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  1. #1
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    Default Setting up a New Mill

    A couple of questions. I recall reading some time ago a thread that suggested using hydraulic oil in the gear box of machinery. The instructions from my new Mill does not mention anything about oil grade. All it says is "fill the oil to the gearbox.....".

    Suggestions?

    When bolting the Mill down to the stand with the tray in between would a bead of silicon be the normal way to seal the mill base to the tray? I thought about a strip of rubber all way around but then thought it would introduce suspension which would not be desirable.

    Dean

  2. #2
    Dave J Guest

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    Hydraulic oil will do the job fine. As for silicon I would do it while you have the chance, that way if you do run coolant latter it will save the hassle of doing it then.

    Dave

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave J View Post
    Hydraulic oil will do the job fine. As for silicon I would do it while you have the chance, that way if you do run coolant latter it will save the hassle of doing it then.

    Dave
    Thanks Dave. After considerable search I found my 20l drum of Castrol AWH46 that was left over from my wood splitter, in full view in middle of my shed. It is nearly full. I think I topped a long ram jack with it and that is all.

    I have yet to make the coolant tray for the mill cabinet. The cabinet is 1230mm X 610mm which is slightly shorter lengthways than the full footprint including X axis movement. This is because of available materials and me being not exactly a spendthrift. I am wondering whether to make the tray the full cabinet size or the same size as the ones included with the optional cabinet. I still have to cover the top of the cabinet anyway.

    Dean

  4. #4
    Dave J Guest

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    I would go the size of the cabinet and maybe out forward a little. When using coolant it will run along the table and drip off the ends.
    I have sheet aluminum here and am going to make up a tray for my mill with fold out wings, so when I use coolant it catches it all.

    Dave

  5. #5
    Ueee's Avatar
    Ueee is offline Blacksmith, Cabinetmaker, Machinist, Messmaker
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    Default

    Hi Dean,
    I find if using a vice it runs through the ways of the vice and comes out near the handle usually onto the y axis handwheel and onto the floor, it also gets into the t slots on the front edge of the table and gets to the end of the table and onto the floor that way. I drilled a couple of holes into the bottom of the t slot in the middle of the table so it would drain. The HM50's trays are too small IMHO.

    Got some pics of ya new toy?
    1915 17"x50" LeBlond heavy duty Lathe, 24" Queen city shaper, 1970's G Vernier FV.3.TO Universal Mill, 1958 Blohm HFS 6 surface grinder, 1942 Rivett 715 Lathe, 14"x40" Antrac Lathe, Startrite H225 Bandsaw, 1949 Hercus Camelback Drill press, 1947 Holbrook C10 Lathe.

  6. #6
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    I put in about 10hrs today working on the cabinet. It is now a complete box shape with centre supports at mill base width. I now need to work on adjustable legs which are going to be 25mm all thread, 6mm plate foot and turned socket welded to the foot for rotation. I will weld nuts inside the frame to screw the all thread into and have a lock nut. I have not decided whether to use the 25mm for all 8 legs or use smaller all thread for the outer legs which are not supporting the mill itself. The problem is that the next size down that I have is 12mm and I was not sure if that would be good enough. I would prefer 16mm. The 25mm came from work. It was an unused frame for mounting something on after it was concreted in the ground. Four all thread rods about 300mm apart in a square and about 650mm high (long). All thread reo so to speak. Funny how some contractors throw money around. We have supports hanging from a roof at work that are made of all thread. They supports piping and cable trays. About 16ft of all thread for each support.

    I would have taken photos and posted them tonight but I was completely stuffed when I finished. I will take photos on the morrow to show how far I have got. The mill is still in its box on the trailer although I have removed the top and one side to look at it. My hope is to get the cabinet finished and transfer the mill to it before the trailer is needed urgently for some other job. I could slide it onto an 8 x 5 trailer we have which is not registered but that should have our fire fighting tank / pump on it so I have left it for now.

    I may get the mill onto the cabinet tomorrow but I am not betting on it. The legs can actually wait untill it is in the shed. They are only going to make it harder to move anyway. I only need to weld the nuts in ready. I also need to make up the coolant tray, and to find some more angle to fit runners for 3 drawers which are going to be at the top of the cabinet. I also need to fit the back panel on before it goes in the shed. All the rest I should be able to do after.

    Dean

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    Ok I took a picture. This is where it is at now except that I have cut out a sheet the right size to bend up a coolant tray in aluminium. Now I have to find a long straight edge to bend it over. First I will bend 20mm of the edge downwards 180 deg to form a clean rounded edge and add some strength, then bend 50mm up at 45 deg. This is the same way I did my bandsaw tray which work fine except when I poured soluble oil in the tray yesterday and it blocked the filter and mostly filled the tray, I noticed a drip from the back left corner so I will have to clean this and give it some more silastic.

    100_0144.jpg

    I went with unistrut instead of angle for the drawer runners. These will be easier to prevent the drawers from falling out like the ones under my bench that I made a while ago. They need a stop. As the drawers will sit on top of the unistrut the rear nylon wheel will hold the drawer up untill it is almost right out. I went with 16mm legs for the outside ones. In the picture you can see how the weight of the mill will be directly down on the centre four legs. I was trying to keep the 16mm all thread for fencing fittings such as hinges but decided I could bite the bullet and buy some.

    Dean

  8. #8
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    Hi Dean,

    Stand is looking good!

    WRT lubricant for your mill, I too wondered what type of oil to use. My lathe recommends hydraulic oil and I always wondered why hydraulic oil. A year or so ago a member on this forum came up with a reason which is the best I have heard. They stated that engine oil has additives that suspend particles such as metal and other impurities so that it gets carried away into the filter and away from the motor. Hydraulic oil does not, so metal particles will fall out of suspension and collect at the bottom and not be passed through the bearings again. Probably more important with lathes that have their spindle bearings splash lubricated with the same oil. For what it's worth, I use the same oil for both my mill/drill and lathe, either 68 or 46.

    Cheers,

    Simon

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonl View Post
    Hi Dean,

    Stand is looking good!

    WRT lubricant for your mill, I too wondered what type of oil to use. My lathe recommends hydraulic oil and I always wondered why hydraulic oil. A year or so ago a member on this forum came up with a reason which is the best I have heard. They stated that engine oil has additives that suspend particles such as metal and other impurities so that it gets carried away into the filter and away from the motor. Hydraulic oil does not, so metal particles will fall out of suspension and collect at the bottom and not be passed through the bearings again. Probably more important with lathes that have their spindle bearings splash lubricated with the same oil. For what it's worth, I use the same oil for both my mill/drill and lathe, either 68 or 46.

    Cheers,

    Simon
    Thanks for that information Simon. Very useful to know. Nothing achieved today. I had some other work to do for SWMBO and somehow (I have no idea) my crook knee locked up and when I unlocked it I was in some pain so I finished that job and gave up for the day. Sigh. This sort of thing never happened when I was younger.

    Dean

  10. #10
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    I have removed the top part of the crate so I can see and play with the mill. The coolant tray is about ready. I am clearing space to position mill. A big job. I have decided to leave the mill where it is until I have the position ready for its location.

    I have thought of another couple of questions. The drawbar I have measured at M14. This appears to be an unusual size. None of the collet holders I have been looking at have an M14 thread. I think it may be better to rethread to M12. Collet chucks I have been looking at are available in MT4 with M16 drawbar thread and MT3 with M12 drawbar thread. The mill is MT4. The new lathe is MT6. An MT3 chuck will require an adaptor which has a clearance hole for the drawbar. I have not seen one of these yet. There appears to be a 16mm clearance hole thru the spindle. Maybe the best option is to make an M16 drawbar and keep the M12 in case I get something that needs that size. Comments?

    Regarding collets I have been looking at ER40 sets of 24 and due to the price of these I am wondering if I could get away with a 15pc set or even get ER32. As this is the first mill I have owned I am not sure what I am likely to need in the future. I can get an 18pc ER32 set for $114 Full 18pcs(18 size ) ER32 PRECISION SPRING COLLET set For CNC milling lathe tool | eBay compared to the 24 pc ER40 set from CTC at $181, both including freight. I guess it is possible that I would want to hold work pieces up to 26mm diam as apposed to only 20mm diam for ER32. Comments?

    Dean

  11. #11
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    Default

    Bison make a reducing sleeve, possibly others as well.

  12. #12
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    Hi Dean,

    It's always difficult to predict what tooling you may need and it can be frustrating not having the tooling when you need it. Until I bought my 45 size mill I had zero experience with milling so I really had no idea what my future needs where. I ended up hedging my bets each way. I bought a complete ER32 set and collet and just in case I need something bigger in the future, I also bought an ER40 collet. That way if ever I need something bigger than 20mm I can just order an individual collet. No use buying both ER32 and ER40 sets as 90% of them double up.

    As it turns out, I can't see myself using or needing bigger than 20mm on the mill. Given the type and size of my mill, I need to be realistic of what I can cut with it. However, I may need the ER40 if ever I wish to hold something in the lathe, which is where it will get used.

    My mill has MT4 and my drawbar is M16 as is all my tooling for my mill. Keep the M12 in case and make or buy an M16, since most, if not all MT4 tooling will have an M16 thread for the drawbar.

    Cheers & Merry Christmas,

    Simon

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonl View Post
    Hi Dean,

    It's always difficult to predict what tooling you may need and it can be frustrating not having the tooling when you need it. Until I bought my 45 size mill I had zero experience with milling so I really had no idea what my future needs where. I ended up hedging my bets each way. I bought a complete ER32 set and collet and just in case I need something bigger in the future, I also bought an ER40 collet. That way if ever I need something bigger than 20mm I can just order an individual collet. No use buying both ER32 and ER40 sets as 90% of them double up.

    As it turns out, I can't see myself using or needing bigger than 20mm on the mill. Given the type and size of my mill, I need to be realistic of what I can cut with it. However, I may need the ER40 if ever I wish to hold something in the lathe, which is where it will get used.

    My mill has MT4 and my drawbar is M16 as is all my tooling for my mill. Keep the M12 in case and make or buy an M16, since most, if not all MT4 tooling will have an M16 thread for the drawbar.

    Cheers & Merry Christmas,

    Simon

    Thanks Simon. I have just read my previous thread about "Milling Cutter Choices" and found the following information


    Hi Dean,

    I have a ER32 collet set, ER32 to MT4 collet, ER40 to MT4 collet, 50mm Boring head, 63mm TCT face mill and a MT4 to MT5 all from CTC tools. I have found their quality to be pretty good for the price.

    I always cringe when I see gold coloured cutting tools. (drill bits etc) I bought a set about 20 years ago when I saw an add and believed the sales pitch (this was before I realised you get what you pay for) With the first use I was more incline to start a fire than create a hole!

    Fencing wire and cheese come to mind as descriptions for these type of tools!

    Simon

    LOL.

    I have pretty much decided to go with the same choice as this except I am not sure about the ER40 chuck at this stage. YSTools aka Onlineseller68 has a 63mm face mill for $120 including 10 inserts and free postage. This is cheaper than the 50mm from CTC. Also I need an MT6 to MT4 adaptor and these are a bit harder to find. This is for the new lathes headstock. Your mill has the same spindle size as mine so I guess 20mm will be sufficient for me as well.

    Pipeclay. Thanks, I will look them up.

    Merry Christmas to all

    Dean

  14. #14
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    My lathe is a MT5 and I also have a MT4 to MT5 adapter. MT6, you must have a decent sized lathe!

    Edit: I see I already mentioned this!

    Simon

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonl View Post
    My lathe is a MT5 and I also have a MT4 to MT5 adapter. MT6, you must have a decent sized lathe!

    Edit: I see I already mentioned this!

    Simon
    My new lathe is 16 X 40 I think it is rated as or 410 X 1000 in metric. It is a bit bigger than my current 400 X 750. The best thing about having an MT6 spindle bore taper is that this means it can have a 52mm spindle bore which is much bigger than my current lathe. Although there seems to be a huge jump in cost for MT6 fittings it does have an advantage. The new lathe also has a micrometer adjustable style of taper attachment which is a big serious bit of equipment so I really don't need to worry too much about buying an adapter.

    It was funny how I found the quote I copied from the previous thread. I am trying to finalise what I want to order from CTC as I will soon have the mill operational. I looked at this previous thread because I knew some recommendations were made as to milling cutters so I refreshed my memory so to speak. While doing so I saw your post which was very relevant to this thread.

    Lying in bed this morning I realised that the main impediment to extending my workshop has mostly been removed. We had a large poplar tree behind it. Trunk about 750mm diam. It has been cut down and finally removed. The stump needs digging out however. With 3 chainsaws I could probably do this. There is a small lean-to I built on the end as a storage area and a small rainwater tank (very old) next to this. Removing these I could now extend the shed out to the back fence if I want, a distance of maybe 10m. The tree was always the problem before. That might give me room to move and space for vehicular access as well. This shed used to be a garage but a house extension with raised concrete floor put paid to that many years ago.

    Enough off topic dribble.

    Dean

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