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Thread: Dividing plate for 127 divisions
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1st Jun 2013, 08:07 AM #16Senior Member
- Join Date
- Oct 2011
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- Newstead Victoria
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- 459
Nice Job.
Hi Ewen,nice job you made of the gears and adaptors.
The Mars Great Scot here has ''serious dentition '' problems.Think its had too many Mars Bars.Both the 20 teeth on tumblers are stripped minus 3-4 the other 15 gone must have been a mighty stack.I have both the 20t on feed shaft and lead screw.Back gears are both missing a couple too.Must have been a hard chuck.The spindle drive hub has a tooth off too.looking at it is it a press fit on the end of the cone pulley?The quadrant is missing too and if its not too much bother a rough sketch please when you find time.Is planned to raise the head stock up 2 inches so will have to extend 1 arm of the quadrant any way.Could you also please list the complete gear set missing a few.
With the 20 teeth gears got a bar of cast meehanite here and was planning to knock up a foot length of 20 teeth.got a cutter here so not a problem can cut off a piece for you.
Only reason I wanted to re furb this machine is its planned for the old touring coach here and with the large saddle will be good for a multi purpose machine boring milling etc without being without a machining facility.If I don't use a lathe daily get withdrawl pains.
Some time in its life it has had a light blue hammertone finish yuk! got to go for a solid colour any idea of orig colour as the base colour is gone.
Back to the pins you made have you ever seen the Drummond way they anchor their gears ? Is a knurled shaft with a split in in it and expanded it just pushes into a hollow in the gear spindles.An easy idea to disconnect drive line.Spur gears have no end thrust just radial so they never get out of mesh.
From what I see these machines are pretty robust and am sure will take a 2 inch raise up.Only thing is the headstock cones was considering tapered rollers and larger bore in spindle but is a big job.Dont know but is the feel of old machines their past and what they have made makes you reflect when using them. Cheers John.
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1st Jun 2013, 10:26 AM #17Philomath in training
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- Oct 2011
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- Norwood-ish, Adelaide
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- 59
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John, I tried the parting off length of geared bar stock thing and found that I got annoying burrs on the sides of the teeth that then took some time to clean up. My suggestion would be to part the blanks to thickness and then thread them on a mandrel before cutting the teeth.
Ewan, please let us know how those plastic gears go (especially the small ones). I occasionally think about making up plastic change gears but I'm concerned about how durable they would be. It would be good to have some feedback.
Michael
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1st Jun 2013, 02:21 PM #18Most Valued Member
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- Jun 2007
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- sydney ( st marys )
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Any particular reason why the gears were not chamfered prior to finish parting.
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1st Jun 2013, 03:31 PM #19Senior Member
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- Oct 2011
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- Newstead Victoria
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- 459
Hi Michael was going to gash all the length of root depth with a slitting saw to ease the pain on the gear cutter and was my idea too to bevel the lead in before parting was going to bandsaw then no worries with ''dags'' Cheers John.ps got 2 mills here so can set up either cutter.
Last edited by j.ashburn; 1st Jun 2013 at 03:33 PM. Reason: more to add
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1st Jun 2013, 05:35 PM #20Senior Member
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- Jan 2010
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- Perth
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- 119
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1st Jun 2013, 07:15 PM #21
Hi John,
Looks like Mark sorted some pics out, i really can't tell you what gears the machine should have come with as mine has a metric leadscrew and some of the gears i have definitely where not originals. I am actually starting to think that my machine was converted to metric at some stage......i forgot to take a pic of why, but will do tomorrow, its not good......
If you need more dimensions on the banjo let me know, just having made the spindle for it i know the grooves are 10mm wide and the arms are 25mm thick.
Hi Michael,
I'm really interested in how they will last too, obviously the 30t will go well before the 120.....I may not be using them for feed though, i'm still thinking on that one.
Cheers
Ew1915 17"x50" LeBlond heavy duty Lathe, 24" Queen city shaper, 1970's G Vernier FV.3.TO Universal Mill, 1958 Blohm HFS 6 surface grinder, 1942 Rivett 715 Lathe, 14"x40" Antrac Lathe, Startrite H225 Bandsaw, 1949 Hercus Camelback Drill press, 1947 Holbrook C10 Lathe.
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1st Jun 2013, 09:23 PM #22Senior Member
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- Oct 2011
- Location
- Newstead Victoria
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- 459
Hi Mark,many thanks for the pics and help.Can fabricate that quadrant from the pics as have to make 1 leg longer if i raise up the centre height.Will check out that colour too although battle ship grey is not my favorite colour.Re the gears are there any duplicates of those numbers?If I go to the trouble of making gears will make extras as it is easy to cut more when you are tooled up.The other thing is I must check the leadscrew as got an idea it may be metric??? iis quite a fine tpi like 10 -12tpi will measure in daylight and check.are there any serial numbers so far havent seen any.Thankyou once again for your prompt reply and co operation.
Hi Ewan,firstly an apology mis spelt your name.Many thanks too for your help and hopefully another Mars gets up and running.The previous owners fed it too many Mars bars and were quite brutal.Abuse of tools really makes me wince.Saddle has a broken out tee bolt slot at the rear looks like was the top slide set over or a rear parting tool mounted broke it out.Thats fixable and some cast rods with some copper sheeting will build it up.not a bother but is an eye sore.''white ants'' caused by ill thinking people in striped aprons.Re skim it and improve its surface.Need some scraping skills like you blokes who did the course.i do like the idea with the tapered gib.
Will keep you posted on further updates better start to learn how to upload pics.Many thanks save the Mars bars for the kids
Cheers to all John.
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1st Jun 2013, 09:45 PM #23
My Serial # is on the right hand end of the front flat way, 2 separate numbers if i remember right, but one may be from the ministry of munitions. My leadscrew is 3.5mm square thread, 3mm ACME on the cross (but the dial is graduated with 50 main divs, giving .12 of dia) and the compound is just a standard M10 thread . I know the leadscrew can't be original as it is made in 2 pieces which separated just today, like i said i need to take a pic.....
Some smartarse decided to swing something thicker than the gap one day so they cut 10mm off the end of the bed ways, other than that it is in overall ok condition, except for the huge amount of wear that was on the slides before i scraped it.
Cheers
Ew1915 17"x50" LeBlond heavy duty Lathe, 24" Queen city shaper, 1970's G Vernier FV.3.TO Universal Mill, 1958 Blohm HFS 6 surface grinder, 1942 Rivett 715 Lathe, 14"x40" Antrac Lathe, Startrite H225 Bandsaw, 1949 Hercus Camelback Drill press, 1947 Holbrook C10 Lathe.
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2nd Jun 2013, 12:17 PM #24Senior Member
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- Jan 2010
- Location
- Perth
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- 119
G'day John, the duplicate gear is 30. Ueee suggested the serial number on the right hand end of the bed - correct, unless (like me) you've surface ground the bed, therefore another location for the serial number is on the tailstock above the eccentric lever lock (assuming your tailstock matches the bed). My leadscrew is 8tpi - I'd like to know how Ewan did metric! cheers, Mark
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3rd Jun 2013, 08:03 PM #25Senior Member
- Join Date
- Oct 2011
- Location
- Newstead Victoria
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- 459
John here,checked a few things out on the Mars G S today.
the lead screw is 8 tpi.
Found the serial numbers tailstock was sitting on it 355 matching t/s no too.
Hunting through the skungy l blue hammer tone [owner refurbished] paint on the tail stock found paint like an indian red to maroon colour down to bare metal is only primer so red the orig colour was.
Measured the spindle and found about .001 in the middle of shaft on gear end [l h end] and 0.0015 -0.002 on the large shaft [chuck end].Slight galling on both more so chuck end and white metal in cones has fared better with the boundary lubrication.has had grease nipples added so be back to drip oilers or oil cups prob the latter as i never forget my pre flight checks.
looks like 7/8 hollow spindle or abt 22mm end has been burred and needs to be re shaped.
As I did say earlier the use for this was to be a travelling companion in the old coach and the more i do look and clean it up its not a bad thing. I love old machines and think this 1 worthy of the effort.has been sneered at by a few i suppose because of it's 6x4 trailer blue hue and looks folorn.
1 thing didnt mention is the cover where the sliding 20 tooth gear goes is missing and the gear is loose out in the bits box that came with it. not sure on the connect up assuming [that word] the 120 tooth gear is for fine feed off the quadrant. the other assumption is that the 20 tooth slips in and out to engage. what's got me stumped is the long key way in the power feed shaft.
All help received gratefully. Cheers John.
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3rd Jun 2013, 08:14 PM #26
Long key in the feed shaft is for the gear that drives the worm that drives the feeds to key into. I always n eeded to double compound my gearing to get a decent slow feed, but the biggest ci gear I had was 70t. Using 30-120/35-127 I get .14mm per rev long feed, cross is much much slower. I have no guards at all, bearings are bronze in steel front and bronze in brass rear. Front had barely any bronze left. I had no gears to drive the feed shaft at all, had to buy some. Worse thing is mt in spindle has runnout, but nose is ok, I think my bore is only 20mm
Cheers,
Ew1915 17"x50" LeBlond heavy duty Lathe, 24" Queen city shaper, 1970's G Vernier FV.3.TO Universal Mill, 1958 Blohm HFS 6 surface grinder, 1942 Rivett 715 Lathe, 14"x40" Antrac Lathe, Startrite H225 Bandsaw, 1949 Hercus Camelback Drill press, 1947 Holbrook C10 Lathe.
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3rd Jun 2013, 10:32 PM #27Senior Member
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- Jan 2010
- Location
- Perth
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- 119
Evening gents, Eweee's answered the query about the long keyway - yes, it is for the power feed, and it is engaged by sliding a knurled sleeve at the left hand end. I checked the diam of my spindle is the same as yours. Spindle bearing adjustment is done by screwed adjustment rings outboard of the headstock with a 'C' spanner (on the left and right hand of the headstock). I note Eweee's comment about brass bearing shell. I'd thought mine were bronze lined with Babbitt metal. You mention oil cups - I had a set of originals which were small metal screwed items and I originally wicked them with pipecleaners but replaced them with visiguage style. There are a couple of other threads on this site which feature Great Scot http://www.woodworkforums.com/f65/mars-atlas-lathe-restoration-141925/
http://www.woodworkforums.com/f65/mars-bar-no-mars-lathe-124508/
http://www.woodworkforums.com/f65/adjusting-replacing-babbit-bearings-mars-great-scot-lathe-brisbane-134688/ This last one has pics of my oilers and supplier. Look forward to hearing more of your progress. cheers, Mark
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3rd Jun 2013, 11:00 PM #28
Here is the pic of my leadscrew.....well i should say screws
The worst is all the endfloat is dealt with at the RH end and the join is about a 1/4 of the way from the right, so the rest of the screw is just floating....
Make sure when you adjust the bearings to shim the slit and tighten, this may be common knowledge but it wasn't to me and doing this made a big difference.
http://www.woodworkforums.com/f65/th...lathes-169007/Last edited by Ueee; 3rd Jun 2013 at 11:44 PM. Reason: added link
1915 17"x50" LeBlond heavy duty Lathe, 24" Queen city shaper, 1970's G Vernier FV.3.TO Universal Mill, 1958 Blohm HFS 6 surface grinder, 1942 Rivett 715 Lathe, 14"x40" Antrac Lathe, Startrite H225 Bandsaw, 1949 Hercus Camelback Drill press, 1947 Holbrook C10 Lathe.
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4th Jun 2013, 12:06 AM #29Senior Member
- Join Date
- Jan 2010
- Location
- Perth
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- 119
Thanks - I've never seen that before - trying to work out what is holding it together - was it pinned with an internal shaft? You're right your thread form is also totally diff - Acme, rather an mine - pic. What's the solution? Hope this doesn't mean it's screwed DSC00596.jpgDSC00597.jpg By the way, thanks for the tip regarding shimming the slit - didn't know.
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4th Jun 2013, 09:39 AM #30Most Valued Member
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- Aug 2008
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- Charlestown NSW
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Ueee. How long is your leadscrew? I have an imperial screw and half nuts from a short bed Nuttall. Its used but in ok condition. If it could be modified for your lathe you are welcome to have it if you organise and pay for the freight.
Overall length is about 1100mm and I think from memory its about 1" dia. I haven't been able to measure it closer than that atm as its all wrapped up in bubble wrap. Some time ago I offered it to a bloke who had bought a metric Nuttal off ebay but it all must have become too much for him to organise the freight and its been sitting here for a couple of years now all wrapped up.
If yours is around that length I'm happy to unwrap this and take some more accurate measurements.
For those with out a qcgb something like this might be worth considering. Theres a lot of this sort of thing out there apparently. It might be cheaper than making/sourcing gears etc
Electronic Lead Screw Main Page
regards
bollie7
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