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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    N.W.Tasmania
    Posts
    1,407

    Default Trailer Refurbishment 2

    Hi Folks,
    I am not an experienced welder by any means, so happy to receive advice on this project. Our Community Shed, (like a mens shed but we also have female members) was recently given a commercially manufactured trailer which has seen better days. It is relatively large for an unbraked trailer at 8 X 4 Feet internal dimension, all steel, but very lightly constructed. The main chassis is or more correctly was 40x40x3 angle. It had a very light checker plate floor, pretty well rusted out, and we will replace that with 30mm Macrocarpa boards, and the sides are 1.6 or maybe 2mm profiled steel, similar to that used for the sides of a flat tray ute. I have almost finished cutting out the bottom 80 mm of the sides, which were pretty rotten, but the rest of them look ok. The lateral members of the chassis were folded 1.6mm steel with a 40mm square U profile. The checker plate floor was stitched to the open end of the U shape, and these will be replaced with 40x3 mm RHS, I would have preferred a wall thickness of 2 or maybe 2.5mm, but I got what was available at the time.
    Now some questions. A couple of the original U profiled lateral members, have rotted out on the ends hence their replacement with the RHS, but at least one must have trapped moisture leading to some deep corrosion of the angle, which I estimate to be near half the original thickness. Would it be OK to just lay down some beads of weld to build up the reduced thickness? Or will this lead to possible premature failure? Would pre or post heating of the area be of any benefit?
    I have not measured the drawbar, but I think that it is probably 75 x 50, but not sure of the wall thickness. I note that it has been welded across the top as well as the sides where it attaches to the angle chassis frame. While I have not yet checked closely, I don't think that there is any cracking yet in this area, but short of replacing it completely, I don't see any easy fixes for that shortcoming, but some of you may have suggestions for a remedy I haven't thought of!
    I have some 2mm galvanised strip to replace the section cut out from the sides, and bearing in mind my limited welding experience, (plenty of YouTube experience though) what would be your suggestions for welding that in. I have a Metalmaster 215 multiprocess TIG, stick and plasma cutting machine, and The Community Shed has a Michigan Mig welder, but I have to work under cover but outside, and although it is fairly sheltered, depending on the day it might be hard to get good gas shielding for mig or tig. I will have to get some more electrodes if I stick weld, as we only have a few old 6013s in 2.5mm I think, any suggestions for suitable rods for pretty well a novice, or at least someone with limited recent welding experience?
    I will enclose some photos of the WIP Thanks in advance for your useful suggestions and advice,

    Rob.
    IMG_0616.jpg

    The photo above with the corroded section of the angle out of focus unfortunately.

    IMG_0613.jpg
    This photo shows the upside down trailer frame with A frame welds shown from bottom view, and the cutout of the rotten section at the base of the sides.

    IMG_0614.jpg

    This photo shows the welded across the top of the "A" frame.

    IMG_0615.jpg

    A general view down the length of the trailer frame with one of the lateral members removed, the first one in from the tail end. The nuts welder the lateral members were used as cable guides for the brake, tail and indicator lights wiring, really rough and basic, I was surprised that the manufacturer got the compliance rating for this trailer, no jacket on the wiring between each tail light assembly and no grommets for cables passing through drilled holes in the metalwork either.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2021
    Location
    Western Sydney
    Posts
    262

    Default

    ''...A couple of the original U profiled lateral members, have rotted out on the ends hence their replacement with the RHS, but at least one must have trapped moisture leading to some deep corrosion of the angle, which I estimate to be near half the original thickness. Would it be OK to just lay down some beads of weld to build up the reduced thickness? Or will this lead to possible premature failure? Would pre or post heating of the area be of any benefit? ''

    I would patch it with a plate rather than weld it up to thicken it. Once you done patch plate over the whole think to reinforce it.


    ''...I have some 2mm galvanised strip to replace the section cut out from the sides, and bearing in mind my limited welding experience, (plenty of YouTube experience though) what would be your suggestions for welding that in. ''

    Fluxcore wire with mig . I've found welding rusty trailers can be a mission , you might see a spot badly rusted and think i'll remove it and weld it in 5 min , but the whole section can be rusted a long way back from that hole, and as soon as you start welding , it blows holes everywhere because there is no carbon in the steel. It is sometimes quicker to replace the whole frame than spend hours patching rust. Another trick repairing rusty trailer floors is to remove the old one and just replace with it form ply, much easier to install then trying weld over rust ect.


  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2021
    Location
    Central NSW
    Posts
    25

    Default

    On the rusty section if you are able to replace the whole section, then do that.
    I think you might be better off welding angle in where the bottom 80mm was cut out.I would use maybe 50 x 50 mm angle. Then to the topside of angle weld 32mm flat black steel. Trim the cut edge then weld in angle to the sides. When you screw the boards on may need to plane 50x3mm off outside edge to allow for the angle thickness. The angle will give a good footing for screwing outside edge of timber’s. This may be a bit exy and heavy - with the angle and timber - is a metal floor possible?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    N.W.Tasmania
    Posts
    1,407

    Default

    Thanks Iron Triangle and MugWelder for your replies. There are some comments from both of you that I am unsure just what you mean, but before getting into those, I will just clarify what our plans are for the refurbishment. I have cut out the old floor which was thin checkerplate, I can't be certain how thin, but less than 3mm I would say. It was perforated by corrosion in several areas, and what wasn't perforated was heavily corroded.
    Our plan is to replace the steel floor with Macrocarpa boards cut 30mm thick, which we mill ourselves at the Community Shed. For those unfamiliar with Macrocarpa, it has been grown widely in Tasmania as shelter belt trees, and it proves very durable as timber exposed to the weather. Outdoor furniture made from it routinely last 20 - 30 years exposed to all weathers, and not painted at all during its lifetime.
    The trailer showed all the signs of either being used to cart and perhaps hold acidic stuff like manure, or perhaps being left holding lawn clippings, or even just parked outside under trees shedding leaves or needles. The floor was gone, and the bottom edge of the sides had rusted out, but further up everything looked pretty sound. I have cut out strips on each side about 60 mm wide, and while I have not yet completed dressing the edges, what I have done so far, has all had a good solid edge and no signs of thinning, so I am pretty confident that I have good material to weld to with the replacement strip.
    Now to clarify my understandings. Iron Triangle, did you mean that I should cut out the thin area of the angle iron frame, and weld in a section of plate to replace the corroded bit, and then weld in some flat bar onto the inside, horizontal edge of the angle (when the trailer is right way up again on its wheels)?

    Mugwelder, I'm sorry but I can't quite follow what you mean in your second paragraph. I get what you are saying in your first statement, and the one thing which causes some hesitation on my part in going that way, is that I would have to remount all the suspension parts, but having some new angle for the main rails, and 50 x 50 x 6 mm would make for a good long lasting job, and I may well go that way. Did you mean that I should add the 32 mm black steel to the top of the angle to fill in what I have cut out of the rusted sides? This part I am not following at all Trim the cut edge then weld in angle to the sides. When you screw the boards on may need to plane 50x3mm off outside edge to allow for the angle thickness. Probably clear as crystal to everyone else, but I am just not catching on
    Thanks again gents for your comments,
    Rob.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2021
    Location
    Central NSW
    Posts
    25

    Default

    Hi there I reread and looked as the pics again - the way I was looking at it was to weld the angle on top of existing angle that supports the cross members. But I don’t think that will work. if kept outside will the timber swell (surface won’t be level) and contract when dried out (let sand or gravel out). Thought the rust angle is along the front. Have you got a clear pic of the section you have cut out. Cheers

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    N.W.Tasmania
    Posts
    1,407

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mugwelder View Post
    Hi there I reread and looked as the pics again - the way I was looking at it was to weld the angle on top of existing angle that supports the cross members. But I don’t think that will work. if kept outside will the timber swell (surface won’t be level) and contract when dried out (let sand or gravel out). Thought the rust angle is along the front. Have you got a clear pic of the section you have cut out. Cheers
    Unfortunately I don't have a really clear picture of the bit which is badly corroded, picture 1 shows the area, but my phone picked the ground and my foot to focus on and not the rust patch I wanted. I didn't notice the poor focus till I got home and loaded the photos onto my iMac which I far prefer to use to browse this forum. The bad part is in line with my foot on the LH end and goes to the random marking that looks vaguely like the number 12 to the Right. I won't be back at The Shed till Wednesday to get a better photo either, unless I make a special trip.
    That 40 x 40 angle frame was only 3mm thick I think, it is a bit hard to be certain because of the extensive rusting, but most of it is around 3mm thick now. That badly corroded section would be less than 2 mm thick in parts. I am thinking that I should just really bight the bullet and cut out those bottom side rails, after having taken some careful measurements of the spring hanger position for the front spring mounts. The rear will not be so important as they are just 50mm SHS to restrain the slipper end of the spring sets, and a few mm either way won't matter much.
    The trailer will be stored outside, and may occasionally be used for sand and gravel I suppose, but the trailer is expected to be used mainly for taking timber and various bits and bobs made at The shed to either paying customers or to local markets. In any case I don't think that Macrocarpa will shrink or expand too much, as it has a lot of resin/oil which acts as a long term preservative, but I may be wrong on that front, and need to check with some of my more knowledgable fellow Shedders. If it proves to be an issue, a few beads of Sikaflex polyurethane, or even just a layer of plastic laid in the tray for the odd occasion might suffice. Thanks again for your input, Cheers,
    Rob.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2021
    Location
    Central NSW
    Posts
    25

    Default

    In the past have found the spring hanger we’re not in the right spot when originally built. Just check the lengths from middle of the hitch( need to be the same). I think you have come this far and to cut the side rails would not be much more work.

    Another way for the hangers is to cut them off and weld a piece of flat - say 100mm or so long onto the side rail - then weld the hanger on top of that. (If you decided not to cut the rails out)
    These rotten trailers are really a lot of time. I find u keep finding things wrong.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    N.W.Tasmania
    Posts
    1,407

    Default

    Thanks MugWelder for the input. I will consult with the hierarchy but my instinct is to replace the bottom rails, they are only 2 bits of angle iron, a total of less than 5 metres in length and I have already bought new cross members in 40 x 3 mm SHS. It give us the opportunity to reinforce the guts of this trailer by going slightly thicker for the materials used, and to be honest even the 3mm material lasted 20+ years, so if that was all we get out of the rebuilt unit I will be in my 90s, and someone else can sort it out then. If we get the steelwork finished I will see if we can get it sandblasted and resprayed in 2 pack paint before we put the timber floor in. As mentioned previously most of the trailer is in pretty good nick, and it just seems that it was left with something in the tray which held water, and was perhaps a bit acidic in nature. The 2 pack paint should give good long term protection, especially to parts which might hold dirt and grime but be difficult to wash down easily with a hose.

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