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15th Jun 2021, 10:05 PM #1
Design problem: I'm looking for help
Hi all,
I'm trying to design a movable step for our Transit van camper.
I really don't want to have the step in its stored position lower than the existing structure due to ground clearance. Here is a sketch of the space available for storage, and the position I would like it in when extended out. Any hinges or tracks or levers need to fit no further left then the vertical line on the left (the outline of the van) and no lower than the horizontal line on the right (the water tank under the van floor).
I've tried all kinds of variations of CAD (cardboard assisted design) and lots of sketches of hinges and tracks - all to no avail.
So I thought there are better and more imaginative brains here than anywhere I can imagine, so someone might just "see" in their mind how it could be done
Step path.jpgCheers, Joe
retired - less energy, more time to contemplate projects and more shed time....
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15th Jun 2021, 10:18 PM #2Most Valued Member
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My first thought looking at the picture is vertical runners at the rear to bring the step assembly down, then slide within a slide horizontally until you have the reach you need. Fair bit of cantilever action going on though.
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15th Jun 2021, 11:26 PM #3Golden Member
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Might be easier to achieve if some simplification of the problem is possible.
For example, would the storage position be workable if the step stayed horizontal (or close to) when stored, but was as high and far forwards as possible?
Things may be easier if the step could be stored inverted. If so maybe it could hinge around the edge that is forward when deployed; that would reduce the distance to the storage location, and (errr ... maybe) simplify the mechanism needed.
J hovel step.gif
Bill
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15th Jun 2021, 11:53 PM #4Most Valued Member
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If the step tread can be split into two leaves and folded on top of itself for storage so it’s only half as long (left to right in the photo), then it would give more options as to the final orientation when stored.
In case that doesn’t make sense, the setup action for use would be to pull the step out of its storage, and then flip the front leaf down.
I still can’t visualize after that how it would actually be set up, but just feels to me like having to use the full diagonal space to store it makes it harder to achieve.
Steve
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16th Jun 2021, 02:22 AM #5
Hi Joe, Guys,
When I made the step for my Ford transit 280 camper van, now scrapped, I used a motor driven screw and a pair of roller rails to support it !
A battery electric drill drove the screw, the step was horizontal and bolted to the sill lip at the front and a pair of M8 bolts at the rear into the chassis runner. A pair of M8 riv-nuts crimped into the chassis and a pair of M6 riv-nuts in the bottom of the sill. The actual step was a rectangle of aluminium chequer plate pop riveted to the moving frame. The whole thing was only an inch in thickness excluding the drill motor.
The downside was the drill motor made quite a noticeable noise when running. It did about six years before the van got scrapped because of chassis failure at the rear spring hangers. Sad really because it was a very good conversion and did about 60K running about Europe.
The new van is currently SORN'ed, at least until this Covid thing is sorted.Best Regards:
Baron J.
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16th Jun 2021, 07:43 AM #6Golden Member
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Joe
I have a bit on and am not good at computer sketching to prove my idea. If you have the step in the stowed position with the top corner at the rear of the compartment instead of the front as shown \ way instead of / way it opens up some options.
I would put the pivot on the lower back point with an arm at to near the top back of the step. If you can get the angles correct this would allow the step to come out in a counter clockwise motion and extend back.
I have a few more ideas on refining this concept if it looks like it may work for you.
Steve
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16th Jun 2021, 08:23 AM #7Philomath in training
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Joe, is that sketch to scale? At a first glance, I think the movement may have to be in two stages but it's an interesting problem so a solution may present itself.
Michael
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16th Jun 2021, 12:54 PM #8
Thanks everyone for the responses.
I'll consider them all and review how I could implement each one.
The rotating idea of Steve's is interesting, I'll have a ponder. Not considered that one at all.
Michael, it's only roughly to scale. Once I review the new principles, I'll do a dimensioned sketch for working out the exact mechanism.
Having the step in two folding slats sounds like a great way to reduce the storage angle. I had not considered that either.
Roller tracks was in my mind when I considered my option and the cantilever issue stopped me going down that track....
Keep ideas coming. Amazing how differently different people think and imagine engineering issues! Great stuff!Cheers, Joe
retired - less energy, more time to contemplate projects and more shed time....
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16th Jun 2021, 01:16 PM #9Golden Member
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Joe
To I will add a bit more to my thinking. If I was to design this I would measure the length of the opening.
This length would determine how long the pivoting arm can be. I would then draw an arc from the lower rear corner. This will show how far back the pivot would go.
The attachment point for the pivot arm to the step will be where it wants to be. I would be guessing 1/2 to 2/3 along step.
This arm would pivot at both the step and caravan end.
When the step is "released" from the stowed position it will naturally drop down.
The easiest solution would be to have a chain that hangs down and holds the step in the rearward position and a pin to stop the step rotating.
Therefore your design would be to straight arms, a chain and pin.
Steve
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16th Jun 2021, 02:44 PM #10Diamond Member
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How about storing the step in the same plane as it is when in use?
keeps it simple.
Step path.jpg
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16th Jun 2021, 05:02 PM #11
Hi Joe, Guys,
I started my design by using a piece of flat wood pressed against the underside of the chassis member protruding out under the sill. I found that on my van the sill was level with the bottom of the chassis. This effectively determined that the step was going to be horizontal and level with bottom of the sill.
The amount that I wanted the step to protrude, about 9" inches determined the overall length of the side rails and hence the total length plus that needed for the motor. Since there is not a great weight to pull and push I used a brass M8 nut and galvanised threaded rod to drive the step.Best Regards:
Baron J.
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16th Jun 2021, 06:16 PM #12Golden Member
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G'day Joe,
How about a combination of telescopic slides, pivoting step and hinged supports.
Step.png
Cheers,
Greg.
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16th Jun 2021, 06:30 PM #13
Have you looked at the commercial units out there ?
https://www.caravansplus.com.au/dome...p-p-17429.html
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/29154172...SABEgLB1fD_BwE
https://www.aussietraveller.com.au/brands/thule/step
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16th Jun 2021, 07:03 PM #14Most Valued Member
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Hi Joe,
What surfaces are structural?
I assume we aren't allow to drop a strap down off that left hand face?
I'm picturing a stair that swings down sideways, slides forward then flips out. Easy
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17th Jun 2021, 09:57 PM #15Philomath in training
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Still thinking about this one Joe. Not what you have asked for I know but may be a good fall back position -
Simple step.JPG
With a pivot point just by the corner (where the circle is), a step would fold up flat against the door.
I was also thinking of an aluminium step that would sit in the stair well when travelling and then could be taken out when you first open the door.
We'll keep thinking...
Michael
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