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  1. #61
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Default Bluing some woodies hand tools.

    I got back to some more metal bluing.

    This time it's a few woodies hand tools.
    If anyone is interested see here. https://www.woodworkforums.com/f152/...-planes-235862

  2. #62
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    Strewth that looks good!

    How well has the bluing held up on your older pieces over the years?

  3. #63
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Default

    Here are some final pics of the two blued planes.

    Bailey4.jpg
    7812.jpg

  4. #64
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    Hi Bob, Guys,

    Nice !
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  5. #65
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Default 900 tall with

    I have a 820mm long 12mm diam steel rod I want to blue.
    It won't fit into my fume bluing tank so I'm going to use the H2O2 and salt method.
    To set the blue I need to put it into boiling distilled water for about 20 minutes.
    The apply the H2O2 and salt and boil repeatedly multiple times.
    The container needs to be clean so SS is usually used ie ordinary steel is not the best

    Looking for a way to boil water 820 mm deep or long?
    If push comes to shove I could boil one half of the rod and then the other, Still 400+ mm long. The longest/deepest SS pan I have is about 350mm deep/lonmg.

    A piece of SS pipe ~900 mm with a plugged bottom could easily contain the water but what are the chances of getting the water boiling near the top of the pipe?

    A piece of horizontal SS pipe sliced in half with a couple of heat sources might be the go.
    Any idea what 1m of say 50mm Exhaust pipe or guttering might cost?

    I could also bend up a 1m long trough from a piece of SS eg BB cover, and weld some ends on?

    I can see myself using this again in the future.

    Any suggestions much appreciated.

  6. #66
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    Band heaters?

    4 or 5 perhaps

    The first link I came across.
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1505402133.html

  7. #67
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    Does it need to be boiling water? what if you pass steam through a capped and vented tube containing your steel rod for 20 minutes, would that still convert the Fe2O3 to the desired Fe3O4

  8. #68
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Quote Originally Posted by NedsHead View Post
    Does it need to be boiling water? what if you pass steam through a capped and vented tube containing your steel rod for 20 minutes, would that still convert the Fe2O3 to the desired Fe3O4
    Not sure. Might have to do some experimenting.

  9. #69
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stustoys View Post
    Band heaters?

    4 or 5 perhaps

    The first link I came across.
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1505402133.html

    Yeah I reckon I'd need at least 5, maybe more
    At 240W each that's only 1200W.

    A 50mm ID pipe ~1m long holds about 2L so about domestic kettle size but kettles are usually ~2kW and also use immersion heating whereas the heat from a band heater would have to get through the pipe. If the pipe was well insulated it would eventually boil teh water but would take a lot longer than a kettle.

    I'm now thinking of using two 1200W immersion heaters at either end of a 1m long SS trough?
    Problem is now finding immersion heaters that are long enough. I looked online and the longest 1200W ones I can find are about 200 mm long - double or at least 300 mm long that would be better,

  10. #70
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    Can you send it out to be carbon blacked?

  11. #71
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Quote Originally Posted by pipeclay View Post
    Can you send it out to be carbon blacked?
    I could but I can see myself doing longer objects in the future so its going to be handy to have a longish setup.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post
    Yeah I reckon I'd need at least 5, maybe more
    At 240W each that's only 1200W.

    A 50mm ID pipe ~1m long holds about 2L so about domestic kettle size but kettles are usually ~2kW and also use immersion heating whereas the heat from a band heater would have to get through the pipe. If the pipe was well insulated it would eventually boil teh water but would take a lot longer than a kettle.

    I'm now thinking of using two 1200W immersion heaters at either end of a 1m long SS trough?
    Problem is now finding immersion heaters that are long enough. I looked online and the longest 1200W ones I can find are about 200 mm long - double or at least 300 mm long that would be better,
    He lists up to 290W in 50mm, and offers custom made ones.
    If you're in a hurry you can boil the water in a kettle first
    Heat loss would be way less than a trough wouldn't it?
    Power might be an issue though if the workpiece goes in cold and it needs to be returned to boiling ASAP

    How about an immersion element but still in a vertical pipe?
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32700591791.html. Depending on just how small they can make "B". Or perhaps a straight.
    "700"mm one?
    And it would be cheaper that 5 band heaters!

    Though with the trough you can see whats going on.

  13. #73
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Thanks for the ideas Stu,

    Quote Originally Posted by Stustoys View Post
    He lists up to 290W in 50mm, and offers custom made ones.
    If you're in a hurry you can boil the water in a kettle first
    Heat loss would be way less than a trough wouldn't it?
    Yep, but not that much if the trough was covered.

    Power might be an issue though if the workpiece goes in cold and it needs to be returned to boiling ASAP.
    Yep

    How about an immersion element but still in a vertical pipe?
    Yep - a distinct possibility.

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32700591791.html. Depending on just how small they can make "B". Or perhaps a straight.
    "700"mm one?
    And it would be cheaper that 5 band heaters!.
    Much cheaper, but "B" would need to be much smaller than shown otherwise pipe/water volume becomes too large.

    Swings and roundabouts.

    Somewhere I have an immersion heater that I will be able to play around with if I can find it.

    Though with the trough you can see whats going on.
    correct - that's very handy.

    Keep the ideas coming

    BTW is not just the blackening part of cycle that this would be used for.
    The objects are also heat washed in hot sodium carbonate solution and finished off by 120șC heating in engine oil.

    Here's a batch having their Na2CO3 wash.
    This is my biggest flat SS container (rating pan) and it has a 450mm diagonal but when the 820mm rod is placed on the diagonal only about 350mm gets fully submerged.
    This container nominally holds 4L of liquid and when covered takes ~30 mins to come to a decent roiling boil. When uncovered it never really comes to a full boil.
    Its heated by two hotplates for a total fo 2400W.
    Setup.jpg

    I also have a sort of large SS saucepan/pot that is about 350mm tall.
    Last edited by BobL; 17th Apr 2021 at 10:13 PM.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by NedsHead View Post
    what if you pass steam through a capped and vented tube containing your steel rod for 20 minutes, would that still convert the Fe2O3 to the desired Fe3O4
    Apparently so. This video shows rust bluing a gun barrel with steam in a cheap PVC pipe setup. Tune in at 19:30.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4QOcRTZv2Q
    Chris

  15. #75
    BobL is offline Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack620 View Post
    Apparently so. This video shows rust bluing a gun barrel with steam in a cheap PVC pipe setup. Tune in at 19:30.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4QOcRTZv2Q
    Perfect - I even have the right sort of thick PVC pipe for the job!

    However, I will still need some sort of a hot tank to clean up the work pieces but maybe that can be done manually with such a smooth object as a steel rod.
    Cleaning by boiling in a Na2CO3 solution is more the go for objects with complex shapes and nooks and crannies.
    I will then also still need a tank for the hot oil bath.

    One of the most useful things I saw on that video was the long strand soft carding brush/wheel so I've ordered myself one of those.
    This will save a lot of time as up until now I have been doing that by hand with a soft wire brush or steel wool and it makes a ferkin mess.

    With a wooden hub those soft wire wheels are not designed to run at high speed (plus that would strip of too much of the black oxide) so will runs it at slower speed on my WW lathe and use bellmouth hood extraction which should reduce the amount of black dust this process generates,

    Thanks

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