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  1. #1
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    Default Will this plan work?

    Hey Guys, Does anyone think a "Bolt Together" steel trailer will work? reason behind bolted trailer is i can pull it apart and transport it for galvanizing as it will be 6 meters long and around 1.8 meters wide i cannot carry it my self

    the black lines are 100x50x3mm or 100x50x4mm main outside rails and 50x50x3mm or 50x50x4mm cross members the red line will be 4mm plate bent to shape in the hydraulic press than welded only to the cross member than bolted to the main frame

    i can't guarantee my welds to be water tight so re-thinking about filling the tubing with oil or SX-50/water
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  2. #2
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    Jun 2010
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    Gazza.

    Why are you so convinced that putting oil in the frame is a good idea. You are going to get it galvanised obviously. What is wrong with allowing the gal. to run inside your RHS. Holes need to be drilled in the right place for the gal to get in and out during the dipping process. Two of the places I had galvanising done, checked my work at drop off to see that the holes were suitable for the dipping.

    I am not an engineer, but have built dozens of trailers, including 7 boat trailers, some of them the large wobble roller type and used under boats that were up to 7 metres long.

    Your bolted joints will be a week point and will flex, causing likely failure.

    Your will have to get the bolts galvanised. Have you seen what that does to bolts and nuts. All will require a run over with taps and dies. And that removes the gal.

    Weld you trailer together, drill holes where they won’t be seen so that the galvanising gets in to every corner and tube, and then borrow a mates’ trailer to cart it to the gal joint.

    As far as spring mounts go, I used 75 x 75mm angle for that job. Spring hangers and guard welded on and “U” bolted to the frame after galvanising. Allows for forward and rear movement of the axle for weight balance. Can sent a photo of you wish.

    And chase around for prices, as the ones I have used in the Melbourne area vary considerably. Al the jobs I have had done have been of good quality.

    Hope this convinces you to gal the whole thing. You will be a much happier man.

    John.

    PS. Go to a boat show and get some ideas.

  3. #3
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    Hey John, I was either going with oil filled tubes or fill it with SX-50 which is a rust preventive pre mix with water but the other option was to have a "bolt together trailer" so i can cart the trailer in pieces to the galvanizer, if i weld the whole trailer together i have no way of lifting it or even carting it to the galvanizer i have no extra hands to help lift the trailer frame onto a car trailer to get the job done so if i built the frame in pieces i could carry it my self in sections

    if i could get someone to lend a hand my trailer would be 6 meters i think 7-11/U Haul trailers are only 4-4.5 meters? thats a big overhang to tow 3 hours north and back to get galvanized i would be pulled over by the cops or sure

  4. #4
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    Lebrina
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    No, that design of trailer will not work at all. You will crush the RHS and due to this never keep the bolts tight. Hollow sections are not really at all suitable for through bolted joints.
    I questioned your Galvanising pricing in your original thread and I still question it now. I really doubt that anywhere would be charging $5-6/Kg. Pricing at my galvaniser is as follows: Weight of item X 1.07 X $1.73, then add GST. A 500Kg frame would therefore cost 500 X 1.07 X $1.73 plus GST, equalling $1018 including GST. You would spend $600 at a miniumum to 2 pack paint the trailer properly, not counting abrasives etc. There is a reason that commercial trailers are galvanised.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza2009au View Post
    Hey John, I was either going with oil filled tubes or fill it with SX-50 which is a rust preventive pre mix with water but the other option was to have a "bolt together trailer" so i can cart the trailer in pieces to the galvanizer, if i weld the whole trailer together i have no way of lifting it or even carting it to the galvanizer i have no extra hands to help lift the trailer frame onto a car trailer to get the job done so if i built the frame in pieces i could carry it my self in sections

    if i could get someone to lend a hand my trailer would be 6 meters i think 7-11/U Haul trailers are only 4-4.5 meters? thats a big overhang to tow 3 hours north and back to get galvanized i would be pulled over by the cops or sure
    That would be a very illegal overhang to tow anywhere.
    Have you considered throwing it on a truck/tilt tray. Often reasonable deals can be had if you organise it as a backload or fill in job.

  6. #6
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    Hey Karl i just called another local gal company i mentioned the trailer will be 6x1.7x.3 meters and was quoted $800-$850 to galvanize the trailer, to paint the trailer will cost some where around $150 using ebay primer and 2k paints rolled or brushed on, SX-50 a water based biodegradable rust inhibitor cost about another $50 to fill the trailer

    i didn't think about the RHS crushing that's a good point

    for the above there would be an additional $160 to the gal coating for hiring a gumtree 16 footer car trailer or 2 days

    so about $1000 to gal the trailer or $200 to paint

  7. #7
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    Can someone please check out this steel to see if its imported or locally made

    https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/HOT-DIPP...QAAOSwCGVYBBuB

    https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/HOT-DIPP...sAAOSwMVdYIQIV

    The plan will be to fill the hollows with this product www.saltoff.com.au - Product Test

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza2009au View Post
    Can someone please check out this steel to see if its imported or locally made

    https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/HOT-DIPP...QAAOSwCGVYBBuB

    https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/HOT-DIPP...sAAOSwMVdYIQIV

    The plan will be to fill the hollows with this product www.saltoff.com.au - Product Test
    I think you are way out on your $200 estimate to paint your boat trailer. To properly do the job you would need to etch prime, prime and then two coats of 2K top coat. If you can get all that for $200, you are truly a talented man. Etch primer was around $60/4L last time I looked, high build primer and 2K top coat will add $250-300 plus hardener and thinner. The cheapest 2K topcoat I found on Ebay was $125/4L without hardener. I couldn't comment on the quality of the Ebay paints, but have used Wattyl Colourthane 2K top coat, PF330 primer and Superetch etch primer with excellent results and would recommend them any day.
    I suspect that the RHS you are looking at may be imported as it comes in non standard lengths and Is quite cheap. I am on a good discount level from the local Bluescope and my buy price for 100X50X2.5 primed RHS 8M length is around $100 +GST. Galvanising would add $82 +GST per length. That pre galvanised RHS may sound cheap, but be aware, it will be a pain to work with and your welding skills are still very much developing, so you really don't want extra headaches.
    The cost of hot dip galvanising while painful at first will pay off long term. The saying that "A poor man always pays twice" holds very true.

  9. #9
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    Yeah i wasn't sure about that steel, i am logged on to my local Aussie supplier for steel now and 50x50x3mm 8m is $88, 100x50x3mm 8m is $153 both are gal steel, not sure if i am calculating this correctly about the paint but my current trailer has 20 meters of RHS a mix of 70x40 and 100x50 very old trailer so lets put that down at 20 meters of 100x50mm that i think works out to be 6 square meters of surface area, these 2k paints on ebay are claiming 11-12sq meters per litre,

    my trailer will have less steel i reckon tho as the trailer i have now has a crap load of welded sections my design will be more basic (current trailer is over engineered typical old timers )

    i thought etc primer was for aluminium i guess i need to factor that in to it is adding up but still cheaper than galvanizing and a lot less of a head ache, there are 2k paint kits on ebay for $200 but only 1L

    Edit: the problem going galvanized trailer is the cost $1000 but also i have no way of moving it plus i could buy enough aluminium or that $1000 and pay a local alloy welder $400 extra to weld the A frame and i can bolt the cross members on and have basically the same as the gal frame for similar money

    what would u do?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza2009au View Post
    Yeah i wasn't sure about that steel, i am logged on to my local Aussie supplier for steel now and 50x50x3mm 8m is $88, 100x50x3mm 8m is $153 both are gal steel, not sure if i am calculating this correctly about the paint but my current trailer has 20 meters of RHS a mix of 70x40 and 100x50 very old trailer so lets put that down at 20 meters of 100x50mm that i think works out to be 6 square meters of surface area, these 2k paints on ebay are claiming 11-12sq meters per litre,

    my trailer will have less steel i reckon tho as the trailer i have now has a crap load of welded sections my design will be more basic (current trailer is over engineered typical old timers )

    i thought etc primer was for aluminium i guess i need to factor that in to it is adding up but still cheaper than galvanizing and a lot less of a head ache, there are 2k paint kits on ebay for $200 but only 1L

    Edit: the problem going galvanized trailer is the cost $1000 but also i have no way of moving it plus i could buy enough aluminium or that $1000 and pay a local alloy welder $400 extra to weld the A frame and i can bolt the cross members on and have basically the same as the gal frame for similar money

    what would u do?
    I reckon the prices you are quoting for the 50X50 and 100X50 RHS will be for Duragal. Duragal is only an external coating and a very thin one at that, so not really what I would call ideal for a boat trailer. You need to make sure that your boat trailer is rigid enough to support the boat without flexing the hull as you go up the highway. Boats break on trailers, not on the water as a rule. Frankly, I would give Aluminium a wide berth as you are no where near experienced enough to reliably produce strong and safe joints on the Aluminium sections required when building a trailer and secondly, Aluminium trailer design is much more difficult and less forgiving than building from steel sections.
    While there are occasions where swimming against the tide pays off, there are others where it is smarter to follow the herd. In this case, I would follow the herd and build a sturdy trailer from primed RHS and then get it hot dipped. Make sure you think the job through and allow for all fitments, brackets and bling as any additions post galvanising will only degrade the degree of corrosion protection provided. Because you are stick welding the trailer, make triply sure that there is no slag left anywhere on the welds - you cannot galvanise slag and it doesn't come off in the pickling bath. Talk to your galvaniser and make sure everything is ventilated to their satisfaction. The initial pain of the extra cost, which will not be all that much greater than a quality paint job, will more than pay off through longer life and greater resale value.

  11. #11
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    Thanks for the advice Karl much appreciated i was hal way thru building a small 12 foot tinny trailer about a year ago and i never done anything with the aluminium i beam because i had upgraded boats so this afternoon i chopped off a length of the aluminium i beam it is 100mm or 101mm 6061 T6 from Capral and i chucked it in the 20 ton hydraulic press and sure enough it bent without and kinks, thinning of walls or cracking

    i think the aluminium path might be reopen to a all bolted trailer

    i took a video of my experience bending the i beam

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaUx2ouKntc

  12. #12
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    Sorry guys in that video i was bending the 100mm 6082 T6 NOT the 101mm 6061 T6 its a bit confusing on the Capral web site as i chucked out my receipt a long time ago and forgot which length i bought i had to put the calipers on it just now

  13. #13
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    Yonnee is offline Trailer Bloke & Mild Mannered Moderator
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    As John stated, the thing with Galvanising, they will not put any hollow section tube in a bath without 1/2" holes drilled at either end of an enclosed tube. So I wouldn't worry how "water tight" your welds are, because the Galvanising process coats inside and out anyway.
    Secondly, is it a boat trailer? I would bite the bullet and either get a freight company to take to & from the Gal place, or hire a car trailer.
    Bolt together frames are always going to give you grief by not being as strong as a welded together frame.
    Too many projects, so little time, even less money!
    Are you a registered member? Why not? click here to register. It's free and only takes 37 seconds! Doing work around the home? Wander over to our sister site, Renovate Forum, for all your renovation queries.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yonnee View Post
    As John stated, the thing with Galvanising, they will not put any hollow section tube in a bath without 1/2" holes drilled at either end of an enclosed tube. So I wouldn't worry how "water tight" your welds are, because the Galvanising process coats inside and out anyway.
    Secondly, is it a boat trailer? I would bite the bullet and either get a freight company to take to & from the Gal place, or hire a car trailer.
    Bolt together frames are always going to give you grief by not being as strong as a welded together frame.
    Yeah its for a 18 foot fiberglass boat i am restoring the trailer the boat is on is beyond repairable i paid $1000 for the trailer and got the boat off the same guy for free had no way of getting it home so had to purchase the guys trailer, the trailer is vintage era all the RHS were filled at some point but some how salt water found its way into the frame and wasn't drained i actually never seen all of the damage untill i was home and in day light the RHS is split in quiet a few locations and rusted thru its all mostly on the under side of the trailer so this trailer is pretty much just to park the boat on while i do the restore

    the hard thing about building a steel trailer is it needs to be 6 meters minimum in length and around 1.7-1.8 meters wide i have only one mate that can help out moving the trailer frame i'm not entirely sure two of us could lift a 160-200kg trailer frame and carry it a good 40 meters and than i have the problem carting it off to the galvanizer none in Sydney are cheap, the cheapest i found were in Newcastle 2-3 hour drive north or pay ransom money locally, also location to build the trailer is difficult i only have one small flat section in my yard to lay down the new steel and its all down hill

    i galvanizing didn't cost as much i would be more inclined to go with it, at the moment both the steel trailer and the aluminium trailer both have there con's of a build, the steel has the expensive cost of galvanizing and the aluminium i have the problem of cracking when i make the bends in the i beam however cost to build each trailer would be the same price roughly

    here is the boat that i need to build a trailer for, project restore isa complete bare boat hull needs everything so i am also extending the boats length by around 60cm by adding a outboard pod so i may even need a longer trailer than 6 meters
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  15. #15
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    The car trailers are measured in the bed so a 4.5m trailer is more like 6-6.5m with the drawbar, your new trailer can overhang the drawbar with its drawbar.
    i have moved many large items with trailers on my own without help it is all about how you approach it, you wont have to lift it on, the car trailers usually include a winch just winch it on.
    The difficult location that you have to build the trailer will not change if the trailer is steel / aluminium / painted or galvanised.
    I think you will be very disappointed in a few years if you do not go to the extra effort now and go down the galvanising process.

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