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  1. #1
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    Default Hercus T&C Grinder

    Guys can you identify this one?




    Whats missing other than the motor and what would be a fair price?

    There doesn't seem to be any of the fixtures, so are they easily acquirable or make it a bit of a lost cause?
    …..Live a Quiet Life & Work with your Hands

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSEL74 View Post
    Guys can you identify this one?

    Whats missing other than the motor and what would be a fair price?

    There doesn't seem to be any of the fixtures, so are they easily acquirable or make it a bit of a lost cause?
    Old Hercus T&C grinder - the model that's not much chop. Voice of experience here. Also ask Anorak Bob...

    What's missing - everything. Not really easily acquirable, not likely to be cheap. Completely useless as-is unless you like big door stops.

    I paid $600 for mine with a full cabinet of tooling including a cylindrical grinding attachment. As is, I'd say $100 would be generous. Very.

    PDW

  3. #3
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    According to Lathes.uk
    [QUOTE]Items included: a No. 3 Morse taper universal workhead; tooth rest; a pair of work drivers; an internal grinding attachment; No. 1 Morse centres; a rough-turned 1.5" x 8 t.p.i. U.S.S. screwed chuck backplate; plain, dish and flared cup grinding wheels; drive belts and spanners.[/QUOTE


    According to lathes UK the accessories were:

    [Extra equipment listed included: 1.5" raiser blocks for the dead-centre work-heads; a 3.75" grinding wheel extension spindle; a gauge to judge the setting of centre height; a 3" swivel-base precision machine vice and a right-angle bracket to carry it (this allowed the vice to be swung to any angle in two planes); low centre holders with centres (useful such work as tap sharpening and grinding reamer flutes) and a collet attachment complete with a set of collets sized from 1/16" to ½" in steps of 1/64".


    I hadn't looked into them much. Doesn't seem to be a lot of info on the models from 1-3A. The more I look at it the less interesting it is due to lack of...well err everything
    Thanks for the reply PDW
    …..Live a Quiet Life & Work with your Hands

  4. #4
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    This is a much later model, more desirable.

    http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Tool-Cutt...item4d38c9ba43

    BUT!!!! If it has no tooling, it's overpriced. You really do need the tooling. No way of telling anything from the crap photos and listing.

    Frankly the single advantage these T&C grinders have over the Cincinnati types (many copies) is the compact size. In every way, the Cincy types are more versatile, more rigid and easier to find tooling for. I know a man with one of these Hercus grinders in perfect nick and one of these days when he's ready to part with it, money will change hands as it's a significant improvement on what I've got, and I know what my needs are these days.

    PDW

  5. #5
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    Dale,

    I agree with Peter. I paid $600 for the No.3 I had. It came with an orphan tailstock and an internal grinding spindle and 15 thou fall across the traverse of the table. There are a few threads on here regarding the grinder and its abundant wear. Hercus produced the No.3 in the early 1940s. It was replaced by the ball bearing tabled No.3A. The photo Tony has on his website is of a 3A not a 1.

    The No.1 I bought from Peter Fou came with nearly every accessory Hercus made along with a number of purpose made goodies crafted by Peter. //metalworkforums.com/threads/1...30#post1715330

    BT

  6. #6
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    From what you guys are saying I'm getting the impression that the model numbers are running in reverse and the no 1 is the most modern?
    …..Live a Quiet Life & Work with your Hands

  7. #7
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    Yes. The No.3 then the 3A and finally the No.1

  8. #8
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    I have a 3A which I bought for $250 a couple years ago. It only came with a small Chinese vice and a small mag chuck. The original spindle had been replaced with a Clarkson MK3 spindle. It was a reasonable job albeit no longer genuine, it would still do averything I needed from a T&C grinder. A few members here poo pooed the purchase as a waist of time & money since it was missing most of the accessories. I stood firm as was over the moon with my first (hybrid) Hercus purchase. The table and ways were flat to about a thou over the entire working envelope. Anyway, to cut a long story short, I have since aquired a universal grinding head and a 5C spin indexer. It gets used enough to make it a worthwhile piece of equipment in the shed. Having said that, I would agree with the initial assessment as it being useless without it's accessories. If I was to find myself purchasing another T&C grinder, I would certainly not waste my time buying one without the accessories.

    Even if that Hercus went for $50, it's still a waste of time and effort because, the time and effort required to aquire even the most basic accessories would be a PITA

    Edit: Of course if you already had a Hercus T&C grinder and needed a replacement part, well that's another issue!

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  9. #9
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    Just found it on Gumtree, $450 tell him he's DREAMING. Is he a scrap metal merchant?????
    Most of the machines I see on flea bay and gumtree, are all in about the same condition, must be a lot of boxes about that contain
    the bits for them somewhere???????? IF you had nothing to do all day, it COULD be the basis of a reasonable machine, just a matter of time and Dollars for the right part to come along or modifying them to fit. You could use it as a surface grinder for starters.
    Kryn
    Last edited by KBs PensNmore; 6th Oct 2015 at 05:39 PM. Reason: Gumtree price

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBs PensNmore View Post
    You could use it as a surface grinder for starters.
    Kryn
    You *could*. Provided your standards for a surface grinder were very, very low. I've tried it.

    With at least some of the accessories *and* provided the ways aren't totally shagged, you can sharpen side & face cutters, end mills and the like. With a few more accessories, very light low precision surface and cylindrical grinding both ID & OD. I thought of fitting a toolpost grinder head to mine.

    But - no power feed on any axis, coarse Z movement and no flood coolant. If you have nothing better and the price is right, sure. Otherwise, wait until the price drops a lot or a machine with a ton of tooling comes along. Problem for a lot of you guys is, the machines with a lot of tooling are usually 3 phase and 1+ tonnes occupying the space of a bit over a pallet in footprint. So sometimes a POS that fits is the best you can do.....

    PDW

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDW View Post
    So sometimes a POS that fits is the best you can do.....PDW
    Sometimes it's what's affordable too. I know, if you can't afford it, you shouldn't do it. 2 ex wives and a cleaned out super
    Ever tried to get metal work out of your blood, when you've been doing it for nearly 50 years.
    Kryn

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDW View Post
    You *could*. Provided your standards for a surface grinder were very, very low. I've tried it.


    PDW
    I forgot to mention, as mine came with a small mag chuck, I did experiment using it as a small surface grinder. As PDW says, you soon realise it's limitations when using it as a surface grinder. However, in my case what it did do was make me realise how useful a surface grinder would be, which was my next purchase. I also sold the small mag chuck I got with the T&G grinder (since I had a SG now) for $200 meaning the Hercus only owed me $50!

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonl View Post
    I forgot to mention, as mine came with a small mag chuck, I did experiment using it as a small surface grinder. As PDW says, you soon realise it's limitations when using it as a surface grinder. However, in my case what it did do was make me realise how useful a surface grinder would be, which was my next purchase.
    Simon
    Yeah. You don't realise quite how useful a SG is until you have one, and mine is only a baby Power without power feeds (cost me $58 on eBay plus days of dirty work and $350 for a new mag chuck). Need a set of parallels for a milling operation? No problem, couple bits of steel more or less the same thickness, a bit of grinding and presto - matched parallels.

    Same for making spacers and the like. I routinely part off a bit over length then grind to final size.

    Once I finish the rebuild I'm thinking the cylindrical grinder will save me working to a couple tenths of a thousand on the lathe when doing nice bearing fits. I can *do* it, the Chipmaster holds 0.0003" taper in 8", but it's still a bit worrying that you'll stuff the last shaving cut.

    PDW

  14. #14
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    It is a Hercus No.3 Surface Grinder. It is not a Tool and Cutter Grinder. On the table there is NOT a V and inverted V at the back of the table - as there should be on a T&C Grinder. I have the same surface grinder, just a bit more complete. Mine is serial number 3A 201, and that is a bit odd too!
    Alan

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by A J in WA View Post
    It is a Hercus No.3 Surface Grinder. It is not a Tool and Cutter Grinder. On the table there is NOT a V and inverted V at the back of the table - as there should be on a T&C Grinder. I have the same surface grinder, just a bit more complete. Mine is serial number 3A 201, and that is a bit odd too!
    Alan
    Hercus must have used just about all the same compenents as the t&c grinders and then called it a sg then! Apart from the missing V way, it all looks the same. There looks to be the same centre pin in the table to allow taper grinding (need to loosen the 4 clamps at each end of the table) which I can't see a need for in sg. It's got the same sole plate for the motor mount, same spindle casting, same spindle. I notice it does not have the spindle extension, the one thing you would probably need to do sg on it.

    Edit: I also notice it has the provision to rotate the table wrt the motor, spindle and grinding head which i dont know why a sg would need that either. The work envelope is about the same as my sg yet my sg weighs over a tonne.

    If that's Hercus's idea of a SG then I'm a little disappointed in their efforts!

    Simon
    Last edited by simonl; 7th Oct 2015 at 10:13 AM. Reason: added a bit

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