PVC machined to profile & sandwiched between compression plates.

    There are some pix of mine on this forum somewhere but I'm too lazy to go & look for them. The search function of the vBulletin software universally sucks.

    Anyway it's a really simple thing to make if you have a lathe and welding gear. No way I'd pay $1000 USD for one.

    PDW

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post
    I would not expect H&F to know what end of the handle to hold let alone the info you are after about their gear
    That would be most suppliers wouldn't it? There's one on the WWF that sells a lot of gear, but after sales and product knowledge, really lets them down.
    To grow old is mandatory, growing up is optional.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
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    Mackay North Qld
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    Default

    The ring roller you mentioned is likely one sold that is a 1/4" max that is 6.35mm.It was around $160 at Ozeme store where I got mine.

    If it is the one I believe mods are possible to achieve 8mm ring rolling

    I think that the roller grooves could be opened up to take 8mm with out too much trouble. Perhaps you might be able to get one of our members with a lathe to do this for you.


    The roller looks like this.This illustration shows flat being rolled,but there are grooves for rolling round bar.


    1415-Planetary-Ring-Roller.jpg

  7. #7
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    Default

    I've recently seen a thread on another forum where someone showed a picture of a vice and three rollers to do this. The pressure on the driving roller was applied by tightening the vice jaws. It looked very simple and would probably be easy to make.
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  8. #8
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    Theres a vice top roller mentioned here in the Home shop machinist forums. Tt attaches to a frame also utilized to bend sheet metal and flats.
    The roller are machined for flats but the rollers could be machined for an 8mm diameter bar.

    Ring roller question.

    BaronJ is right on.Its about as simple as you can make it.With 2 rollers on one jaw and another centered on the opposite jaw,the ring diameters are set by opening and closing the vice.


    I tried to copy the pics but they won't save to my Drive.I hope the pics open for you.

    Grahame

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
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    Willunga
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    Default

    For the 7 1/4 Hunslet Locomotive that I am making I recently made the sort of simple ring roller that BaronJ describes, though the idea for mine came from an old issue of Australian Model Engineer.

    20161231_150220.jpg

    Here the parts of the ring roller are sitting on the front of the locomotive, behind is some spring steel rolled into a coil and the completed springs (after heat treatment can be seen).

    20161231_150855.jpg

    Here the ring roller is assembled in the vice in place of the false jaws. Adjustment is by means of the of the vice screw and they could be made to fit any vice with detachable false jaws. A big vice like the Fortis in the pic is by no means necessary.

    My rollers are 30mm diam and the pivots for the outboard rollers are 70 mm apart. The pivot for the rollers are 8mm high tensile bolts with a plain shank long enough for the rollers to run on. The pivot bolts a threaded into the angle with a locknut below. The pivots need to be as close to the edge of the angle as is practical so that the rollers can be brought in quite close to do small rings. I will make up profiled rollers to do things like rod as I need them. The handle is nicked with a cutoff wheel, bent and the resulting V welded. I made up a decent handle from a bit of broom handle to protect the hands of my assistant and thus to ensure that she was available to assist on more that one occasion.

    I am sure that with a bit of profiling on the rollers this this would have no problem up to 10mm rod.

    Sorry about the upside down pics, I tried without success to rotate them... If someone knows how to do this please feel free.

    Regards

    Ian

    20161231_150855.jpg

    .20161231_150220.jpg

  10. #10
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  11. #11
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNutter View Post
    For the 7 1/4 Hunslet Locomotive that I am making I recently made the sort of simple ring roller that BaronJ describes, though the idea for mine came from an old issue of Australian Model Engineer.

    20161231_150220.jpg

    Here the parts of the ring roller are sitting on the front of the locomotive, behind is some spring steel rolled into a coil and the completed springs (after heat treatment can be seen).

    20161231_150855.jpg

    Here the ring roller is assembled in the vice in place of the false jaws. Adjustment is by means of the of the vice screw and they could be made to fit any vice with detachable false jaws. A big vice like the Fortis in the pic is by no means necessary.

    My rollers are 30mm diam and the pivots for the outboard rollers are 70 mm apart. The pivot for the rollers are 8mm high tensile bolts with a plain shank long enough for the rollers to run on. The pivot bolts a threaded into the angle with a locknut below. The pivots need to be as close to the edge of the angle as is practical so that the rollers can be brought in quite close to do small rings. I will make up profiled rollers to do things like rod as I need them. The handle is nicked with a cutoff wheel, bent and the resulting V welded. I made up a decent handle from a bit of broom handle to protect the hands of my assistant and thus to ensure that she was available to assist on more that one occasion.

    I am sure that with a bit of profiling on the rollers this this would have no problem up to 10mm rod.

    Sorry about the upside down pics, I tried without success to rotate them... If someone knows how to do this please feel free.

    Regards

    Ian

    .
    There you go
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  12. #12
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    Default

    Michael, You beat me to it
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  13. #13
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    Baron, that's the trouble when you're about a quarter of a day behind us.
    To grow old is mandatory, growing up is optional.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Newcatle
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    Default

    Great information guys.

    I will see if I can find a mate with a metal lathe..........adjusting the main roller on my Ring Roller would be a neat solution.

    There might be a trip to H & F to look at their machines. They look light duty but might be strong enough for my purpose........Probably still need a metalworking mate for the right profile.

    The vice top roller looks good, TheNutter. My small vice doesn't allow me to bolt the roller jaws but I could look around for one.

    I'll have a closer look at your "right way up" pics.

    The PVC rollers I think I could turn. Thanks PWD........a pic of your roller would help my brain but I think I get the idea.

    I will have to widen my circle of mates to include a metal worker.....

    I sent an email to Chevingtonmetaltools in Victoria who sell a Metalcraft ring rolling machine............Metalcraft Australia - The official Metalcraft Tools

    Greg Cowie replied the next day and was very helpful. It would do my job with ease but at around $1200 he understood my reluctance to make a purchase.
    I was impressed with his speed of response and useful feedback.....

    I was just thinking that maybe I could get him to put with the rollers?

    Maybe I will send him another email.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Scally
    __________________________________________
    The ark was built by an amateur
    the titanic was built by professionals

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