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  1. #61
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    4,779

    Default Bumping this thread

    Hi all,

    I have since done a little bit with this WIP but haven't taken any pics yet. By the time I get around to posting an update (Going camping in Flinders Ranges for 2 weeks) this thread will have expired so thought I'd bump it to keep it alive....

    Cheers,

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Athelstone, SA 5076
    Posts
    4,255

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by simonl View Post
    Hi all,

    I have since done a little bit with this WIP but haven't taken any pics yet. By the time I get around to posting an update (Going camping in Flinders Ranges for 2 weeks) this thread will have expired so thought I'd bump it to keep it alive....

    Cheers,

    Simon
    have you been able to find your way out of the pound yet
    I want to see some pics and drawings/sketchs etc...no not the pound, the sheet metal folder

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Norwood-ish, Adelaide
    Age
    59
    Posts
    6,540

    Default

    Drawings/ photos of the inspiration are here (Simon was doing a copy then decided to stretch it a bit).
    A folder photo tour
    Not difficult to make, just slow.

    Michael

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    4,779

    Default

    Hi Eskimo,

    A few months back I welded the "wings" or tabs on the leaf of the folder. While I took great care to ensure they did not move during the welding process (which involved multiple passes and preheating the 20mm plate) it none-the-less did not stay straight. I was not overly fussed as my back up plan was to straighten it in my 30 tonne hydraulic press but it didn't even go close to flexing it let alone flattening it. In my troubles I burnt out the motor that drives the hydraulic pump! Something else to mix!


    I'll send some pics of my progress tomorrow.

    Yes, my original plan was to build a 900mm folder similar to Michaels CC folder, a beautifully made Australian piece of manufacturing but Joe Hovel got in my ear and talked me into building a 1200mm folder. That extra 300mm has made a huge difference in the design and material sizes. I have been dealing with pieces of steel that are way outside the work envelope of my humble shed. It has been challenging dealing with 20mm plate to say the least!


    Actually, Joe is not to blame. I'm using a bit of license here. We had a discussion a couple of years ago and he mentioned he wanted to build a 1200mm folder and I thought that sounded like a great idea.


    Michael, as soon as I saw you had commented on this thread I thought "OK here we go" I'm going to cop it again from you for my lack of progress. I'm amazed, you showed restraint!

    Cheers,

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Athelstone, SA 5076
    Posts
    4,255

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael G View Post
    Drawings/ photos of the inspiration are here (Simon was doing a copy then decided to stretch it a bit).
    A folder photo tour
    Not difficult to make, just slow.

    Michael
    thanks Michael

    Simon, I look forward to pics

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    4,779

    Default

    Here are a couple of pics. I haven't done much on it for a few months. It's not the sort of project I can just grind away at everytime I'm in the shed. I find I get better results if I chip away and then procrastinate for a bit.

    The leaf is 20mm x 250mm plate. Most of the other structural elements such as the finger beam and the underside that the sheet rests on will be 20mm plate also although one part will have to be 16mm plate. The steel for this project is a combination of stuff I had laying around and stuff I bought as scrap for around $1 per Kilogram. The leaf is not "perfectly" straight, has a small bow in it which I mostly removed but I have mitigated any issues it will have on creating an uneven fold by attaching a piece of 40x40 BMS in top. This piece is as straight as an arrow and will create the fold. You can see it in the pics sitting on top of the leaf.

    The pins holding the leaf at each end have not been finalised and so the leaf is just held for the pic by some off cut steel inserted in the bushes. The eccentric you can see at one end will obviously attach to the shaft via a keyway and attach to an identical eccentric at the other end. The fingers will be made from 20mm thick M200 which I also aquired for $1/Kg and be 100mm long, producing a box of about 75mm depth max.

    The leaf can be adjusted to allow for varying thickness of material and also to produce various radius in the fold. There is also adjustment for/backward of the finger beam as it is also supported with a small eccentric shaft.

    20160603_112400.jpg20160603_112515.jpg

    Sorry about the sideways shot.

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  7. #67
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Oz
    Age
    73
    Posts
    459

    Default

    Was this build ever finalised, can't find anymore on it with the search function. I'd be interested in seeing the finished product.

  8. #68
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Near Bendigo, Victoria, AUS
    Age
    72
    Posts
    3,102

    Default

    Sadly my build never got beyond collecting all the materials needed and cutting them to size. Life's and the shed's other challenges took priority...
    I have not heard how far Simon got. I suspect he would have proudly shown off the finished project - if it progressed there....
    Cheers, Joe
    retired - less energy, more time to contemplate projects and more shed time....

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Oz
    Age
    73
    Posts
    459

    Default

    Hmmm, same with me, I can get a 600mm pan and box brake for $370, so it hardly seems worthwhile continuing with my build.

  10. #70
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    4,779

    Default

    Hi there. Thanks for showing the interest. Same same as Joe. Other things got in the way but it still sits on my mind and i have not stopped the project perminently. I still envisage resuming and finishing it.

    What annoying is the number of times i could have used it!

    Simon

    Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  11. #71
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    4,779

    Default

    Well,

    It's been a while since I did any sort of update on this. It became on of those projects that sat in the corner and gathered dust as I lost interest/got frustrated.

    In truth, I choose a project that was both beyond my experience/capability and that of my machines.

    Fast forward a few more years and a few things have happened;

    (1) Got better at building stuff, including welding large pieces of steel

    (2) Got a bigger mill

    (3) Stopped using my old clunker AC arc welder and bought a nice little DC welder. So much nicer!

    (4) Have since had countless times when a folder would have been awesome to have!

    Anyway so I made a committment to have this thing pretty much (see the sneaky disclaimer there) done and dusted during our home detention here in Vic.

    So heres a pic of it to date.

    There's a few things yet to do as you can see. The top beam that holds the fingers has just been test fitted and held with clamps.

    I have one more piece of 16mm plate. Not sure if I will use it to box out the top finger beam or use it as support under the horizontal beam. Never used a folder before so I'm not sure which will need it the most. I may do some folding and see what deflection is like and go from there.

    Thinking of placing a couple of screw adjustable truss things on the finger beam and under the base too. See how we go.

    The fingers will be clamped onto the beam with two bolts per finger and a rebated clamp on opposite side.

    Also need grease nipples for all rotating parts.

    Cheers,

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  12. #72
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Vermont 3133 Victoria
    Posts
    248

    Default

    Gday Simon,
    About 20 years back I scored a John Heine 4' pan break from work. We used to do a lot of DC power install in the telephone exchanges, large battery banks, dc RECTIFIERS, 50 volt but massive amps. We would install copper busbar ranging from 2 " to 6", we would use very solid benders to make it fit. Long story short some knuckle head tried to bend a 2" by 1/2 " copper bar in the pan break, broke one 2" finger and one of the cast hinges for the folder.
    Loaded it onto a canter truck and off to my place, Fabed up a new hinge out of solid MS plate all good.
    Cheers
    Bruce

  13. #73
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    4,779

    Default

    Yea that's a great score Bruce. Nice pan brake they make too.

    Ok course you could have offered to fix it for your workplace.... Sheet Metal Folder WIP

    Simon

    Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  14. #74
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    1,105

    Default

    I'm sorta on the fence whether I should make one of these or not, have been thinking about making one for around 10 years now.

    Was thinking whether using a hydraulic press with press brake attachment would be a more versatile thing, but probably won't be as user friendly as a dedicated pan brake that can clamp the material.

    Looks like the pan brake will take up a bit of real estate as well, which I don't really have at the moment.

    Did you mostly follow the original plans with your design?

    I reckon I would have all the materials I need to build one, probably should bit the bullet and hope I don't regret it

  15. #75
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    4,779

    Default

    Hi VC,

    I think if I knew what was involved at the start I probably wouldn't have built a folder.

    Certainly not one this size. In reality a 600 or 900mm folder would have been more realistic.

    Some of the material I have had to cut and machine has been big and heavy. Its been a real slog. Much of it has not been enjoyable to be honest, just too big. Some of the heavy sections of steel was gifted to me 15 years ago and it sat in the dirt for most of it.

    The design was inspired by a thread by Michael G.

    http://www.woodworkforums.com/...176...ml#post1700922

    I loosely followed his CC folder which I thought was very well made. Michael was kind enough to send me some detailed drawings of his folder which I printed out and put in a project folder.

    Michaels folder is 900mm. Some time later Joe Hovel suggested I make a 1200mm folder, which sounded like a good idea. So then I stretched mine out to 1200mm and beefed up areas where I could to cope with the extra forces.

    You can see in the latest photo that there is a seemingly unnecessary hole in the end plates of the finger beam. Thats from a change of plans earlier this year.

    Originally the top beam was only going to be able to pivot up and down with allowance for different material thickness. However there was no adjustment forward or back in order to move the fingers forward or rearward to allow for material thickness.

    So, I then changed the rear pivot pins to an offset eccentric so allow for some adjustment, maybe 5mm or so.

    I never really liked it. Also once it was all assembled and welded up, I would never have been able to remove the top.

    So a changed it (again) to a sliding pin arrangement with an adjustment knob at the rear. Most commercially made pan brakes have this design nowadays.

    It also makes alignment of the beam and fingers during final assembly and welding much more forgiving.

    Cheers,

    Simon

    Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

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