Thread: Horizontal vs bridgeport type milling machines

I was planning on buying a chinese bridgeport type milling machine in the future but have come across an old horizontal milling machine with a vertical head thats pretty cheap. Assuming its in ok condition are there any major downsides to the horizontal machines in terms of versatility compared to the bridgeport?

The biggest issue seems to be the fact its got a fixed quill on the vertical head and less head to table clearance... Is this going to be a big PITA?

Is this going to be a big PITA?

Sometimes, but if the machine is cheeeep then snaffle it and get the brigeport style also

tiz always better to have 2 mills than one

I would say there are downsides either way. It really depends on what you want to to do. If you don't need the machine for lots of drilling them the fixed quill won't really matter. The biggest thing is just how much more rigid the universal will be over the Bridgeport clone. The big uni's make the Chinese machines look like soggy noodles. The one thing that may be a downside is the top end speed may be lacking.
Cheers,
Ew

Originally Posted by shedhappens

Is this going to be a big PITA?

Sometimes, but if the machine is cheeeep then snaffle it and get the brigeport style also

tiz always better to have 2 mills than one

Totally agree, good advice.

Dave

A turret mill is infinitely more variable.. It is no surprise that turret style mills today are one of the few manual machines that still get sold in reasonable numbers...

With the addition of a right angle head and horizontal arbour and supports it will do light horizontal milling...

If I had the choice of one milling machine it would be a turret mill...

Would definitely prefer a turret mill but its a case of wait for what I want or jump in now and start milling stuff. I would like a big bugger so a new turret mill seems to be around the $10k mark versus the one I'm thinking about which is $1500 and is big.

Will probably still get a turret mill one day though...

Originally Posted by .RC.

With the addition of a right angle head and horizontal arbour and supports it will do light horizontal milling...

Just curious what you mean by this RC... looking at the machines they appear at least as rigid as a turret mill.

Originally Posted by .RC.

A turret mill is infinitely more variable.. It is no surprise that turret style mills today are one of the few manual machines that still get sold in reasonable numbers...

With the addition of a right angle head and horizontal arbour and supports it will do light horizontal milling...

If I had the choice of one milling machine it would be a turret mill...

More flexible, yes. Floppy as a fresh cow pat also.

I agree - except for the last bit, maybe. Depending on the mill. Something like a 2+ tonne Kondia or Lagun machine with 5HP and an ISO 40 spindle, maybe.

I think your definition of 'light horizontal milling' may differ somewhat from mine, also. My baby H/V mill can bury a 1" wide side & face cutter 1.5" deep into A36 plate in a single pass and that's without bothering to use the overarm to knee braces. I would never try that on my B/port.

Anyway, depends on what you want to do, as always. If you want to run 3mm slot drills and smaller, an old horizontal mill is going to be painful and not the right choice. If you plan to do lots of drilling in the mill, ditto. Boring, depends if the horizontal has power Z feed or not. My big one does, the small one doesn't.

If you have no mill and the available space, grab the horizontal now and worry about the turret mill later. I keep thinking of fitting a vertical head to the overarm of my Victoria mill - most of the flexibility of a turret mill but a lot more rigidity and power feeds on all 3 axes. OK there's no nod and no turret pivot but I rarely if ever use those features anyway.

Personally I would not give up having a horizontal mill for all sorts of reasons.

PDW

There is another option.. The best of both worlds you could say.... Buy a turret mill and use it as in the attached photo for when you need the spindle horizontal.....

Originally Posted by Dave J

Totally agree, good advice.

Dave

Go for it buy it and learn to use it then go for a more modern machine later plenty of advice here in this forum.If it is a uni mill ie table swings either way go for it as well. most of these old dinosaurs never went hard enough or fast enough to wear out.
Cutters are not cheap but you can make a lot of tooling cheaply got a fly cutter here for cylinder heads made from land rover fly wheel single point tool.I doubled the speed here of one here as you will find the vert head will run slower than the hori spindle,If it is 200 300 dollars about scrap price jump on it and save it from becoming a kia daewoo or a hyundai.You wont regret it. Cheers John.Forgot to mention if it is in good condition and you know its past always pay extra as asked never know what comes out of cupboards if the vendor gets his price,especially if he knows its going to a good home.Some old men are very passionate about their machines that have been good servants to them. John

I have a small horizontal with vertical head (only weighs about 1.2 tonne) and the only regret that I have is that it has not got a quill on it. I've been regretting it for the last 5 or so years without doing anything about it, so it can't be a very big regret. One day I might try and find a turret mill head and graft it on.
Turret type machines are popular but for metal removal the more solid the machine the better. If you are doing light stuff with small holes etc then a turret machine will do but for general milling I'd take a horizontal with v/head. I used it the other day to drill some 6mm holes and did not have an issue with it. For small stuff I have a little X-Y table that goes on the drill press.

Michael

Originally Posted by Michael G

I have a small horizontal with vertical head (only weighs about 1.2 tonne) and the only regret that I have is that it has not got a quill on it. I've been regretting it for the last 5 or so years without doing anything about it, so it can't be a very big regret. One day I might try and find a turret mill head and graft it on.
Turret type machines are popular but for metal removal the more solid the machine the better. If you are doing light stuff with small holes etc then a turret machine will do but for general milling I'd take a horizontal with v/head. I used it the other day to drill some 6mm holes and did not have an issue with it. For small stuff I have a little X-Y table that goes on the drill press.

Michael

Grafted a turret head on one of my old Denbeigh u mill works ok and swivels 360 and no nodding head the only problem is the no 2 morse taper gets tight on me some times but made a puller that works ok with the proverbial tap with the ''knockrometer'' used it to line bore too with uni div head tail stock packed up.Home of what turns up at the back door here.Every day present some challenge and head scratch. John.

Well I went and had a look tonite and bought it. Its a parkson no.3... bloody huge... google reckons 3.5 tonnes. Condition seems average but I'm happy for $1500.

Comes with a few horizontal arbors and the arbor supports as well as some other tooling and a vice. Not exactly sure how I'm going to power it and not looking forward to trying to move it but it should be a bit of fun...Wahoo.


parkson no3.jpeg

Originally Posted by gallegos

Well I went and had a look tonite and bought it. Its a parkson no.3... bloody huge... google reckons 3.5 tonnes. Condition seems average but I'm happy for $1500.

Comes with a few horizontal arbors and the arbor supports as well as some other tooling and a vice. Not exactly sure how I'm going to power it and not looking forward to trying to move it but it should be a bit of fun...Wahoo.


parkson no3.jpeg

Well Done.
She sure does look big, whats the table size like? I only looked on lathes.co.uk but he only lists the no2 sizes. There won't be much stopping her....
Love to see some more pics when you get her home.
I take it you don't have 3 phase?

Cheers,
Ew

Hello Gallegos,
That is one serious piece of gear! Looks like a close relative of my Cincinnati No.2 Universal. Has a similar vertical head as well. My Cinci also weighs in at 3.5 tonnes, and has 5hp driving it. Should move a lot of metal fast, specially in horizontal setup. Believe in wartime production they had an ampmeter with a red line at max. rated motor current, and the instruction to operators was to "keep it on the red line!" Need to spend more time getting familiar with my old beast. Good luck with yours, lots of entertainment ahead. Combustor.

Hi Gallegos,
Nice Mill definitely a good buy. As others have said very handy for heavy cuts and the Vertical Head can be mounted on a swing arm so easy to mount when needed. You could graft a Turret Head on to it if you want but if you have the room look out for a Turret Mill to add later to your Machine Shop.
As for powering your Mill I attach a Motor Ratings guide so you can look at what you have for your incoming power and if you need to upgrade your feed to the Mill.

Regards,
Keith_W.