Thread: Suitable Oil/Diesel Burner?

Hi all,
By chance i picked up a Selectos boiler burner today. I have found a manual online but cannot fine a KW output. Any thoughts on Copper alloy and ally melting? Manual here: http://www.nu-way.co.uk/userfiles/fi...2%20Manual.pdf

Cheers,
Ew

depends on what sized crucible you want to use

if it can keep up the air for a nice smoke free burn , burning a gallon an hour , it will melt copper alloys in a #10 crucible >2lt ,in a 1/2 decent insulated furnace , at 1 gallon per hour (4.5lt ) it should melt aluminum in #10 crucible in a dodgy furnace with out a lid

measure the diesel you put in the tank and run it in the furnace flat out ,with no smoke fan setting , and time how long the fuel takes to run out ?you can "jet it up " to use more fuel , but it will get to a stage where the fan wont pump enough air for a nice burn

the heat wont be measured in Kw , it will be in BTU's "British Thermal Units "

the air fuel mix needs a real nice adjustment to get to copper temps , run it rich and its cold and sooty ( good for aluminum to reduce oxide formation ) run it lean and it go's cold again and white smokes , on a perfect burn you will get to cast iron temps , then its a matter of the size of the crucible , and how good the insulation is , a small flame is good for $$$ per melt , but then it takes too long to get up too temp ( with good insulation ) so a big flame on a big crucible is what you want , even though the small flame will still get up to temp

Thanks sawdust,
I was hoping you might have some input since you made your own. It came from a convent in bungendore, still running but they converted to gas. The ignition works and the fan runs, just need to hook up a tank and test it. All the rest of the companies units are rated in kw not btu's, I did think it odd. The fan has a slide valve on it for adjustment, and the jet looks easy enough to modify. What size was your jet? I'll read back through your thread on making yours. I can always put a bigger fan on, the nozzle is about 3" across so there is plenty of area for a big air flow.
Hopefully get it fired up tomorrow.
Cheers,
Ew

aha!
Apparently this burner can use jets ranging from .5-2 G/h, so i could be in luck......At 1 G/h the output is roughly 35kw at an oil pressure of 8.5 bar. Better find myself a suitable pressure gauge......

The jet i have is .85G/h, but i can still buy jets for the unit, so i can go bigger if needs be.
I hooked it up today with some kero, short of siphoning some out of my van i don't have any diesel. The manual simply states to ad 20% extra fuel pressure when using kero. The flame would not stay at the nozzle with no extra pipe, but i did manage to get a nice clean burn with the air valve only open a crack. Air supply should not be a problem. The pump is self priming and all so it was pretty easy.
Now i need Sawdust to finish his furnace so i can copy it.....
Cheers,
Ew

the flame will change inside a furnace , as now it can get extra air if its running rich , in a furnace , it relys on the fan as its in a closed environment ,

can you find a length of pipe ?? 2m long you can fit over the end of the burner , and pack the gap with something ? a non plastic rag will be fine for a short burn but something non flammable would be better , , , watch out , you should be able to melt the steel pipe ,


if you do it at night , you will see the glow change as you adjust the air/fuel mix , you need atleast bright yellow for copper , a dull orange / bright red for aluminum , but white, hard to look ,at will end in a melted pipe and should be achievable ( not with a rag )

just a learning curve on the burner adjustment , they can be frustrating when you first start , inside the furnace you cant see the glow change

at the moment in an atmospheric burn , you wont get smoke , in the tube , you might find that you have to crank up the air , to a point it will blow the flame out , if it wasn't in a tube

my burner wont stay alight out of the furnace at its running fan speed ( blows its self out ) , you just need a little air and let it warm up for 5min ( normal ) , before , going full blast on the fan speed

you will want to mount the burner so its easy and quick to remove from the furnace , when you turn off the furnace the heat inside will damage the burner
while the burner is running the end is air cooled , when the fan stops , it will heat up real fast form the furnace heat ( not good)

leaving the fan on when you shut it down , cools the furnace quickly and its not good for your refractory , also why warming up the burner for 5 min is good , it slowly rises temp inside the furnace , but still way too fast, if there is any moisture in the refractory steam will blow the refractory apart ( a popping sound ),

lol , my furnace is finished , and runs well , the burner was fine for aluminum , but i also made a waste motor oil / jumping castle fan burner that is good for copper

those small PC fans were not quite up to copper temps and i needed more air

if i were to make a new one , will soon , i would go with large LPG cylinder for the out side , 50mm kiowool and a cast 3/4 inch hot face , but i already have a #10 crucible furnace

but i think i might go for a #30 crucible for aluminium pours (15kg / 6 lt ) and use a 44 gallon drum as the out side skin ,.would probably need 2 gallon an hour some thing that size to get too copper temps

Looks good Ueee and quiet a nice find!

It has now got me thinking..... In terms of making a diesel burner, can I simply purchase something like this:Suntec OIL Burner Pump A2VA 7116 Beckett Wayne Burners | eBay

or similar then plumb it into a suitable jet or injector and then provide forced air and I have a diesel burner capable of bronze or CI temps?

Obviously, the burner would need to be made to the correct dimensions including the jet size, correct forced air ratios, means to drive the pump and control the speed, but is this basically it or am I missing something?

Looks like a fun project if this is the case!

Cheers,

Simon

Hi Simon,
Thats basically it. The jets on this unit are Monarch 80deg AR. I can go to 1.35 Gallons/h with the draught tube i have, or make a bigger draught tube and go to 2 G/H....Monarch Nozzles New Monarch 1 25 80 AR Oil Furnace Nozzle Burner Boiler HVAC | eBay Monarch Oil Burner Nozzles 65 75 1 00 1 20 70 80 Degree AR 10 Lot Set | eBay
My pump runs off the fan motor, it is self priming, has feed and return lines and is pressure adjustable from 7-9.5 bar. The air is simply controlled by a slide valve. More details in the manual.... http://www.nu-way.co.uk/userfiles/fi...2%20Manual.pdf
Being a heater burner it also has its own neon transformer and ignition electrodes, plus flame sensor and a little brain. I'll do away with that and just make it manual.
I hope to be able to do a #10 at least in CI, i'm aiming higher at a #16. i think with 2 g/h it should do this........i hope.

Cheers,
Ew

Originally Posted by Ueee

Hi Simon,
Thats basically it. The jets on this unit are Monarch 80deg AR. I can go to 1.35 Gallons/h with the draught tube i have, or make a bigger draught tube and go to 2 G/H....Monarch Nozzles New Monarch 1 25 80 AR Oil Furnace Nozzle Burner Boiler HVAC | eBay Monarch Oil Burner Nozzles 65 75 1 00 1 20 70 80 Degree AR 10 Lot Set | eBay
My pump runs off the fan motor, it is self priming, has feed and return lines and is pressure adjustable from 7-9.5 bar. The air is simply controlled by a slide valve. More details in the manual.... http://www.nu-way.co.uk/userfiles/fi...2%20Manual.pdf
Being a heater burner it also has its own neon transformer and ignition electrodes, plus flame sensor and a little brain. I'll do away with that and just make it manual.
I hope to be able to do a #10 at least in CI, i'm aiming higher at a #16. i think with 2 g/h it should do this........i hope.

Cheers,
Ew

Oh yea baby, according to the graph 2 G/hr is about 220,000 BTU/Hr @ 77% efficiency!

Nice, very nice. OK that's it. I want to build one. How hard can it be? Surely it doesn't need any brains, just light the thing and adjust as you go. No different to the vast majority of waste oil burners used for same application. Biggest unknown for me is the design of the draught tube and air volume. Maybe I can get Stuart interested in one of these he would make short work of such calculations!

Cheers

Originally Posted by simonl

Maybe I can get Stuart interested in one of these he would make short work of such calculations!

Sounds more like a job for Bob

Have you seen the oil burners that use compressed air as the pump/atomiser?...... thought I'm not sure I have seen one in the 220k BTU/hr range.

Stuart

I can give you all the dimensions you should need Simon. The only real unknown is the amount of air the fan is moving. It sure can supply a hell of a lot of heat......I have no idea how big the boiler was it was on, I just saw it and my brain went clang.......I asked how much, handed over some coin and it was mine before I had even really thought about it.

Originally Posted by Ueee

I can give you all the dimensions you should need Simon. The only real unknown is the amount of air the fan is moving. It sure can supply a hell of a lot of heat......I have no idea how big the boiler was it was on, I just saw it and my brain went clang.......I asked how much, handed over some coin and it was mine before I had even really thought about it.

Yea. Good work, I bet you're not regretting it now! I have been searching my head off on ebay UK & USA for the pumps. Seems to be two main players on the market, Danfross and Suntec. From what I can see, all the models are very similar in output (2 -3 G/Hr) and pressure (100 - 150 psi). They are actually not too expensive with some of the cheaper ones about $40 but it's the shipping that kills it. Still, can get one for under $100. There was also a complete burner similar to yours but perhaps a bit older for about $65. Here it is:

Furnace OIL Burner White Rodgers 688 415 Control Sundstrand OIL Pump Vintage | eBay

I'll have to so some more research. Now I'm thinking of a shed heater too!

Simon

Just how big would be to big?
I just missed one with(in my best Austin Powers) "1 000 000 BTU's"
Would that have been to much of a good thing?

Stuart

Originally Posted by Stustoys

Just how big would be to big?
I just missed one with(in my best Austin Powers) "1 000 000 BTU's"
Would that have been to much of a good thing?

Stuart

You mean Dr Evil? Moohahahah!

Not sure, you can always use a smaller jet and lower fuel pressure i guess. The one i have is rated to 65kw tops, not sure how to translate that to BTU's.

Cheers,
Ew