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Thread: battery charger

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaronJ View Post
    Hi John,
    The coil in this picture is the exciter coil.
    Replacing the voltage regulator would probably be the better way to go !
    Ok thanks John we are on the same wavelength now, hopefully i wont need to replace the reg. In an earlier post i mentioned that i might be able to insulate/disconnect the reg from the output power, if i can do this the reg should work independently and i should still get the same charge voltage and maybe the diode trick will then work ????

  2. #17
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    John (shed),
    Sounds like a setup I could use here. I've got 6.6kW of solar panels and the damn things disconnect when the power fails! I understand why, but it so frustrating to have no power when there's kilowatts of it available from the roof.

    I'll drop in one day for a shufti at your system.
    Chris

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack620 View Post
    I'll drop in one day for a shufti at your system.
    no probs

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack620 View Post
    John (shed),
    Sounds like a setup I could use here. I've got 6.6kW of solar panels and the damn things disconnect when the power fails! I understand why, but it so frustrating to have no power when there's kilowatts of it available from the roof.

    I'll drop in one day for a shufti at your system.
    Hi Chris, Guys,

    You need a transfer switch to disconnect the panels from the grid tie inverter and switch them to a charge controller to feed lead acid batteries. I know that John has gone for a 24 volt system, but 12V charge controllers are quite cheap from China, however I don't know if they will take anything more than about 50 volts input. A single domestic panel outputs 56 volts, which my camper one is. I built my own charge controller which was designed to handle 60 volts and outputs over 12 amps @ 14 volts, in full sunlight ! Actually way more than I need, but its nice to be able to run everything even with flat batteries and still be able to charge them.

    HTH.
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  5. #20
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    Default It has an extra winding

    I learnt 2 new things today, No1 was the word shufti
    No2 was when I had a shufti at the guts of this alternator I found an extra winding connected to an extra pair of diodes.
    It appears as though this extra winding supplies AC power to the regulator for the rotor windings and the excess power is just fed through the diodes into the charge circuit.
    The rotor winding measured 9.4 ohms, at 29 volts that would be only be about 3 amps.
    There must be diodes in the reg to supply DC from this to the rotor coil?
    Why would they do it that way instead of just pulling DC from the output?

    I think that the battery sense circuit is probably connected in the regulator to this AC circuit and I don't think I have the strength or ability to defeat black regulator magic.

    I reckon that I will put it back together and forget that I even thought about putting on a stupid gas up the batteries circuit
    Attached Images Attached Images

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaronJ View Post
    Hi Chris, Guys,

    You need a transfer switch to disconnect the panels from the grid tie inverter and switch them to a charge controller to feed lead acid batteries. I know that John has gone for a 24 volt system, but 12V charge controllers are quite cheap from China, however I don't know if they will take anything more than about 50 volts input. A single domestic panel outputs 56 volts, which my camper one is. I built my own charge controller which was designed to handle 60 volts and outputs over 12 amps @ 14 volts, in full sunlight ! Actually way more than I need, but its nice to be able to run everything even with flat batteries and still be able to charge them.

    HTH.
    Hi John, one string of my panels puts out over 700 volts

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by shedhappens View Post
    I learnt 2 new things today, No1 was the word shufti
    No2 was when I had a shufti at the guts of this alternator I found an extra winding connected to an extra pair of diodes.
    It appears as though this extra winding supplies AC power to the regulator for the rotor windings and the excess power is just fed through the diodes into the charge circuit.
    The rotor winding measured 9.4 ohms, at 29 volts that would be only be about 3 amps.
    There must be diodes in the reg to supply DC from this to the rotor coil?
    Why would they do it that way instead of just pulling DC from the output?

    I think that the battery sense circuit is probably connected in the regulator to this AC circuit and I don't think I have the strength or ability to defeat black regulator magic.

    I reckon that I will put it back together and forget that I even thought about putting on a stupid gas up the batteries circuit
    Hi John,

    Looking at your picture I count seven diodes ! There could be ones that I can't see. Its possible that the regulator gets its reference input from an auxiliary winding by rectifying the AC and using it as a reference.

    Normally the windings are a set of three, as in a three phase motor configuration, with six diodes rectifying the AC output from the field coils. One set of diodes providing the positive DC voltage the other providing the negative DC voltage. Depending upon whether the alternator is designed to be positive or negative earth, one set of diodes will be connected to the alternator frame the other will be the output voltage to the battery.

    Three Phase Alternator.png

    This picture shows the possible wiring configurations of a three phase alternator. Either of the two bottom wiring circuits could be used. "C" is the most common one. The diodes will be connected to the three wires on the right hand side. A secondary winding can be used to provide a reference voltage or even be fed DC to reduce or intensify the generator magnetic field thus altering the output voltage as required.

    HTH.
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by shedhappens View Post
    Hi John, one string of my panels puts out over 700 volts
    Hi John, Guys,

    700 volts ! Ouch.

    Normally only five or six panels are in a string putting 280 to 350 volts into the grid tie inverter with two or three strings. 700 V, that effectively means that half of the available power is being lost !

    Normally a grid tie inverter would output a nominal 240 volts AC @ 50 Hz.
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  9. #24
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    Shed do you invert to 240V to run your cpap or run it on 12V?
    I'm dealing with the same issues, trying to decide between running a couple of light loads from a small UPS and adding some storage to that(then I have to get 240V extension leads through walls, which can be frowned upon) or running off batteries through a boast/buck converter, instructions say car battery is fine but not while engine is running, which I take to mean <13V ok >13V not so good.

    Quote Originally Posted by BaronJ View Post
    that effectively means that half of the available power is being lost !
    Isn't that what MPPT is all about? Am I missing something?

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaronJ View Post
    Hi John, Guys,

    700 volts ! Ouch.

    Normally only five or six panels are in a string putting 280 to 350 volts into the grid tie inverter with two or three strings. 700 V, that effectively means that half of the available power is being lost !

    Normally a grid tie inverter would output a nominal 240 volts AC @ 50 Hz.
    G/day John, page 69 has the tech details

    https://www.google.com/url?q=https:/...2lgNKJMj8UO8uY

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stustoys View Post
    Shed do you invert to 240V to run your cpap or run it on 12V?
    I'm dealing with the same issues, trying to decide between running a couple of light loads from a small UPS and adding some storage to that(then I have to get 240V extension leads through walls, which can be frowned upon) or running off batteries through a boast/buck converter, instructions say car battery is fine but not while engine is running, which I take to mean <13V ok >13V not so good.
    G/day Stu, in the past i used the 12v forklift battery with a 12/24v resmed converter, it worked fine and i would use a 7 amp ctek charger with it.
    It worked well and really the only 2 problem's were if needed the battery in the shed and the continual whining nose that a battery can inadvertantly cause when in a bedroom amongst floral sheets and fluffy pillows.
    Mains power was disconnected from selected power points and reconnected into jb's, new power cables run from inverter to those power points.
    Well...thats the simple explaination.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stustoys View Post
    Isn't that what MPPT is all about? Am I missing something?
    Not missing anything Stu. The MPPT voltage of my panels is 33V.

    John (Baron),
    An MPPT inverter will load the panels such that they operate at their optimum voltage (33V for my LG panels). I have a string of 12 panels. 12x33V = 396V. Remember also that 240V RMS is 337V peak.
    Chris

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaronJ View Post
    Hi John,

    Looking at your picture I count seven diodes ! There could be ones that I can't see. Its possible that the regulator gets its reference input from an auxiliary winding by rectifying the AC and using it as a reference.

    G/day John, i would have to unsolder the windings from the diodes to be able to work out how it is wound but i reckon you are correct regarding the auxiliary coil , it is reassembled now and mounted back on the frame.
    Sorry i dd not reply earlier but i needed to get to my poota to do the pics.

    A couple of pics showing the 4 pairs of diodes....
    Attached Images Attached Images

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