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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
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    N.Y. u.s.a
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    42

    Default freehand turning??

    Is it acceptable to freehand on a metal lathe(like a woodturning lathe)?? I tried it on 1/4" brass rod to make a little ball on the end and it didnt seem too bad, but today I tried to make the hourglass shape on a replacement lathe handle. I cant seem to get the two cross feed handwheels to work together to make that curvy shape. So, I tried to freehand it. The tool bit and my hand got pulled toward the work and the bit almost got shot across the room.
    What is the technique for making non straight cuts??? (like the bowling pin shape of the handle)

  2. #2
    Dave J Guest

    Default

    Be carefull you will end up with a trip to the hospital.
    You can use round carbide inserts for freehand turning ,(using the dials) if you are using HSS make the nose radius a large round after taking most of the metal out with other tools also using the dials.
    You can also make form tools to do most of the job but it can be a bit of a pain to make them all up for 1 job.
    As for free hand turning like a wood lathe here is a link to a fellow making a handle but you have to take most of the metal off before free handing and have the (custom) tool rest very close almost touching the job. http://www.haythornthwaite.com/Mandrel%20Handle.htm
    Dave

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Queensland
    Posts
    445

    Default

    no idea how you tried doing this but here is a link that show what one guy uses ...good site to his lathe is a copy of a Hardinge tool room lathe very expensive. here is a link to the same site that shows you how to make ball handles. and another link this guy has a good site to and it shows how he does it as well as a ball turner

    i cant say much about the turning but the tools you need are sort of like wood turning scrapers DO NOT TRY AND USE WOOD TURNING TECHNIQUES LIKE BEVEL RUBBING OR PLAINING!!!!!!!! i would use a wood turning scraper with a steap beval ie not sharp and keep it flat while cutting the work, you can make a scraper from a good quality old file but take it slow and be carfull. always use a rest!!! and keep the gap between the work and the rest as little as posible but firm for the tool to sit on and not slip also ajust the rest so the tool edge sits on center. well that how i would try it first and carfully experiment

    be carfull and have fun but dont write your next post here from a hospital bed lol
    happy turning

    Patrick

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Garvoc VIC AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    1,656

    Default

    I've made shaped stuff on metal lathes by filing across the spinning metal.
    Regards, Bob Thomas

    www.wombatsawmill.com

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Marsden, QLD
    Posts
    93

    Default

    Yes, you can free hand working on metal, I dont mean using the topslide either, it is exactly the same technique as working with wood chisels, if you aint got no respect for your wood working tools/chisels, you can even use them, so long as they are made from tool steel.

    The main thing to watch out for, is to have the support bar as close as possible to the workpiece, or the chisel will grab and then your "up the well know creek without a paddle". You must work the tool at exactly centre height to make it cut, above centre and it will bite into the work. Below centre and your rubbing away at the cutting edge of the tool.

    For all the sceptics, go try it out if you dont believe it can be done, then again, better go see what watchmakers/jewellers do with their stuff and how they do it.

    Brass, aluminium, plastic is easy, steel is where you got to be on your toes, a mistake when working with steel can be very painfull.

    If you have never done it with wood, then don't try steel, practice first on something a lot softer and a bit more forgiving.

    regards radish

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Somerset, UK
    Posts
    60

    Default

    IMHO anyone who has a metalwork lathe should do a bit of hand turning, it teaches more about tool cutting angles than a shed load of manuals.
    'Must have' is a hand turning rest, nothing special, a bit of square bar in the toolholder would be a way to start. Get some square tool or carbon steel (old files are the dogs wedding equipment but are very brittle if the full length is left dead hard), Grind one as in the insert in this pic. & shove a secure handle on it.

    Pic 2 shows the angle for turning steel (leaded, free cutting makes it easy).

    Pic 3 shows a few bits of hand turning.


    Mark
    What you say & what people hear are not always the same thing.
    http://www.remark.me.uk/

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    N.Y. u.s.a
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    42

    Default

    Thanks everyone for the replies. Now I know what I did wrong, I wasnt close enough with what I was using as a tool rest.
    Dave J and NewGuy...that link to the handle was exactly what I'm trying to make.
    Thanks to everyone for the great links, I saved them.
    Old BikerUk..the pics are a great help, I'm not understanding the grinding angles yet.
    ..
    Well I tried to make the same lathe handle in the link from above, I never turned anything so I realized how fast things change shape. I cant get the curvy-ness of the original with just the cross slides.
    This is how far I got,the bottom flare is too small and I didnt make the piece that goes into the hole yet....also, I have no parting tool to cut it off. (there should be two handles on that cross slide, one was broken off when I bought it).

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Somerset, UK
    Posts
    60

    Default

    Turbo - Looks like you are getting the idea.
    It's like anything else - difficult to figure out initially until you get the hang of it. If I haven't done any hand work for a while, I practice on a few scrap pieces to get the 'muscle memory' back.
    For the concave part make a curved scraper same as for wood, swing it side to side pivoting on the rest & adjusting the vertical angle with the handle till it cuts sweetly. A dash of cutting oil will also help with the finish.
    Mark
    What you say & what people hear are not always the same thing.
    http://www.remark.me.uk/

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    N.Y. u.s.a
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    42

    Default

    in the picture I posted, it looks like my original handle is floating next to the holder instead of stuck into it

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Queensland
    Posts
    445

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by turbo TA View Post
    Thanks everyone for the replies. Now I know what I did wrong, I wasnt close enough with what I was using as a tool rest.
    Dave J and NewGuy...that link to the handle was exactly what I'm trying to make.
    Thanks to everyone for the great links, I saved them.
    Old BikerUk..the pics are a great help, I'm not understanding the grinding angles yet.
    ..
    Well I tried to make the same lathe handle in the link from above, I never turned anything so I realized how fast things change shape. I cant get the curvy-ness of the original with just the cross slides.
    This is how far I got,the bottom flare is too small and I didnt make the piece that goes into the hole yet....also, I have no parting tool to cut it off. (there should be two handles on that cross slide, one was broken off when I bought it).
    glad i could help you look like your doing great. one thing to look out for now is how your going to attach that handle to the slide maybe next time make a blank with a good thread on it so it can screw on where you want to attach it (the thread will need to be undercut with clearance at the face so it will thread right up to the shoulder and dont forget to test it with a nut or it will be chucked) and part it off so you have the thread and the length you want the handle to be plus a little extra for clean up. chuck a scrap bit of round bar the same size as your blank in the lathe about oh 10-15mm out, face it off, drill it and tap it to the size of your threaded blank. this way you can thread your blank on jig, it will be perfectly centered and you will be able to turn it like you normally do just take it a little easier for safety sake oh and it WILL be very tight to get off when your finished turning

    hoped that was helpful, get yourself a parting tool soon eh
    happy turning

    Patrick

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Somerset, UK
    Posts
    60

    Default

    Like the man says - you should learn something new everyday - A friend called for a chat in the workshop & the subject of hand turning came up, he asked if I had come across the 'point tool' . I hadn't, it seems that it was the favourite tool of the 'old' ivory turners and is now is popular with wood turners (chapter & verse on making one here., anyway it also works great on steel and brass, the metals tried so far.
    It consists of three facets ground on the tool.

    I made this one from 1/4" tool steel and it works like a dream (and has three cutting
    edges so less sharpening). I made the angles 20 deg.one end and 30 the other.
    Mark
    What you say & what people hear are not always the same thing.
    http://www.remark.me.uk/

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    N.Y. u.s.a
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    Default

    Thanks Mark, thats a very interesting tool. I'd like to try to make one, I like the handle you put on yours also. I bookmarked the link...
    thanks,
    Marc
    .

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    AlphaCentauri
    Posts
    29

    Thumbs up

    Very good thread, Marc. I'm learning quite a few things myself.

    I'm building myself a quickie hand rest soon. I like the handle you're turning out. I'm going to try doing a similar one for my Makita cold saw.

    Mark has posted some nice pictures.

    Regards all.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    184

    Default

    I found this article on making a graver (that's what the hand turning tool is called) useful. I've only used it on brass so far, but it worked very well.

    http://www.sherline.com/gravers.htm

    Here's one of my attempts at some radius work

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    N.Y. u.s.a
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    42

    Default

    well, I finished off that handle basically just the way it looks in the photo. I messed up the little shoulder so I didnt make it like the original. but the tang (the original isnt threaded) fit in real snug. So for now I left it,until I make some of these turning tools you guys showed me...thanks!!

    Blackfrancis,, I really like that brass thing you made...thats what I want to do ,I think, make nice looking stuff..not thread rods (well maybe one day I'll have to).

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