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25th Nov 2015, 10:32 PM #1Senior Member
- Join Date
- May 2012
- Location
- Vermont 3133 Victoria
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- 248
Camel back, squares, scrapers and cast surface plate.
Thanks to a post from greg_n I recently won, as in the title, some good gear.
As a follow up I caught up with Phil M last Sat and as always had a great yak and top lunch at a local Viet eatery. As Phil does, he passed on some interesting info of work he is doing, bloody dark on him though as he is monopolising the market in Biax scrapers.
He gave me a jar of Prussian blue powder that he purchased from an arts supplier in Fitzroy so tonight I thought I would mix up a half batch. 10 g of powder to 50 of the Kingchrome pale grease from Bunnings.
MMM note to self, mix carefully, powder will puff, cloud out, so the stainless sink is actually porous.
Mix Mix maybe I shouldn't have grabbed a mug out of the cupboard, turns out they are porous.
Mix feels a bit stiff, hey place in microwave and give it a bit of a zap. Bugger micro buttons are now blue and door and taps and windex bottle, only bonus is windex actually cleans up well. Hey I have a full box of medical gloves on the kitchen bench, why didn't I put some on.
The blue looks very dark in the container but when on fingers and, copious amounts of paper towel looks ok. Will put some on the granite plate tomorrow night.
So as I hadn't really done any scraping since the last Phil, Marko enlightenment what the heck how hard can a 500 X 230 cast surface plate be to scrape by hand.
Mmmm hard, hint Phil a Biax would be nice, must say Phil did offer to let me borrow a Biax but at this stage I am not ready to attack the Elliott lathe.
I think I am about 5 cycles away from having the cast plate reading around 20 points, nice, guess 6 hrs work, was low in the middle like an oval but not excessive if I blued a bit thicker there was a good coverage. Got to love reading the rub, dark, light, lighter and what looks shines almost grey. The high high spots.
When I picked up the gear it turned out there were another 2 straight edges, 1 smaller than the 3ft that is in good nick, that I will scrape in, only been ground. The smaller is pitted and needs machining and grind, then there was a nice camel back straight edge with dovetail edge, needs machining and grind.
And yes magic from Phil and Marko will put me in a place from no masters to 3.
Cheers
Bruce
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26th Nov 2015, 08:41 AM #2Most Valued Member
- Join Date
- Jul 2006
- Location
- Athelstone, SA 5076
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- 4,255
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26th Nov 2015, 09:33 AM #3Golden Member
- Join Date
- Mar 2012
- Location
- Western NSW
- Posts
- 543
Did he mention he had a biax with all the other gear. He priced it a little low so it did not last long on eBay. The original BIN price was also low on those items but he removed it quickly once the Biax was gone.
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26th Nov 2015, 11:24 AM #4Senior Member
- Join Date
- May 2012
- Location
- Vermont 3133 Victoria
- Posts
- 248
The Biax I believe was an early model, fixed speed it went for $550. The seller knows Phil from days gone by.
26-11-2015 10-02-58 AM.jpg
Ebay pic, the large Moore and Wright grade A I have moved on, it had the original wooden box. I have also sold one of the Sandvik scrapers and will sell the other 25mm size, the 20mm I will keep.
20151126_083929.jpg
The cast square is scraped on the 90's, the 3' straight edge hasn't been scraped but seems ok a half thou feeler wont pass under it, i will probably scrape it in.
20151118_202119.jpg
Initial rough in scrape, hadn't crossed scraped the opposite way yet in this pic. I have put about 6 hrs on it know and it is just about there. The curve is only an illusion from how the phone has taken the pic.
20151118_201923.jpg
Not a great pic but these are the other 2 straight edges I also got from the seller.
20151117_114205_1.jpg20151117_114154_1.jpg
The seller will be listing other gear he has this really nice milling vice, swivel and tilt. If anyone is interested I can pass on his number.
Cheers Bruce
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26th Nov 2015, 11:37 AM #5Pink 10EE owner
- Join Date
- Aug 2008
- Location
- near Rockhampton
- Posts
- 6,216
I am glad the equipment has gone to someone who will make good use of it. As a legacy of the scraping classes I think there is more scraping going on behind the scenes then we think is going on
Phil and Marko should hold their heads high that they have done their bit to keep the skills alive. Also none of this may have even happened had not Joe started the ball rolling all those years ago. It was his idea that made the first class a reality.Gold, the colour of choice for the discerning person.
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26th Nov 2015, 11:51 AM #6Most Valued Member
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- Jul 2006
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- Athelstone, SA 5076
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- 4,255
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26th Nov 2015, 12:01 PM #7Most Valued Member
- Join Date
- Jul 2010
- Location
- Melbourne
- Posts
- 9,088
Hi Bruce,
I thought that lot sounded familiar
Very nice buy.
Stuart
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26th Nov 2015, 05:47 PM #8Banned
- Join Date
- Jul 2011
- Location
- Melbourne Australia
- Posts
- 1,376
Believe it or not, I made a start on that this afternoon. The pads on the back of the arch, they were 0.6mm different in height, and they were lower than the crest of the arch, so you couldn't use them any way. What to do.
I milled them the same height and drill tapped a couple of M6 holes.
P1010447.jpg
I had a scrap of cast iron.
P1010448.JPG
Epoxy filled the counter bores after gluing & screwing the blocks on. I even torqued them.
P1010450.jpg
Left over size for machining, I'll blend them in with a ball nose end mill, into the existing pads. Coat of paint and you wont know they are there. They are left over size so I can adjust them to the same thickness as the main face, so you can lay it on its side and the face will be square.
P1010449.jpg
Fly cut, ground and scraped, that should be a little beauty. Thinking about having it sand blasted and powder coated before I machine it.
The way the main face is at the moment, sand blasting would improve it.
Regards Phil.
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26th Nov 2015, 09:13 PM #9Senior Member
- Join Date
- May 2012
- Location
- Vermont 3133 Victoria
- Posts
- 248
Not quite sure what to say, I guess above and beyond. This is to me another example of how great it is to have a like community group of fantastic blokes. I never said to Phil do this, as we all know this is how he slides. If you are going to do something don't cut corners. I guess the arch could have been machined down but in a precision master may not be the best.
It it is more relevant as Phil's time when he helps us is time he could be making real money. So when I have 3 masters and the large cast master square they are open for use for anyone who may need them.
In reading the replys to my post RC hit the nail on the head, if not for Joe all of this AUS scraping journey may never have happened. Big thanks there. I have looked over all the old Google info and it is great to see how it started as let's say baby steps to where now many are sprinting.
PS I may have been dreaming when I said, 6 hrs on the cast surface plate, put another 1.5 hrs in tonight. I am in that place where not having enough experience I blue a bit heavier and then survey and scrape, blue lighter and it is a different decision. The plate is close but I can keep chasing, points.
Cheers Bruce
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26th Nov 2015, 09:24 PM #10Senior Member
- Join Date
- May 2012
- Location
- Vermont 3133 Victoria
- Posts
- 248
Just had a revelation, previously I mentioned that Phil was monopolising the purchase of Biax scrapers.
I have investigated and have an answer. He is when it comes to finding them part blood hound, so bad luck to all!
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26th Nov 2015, 09:42 PM #11Banned
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- Jul 2011
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- Melbourne Australia
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- 1,376
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26th Nov 2015, 09:59 PM #12Banned
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- Jul 2011
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- Melbourne Australia
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- 1,376
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26th Nov 2015, 10:30 PM #13Pink 10EE owner
- Join Date
- Aug 2008
- Location
- near Rockhampton
- Posts
- 6,216
If you have areas of big blue blobs and areas of little blue blobs, ignore the little ones, and split the big ones, but do not scrape all the big blue blob areas. A good stoning can work wonders as well, but not too good a stoning A stoning will make the little blue blobs bigger. I find a good stoning can work wonders as well, but not too good a stoning A stoning will make the little blue blobs bigger in size.
Provided you have good coverage overall of blue blobs. Having one tiny ppi in one area and 40ppi in another area generally means you have gone chasing ppi too quickly and progress will slow to a crawl. I find you can not do too much damage in one go with a hand scraper so get into it when roughing, a biax is a different story though and you can make a mess very quickly with them.
Too little amount of blue can also make progress slow to a crawl. I like to put it on so I can see high, not so high and not not so high spots. If I put too little on, only the very high spots are showing and if I am still roughing out, that is not very helpful to me.Gold, the colour of choice for the discerning person.
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26th Nov 2015, 11:13 PM #14Senior Member
- Join Date
- May 2012
- Location
- Vermont 3133 Victoria
- Posts
- 248
Hi Rich,
In the scraping learning curve what you have said is exactly what I am finding. Spot the extra high points, don't take all out. Thin blue makes you question where you are at. Like wise more blue the reading can look like there is a great coverage. Focus on the high points, break up the, as Marko would say naughty points.
it is a very fine line, amount of blue, how much stoning, how deep are you scraping with a hand scrape.
Roughed in the cast 500 X 230 surface plate. As mentioned in previous posts found middle was low.
Caught up with PHIL, 2 seconds later, you need to check with an indicator, turns out .5 thou low.
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27th Nov 2015, 01:55 AM #15
Phil,
I would be interested in one of the 'dead' ones - if you consider passing one along. I think I might have the means and ways to graft another motor on to them.... Would be good to have another functioning one in our group. Obviously available for loans to other members of the family.
Send me a PM or give me a call if you would consider it....Cheers, Joe
retired - less energy, more time to contemplate projects and more shed time....
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