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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Kyabram. Vic
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    632

    Default What the hell is it?

    Quite some time ago I purchased 2 Hardinge split bed lathes which came with 3 large plastic tubs of treasures of Hardinge and other bits & pieces. I started sorting through it yesterday. Quite a few end mills, a couple of horizontal mill cutters and slotting cutters, reamers, morse taper adapters, high speed steel, thread chasers etc as well as "what the hell are they items?"

    Todays item is something that I probably always needed, maybe; if I know what it is. Looks brand new; Swiss made which should spark your interest B.T. I am leaning towards watchmaking; as there was also some minute turning tools as well as some letter stamps which look similiar to the markings on older proper watches and clock workings.

    019.jpg

    Ken

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    South of Adelaide
    Posts
    1,225

    Default

    I think it might be a o ring measuring tool or something similar. you put the Oring over the shaft (i'm assuming the 4 shafts are tapered) and whatever making it lines up with is the size. that's my best guess.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Griffith NSW
    Posts
    435

    Default

    Looks like a hole guage, in thou perhaps?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    9,088

    Default

    Yeah hole/bore gauge is my guess. Take the pin out, put it in the hole, mark, put it back in the holder, read off the size????

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Perth WA
    Age
    71
    Posts
    6,458

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Toggy View Post

    ...........Todays item is something that I probably always needed, maybe; if I know what it is. Looks brand new; Swiss made which should spark your interest B.T. I am leaning towards watchmaking; as there was also some minute turning tools as well as some letter stamps which look similiar to the markings on older proper watches and clock workings.

    Ken
    Hello Ken,

    It's a Zeigerlochlehre !! A watch and clockmaker's hand gauge for holes. There is a newer version illustrated in Bergeon's Essentiel13 catalogue.

    BT

    DSC_6882 (Large).jpg DSC_6885 (Large).jpg
    Last edited by Anorak Bob; 25th Oct 2016 at 07:26 PM. Reason: photos added for Variant.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    formerly from Sydney (north of The Harbour), NSW, Oz
    Age
    68
    Posts
    306

    Default

    what are the words stamped or engraved on the tool?
    regards from Canmore

    ian

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kyabram. Vic
    Posts
    632

    Default

    Thanks BT. My guess was correct then. I have a vague recollection of "Lauris" being a top shelf watch/clock in days of old.

    Ha.... Ian. You wish. They are so small that I can barely see them and I don't think I have anything with enough magnification to read them. I have used them and they leave a stamped imprint in a box. I will use them on a piece of alloy later in the day when these damn medicos have finished having their way with me. I will try a stamp loupe to see if I can decipher them. I don,t think that my macro lens will cut it; and I don't have anything like a microscope type lens.

    Ken

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kyabram. Vic
    Posts
    632

    Default

    I am now sure that the punches are jewelers tools. I have been able to read the stampings and they are from the left ROCKENSHIRY, SILVER, 18CT, 9CT and 18CT with first 18 and 9 T being underlined.

    006.jpg003.jpg

    These are the lathe tools, 1st is a D bit, 2nd appears to be an internal threading tool, 3 & 4 seem to be boring tools 5th is a tiny tapered D bit and the last is a match.

    001.jpg




    Ken

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    26

    Default

    Ken,
    I just sent a PM with my details.
    I'd love to have a chat about those punches.

    Cheers,
    Peter
    .....Who has his own set of that kind of punches!!!
    Peter McBride Goldsmith Jeweller

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kyabram. Vic
    Posts
    632

    Default

    PM received Peter.

    After further research in the right direction they original gauge turns out to be a "Watch hand hole gauge". Its use is to measure the size of the holes in watch hands. The hole at the base of the hand is placed over the tapered pin; and the scale then gives the hole size.

    I have found some more bits & pieces; square emery stick (well used) for deburring, 2 tiny vices, quantity of piercing saw blades and a brass handled item with a hardened tapered point which I originally thought was a scribe. On magnifying the point I found 2 tiny grooves and I now think that it may be a hole deburring tool.
    The item in first photo I think is is the support for an intermediate step pulley for a tiny round belt watchmakers lathe.
    The second item appears to be for holding work between centres and balancing gears/wheels etc.

    009.jpg010.jpg

    Ken

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    26

    Default

    Hi Ken,
    I have about 20 punches of jewellers working in the late 1800s to early 1900s.
    Your Punch marks are very, very interesting to me.
    I've done some searching after looking closely at the mark you made.
    There is a first letter, partly punched in one of your marks.
    It has taken most of the morning BUT !!!!
    What you have are the punches of Messrs Brockenshire,
    They were working in Collinigwood & North Fitzroy at exactly my period of interest.
    Look here.

    16 May 1896 Weekley Times Melb Advert.

    and here a story about a jewellery thief being sentenced....
    04 Jul 1901 - JEWELLERY THIEF SENTENCED. - Trove

    It was a treat to have a long chat
    Cheers,
    Peter

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    26

    Default

    Ken,
    Here are the some of the punch marks I told you about.
    Those of W Slomell, the pipe maker, silversmith and ivory & shell worker from Royal Arcade Melb.
    His other tools are here

    Peter


  13. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Perth WA
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    71
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    6,458

    Default

    The hand hole thing prompted another look through my collection....You are spot on Ken. Any chance of a photo or two of the vices?

    DSC_6895 (Large).jpg DSC_6896 (Large).JPG

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Perth WA
    Age
    71
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    6,458

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Toggy View Post
    .....
    The item in first photo I think is is the support for an intermediate step pulley for a tiny round belt watchmakers lathe.
    The second item appears to be for holding work between centres and balancing gears/wheels etc.

    009.jpg

    Ken
    Hey Ken,

    A bunch of manufacturers made similar stands as spindle mounts - two pages from Millers Falls' 1938 cataogue

    BT

    DSC_6897 (Large).jpg

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kyabram. Vic
    Posts
    632

    Default

    Hello Bob,

    Peter has also came up with your findings of the spindle mount. He also thinks that item number 2 is a metal lathe; or even machining ivory. He believes it may be a watch makers "bow lathe". Similiar concept to a woodworkers pole lathe. Imagine bow used in 1 hand and graver applied with the other.

    Ken

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