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  1. #46
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    Moving right along (as we're running out of winter and this thing needs to do some work before the vines wake up).

    I separated the hopper frame from the sheet metal, flipped it and began mounting it on to the chassis:
    Frame on Chassis.jpg

    I used a pair of 90mm treated pine post offcuts plus a bit of 20mm SHS to position the frame 200mm above the chassis (you can see them holding up the front of the hopper frame) and spent the best part of an hour positioning it - the whole lot collapsed three times I think. As the frame is higher than in my drawing, the support struts had to be steeper than 45 degrees, so I had to mark and cut the angles for both ends.

    Tomorrow it should be pretty quick to install the rest of the struts, and then sort out how the floor is going to fit in there.

  2. #47
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    Hi Rusty, saw this and thought you might be interested in the design. I know the price is a bit rich.



    Vineyard or Orchard Dual Side Delivery Conveyors.Sell Now - $ 4,000.00 plus GST (New $ 6,500.00 plus GST)Click here for more details and photos

    Kryn

  3. #48
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    Yeah, saw that when I was looking at how "real" spreaders are designed. If the machine ends up performing reasonably well, it actually might be worth the money.

  4. #49
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    Finished installing the support struts. The blade on my $50 Gumtree bandsaw decided to break, so I had to revert to the far less pleasant abrasive cut-off saw.

    Then came the task of flipping over the sheet-metal hopper and lowering it into the frame. I installed some lifting points made from 20 SHS in each corner, then messed around with a pair of forks on the tractor, ropes & chains. It was not a smooth nor uneventful process.

    Anyway, it's in there. In hindsight, probably should have built the support frame with a bit more clearance, but hey, tight fits are what sledge hammers are made for.

    slid in the floor, levered it up into place and held it there with a 45mm packer made from a bit of pine stud. Made for a nice tight fit, so put one on each of the 4 crossmembers and will probably leave it like that for the time being, rather than securing it with bolts as ultimately planned.

    Then I thought, bugger it, let's filler her up with mulch, for a couple of reasons, including to make sure the little tractor I plan to use can actually reach over the top - it ended up being about 1,700 high, which the tractor deals with OK, but probably wouldn't if I added a 500 high extension to the top.

    With about 2.5 m3 in it she has a bit of weight to her:
    Full of Mulch.jpg

    But all looks fairly convincing. Brought the tyre pressure up to about 250kPa (35psi) to stop her wallowing about.

    Next step is sorting out how to spin the auger. Harvested this lot (temporarily) from another machine, mainly so I can work out what's needed before venturing into the dear-as-poison world of buying hydraulic bits:
    Oily Bits.jpg

  5. #50
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    Nice work, how are you going to empty it, to be able to play with the hydraulics? Not shovel it out I hope . I only ask, as I presume that there will be welding involved to mount brackets for bearings and motor etc. Hate to see all that hard work go up in smoke .
    Kryn

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBs PensNmore View Post
    Nice work, how are you going to empty it, to be able to play with the hydraulics? Not shovel it out I hope
    Yeah, I kind of felt I was getting ahead of myself filling it up, but it did answer a lot of questions, like whether the sheet metal would bulge or deform when loaded, how the floor would hold up, whether the little tractor would actually load the hopper, which it did, but it took 16 loads to get that much in, making me think the bucket could do with some modifications to make it more efficient for loading mulch.

    I'm tossing up between modifying the bucket that's on there, or fabricating a new one...

    As for emptying it, I'm going to try welding back on the stem that connected the auger to the cheap-arsed Chinese engine and gearbox that I already have, and see if it'll spin the single section of auger I stuck in each end to stop the mulch pouring out.

    If that doesn't work, I'll try hoisting up one end with the forks to see if I can get the stuff to pour out.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyArc View Post
    Yeah, I kind of felt I was getting ahead of myself filling it up, but it did answer a lot of questions, like whether the sheet metal would bulge or deform when loaded, how the floor would hold up, whether the little tractor would actually load the hopper, which it did, but it took 16 loads to get that much in, making me think the bucket could do with some modifications to make it more efficient for loading mulch.

    I'm tossing up between modifying the bucket that's on there, or fabricating a new one...

    As for emptying it, I'm going to try welding back on the stem that connected the auger to the cheap-arsed Chinese engine and gearbox that I already have, and see if it'll spin the single section of auger I stuck in each end to stop the mulch pouring out.

    If that doesn't work, I'll try hoisting up one end with the forks to see if I can get the stuff to pour out.
    Nice to know that it all held up OK. I'd fabricate a new one, as if you modify it, and want to bucket some chicken manure or dirt, the bucket could be overloaded. If you made it wider, a bit deeper and higher, out of say 3mm it would be still light enough not to stress the tractor.
    Should you decide to raise the sides a bit more, you could mound up some dirt like a mini loading ramp, and fill it from there, particularly if the mulch is always dropped in the same place. Or another alternative is to make the top section but with a fold down section on one side, load it and then raise that section, like a trailer tailgate.
    Kryn

  8. #53
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    Well I emptied it. Eventually. I ended up joining 3 of my Chinese augers together and spinning them with a cheap-arsed Chinese post hole digger. I learned a couple of things - once the mulch is under pressure, it becomes quite rigid, and the stuff I was using was quite inclined to form a cave or void and thus stop feeding. I can only hope the motion of the trailer will help cause it to collapse and feed out, otherwise I'll need to add some kind of agitator.

    The other observation is that once the ~1.5m length of auger was fully covered with mulch, the initial torque to get it to turn was substantial, and if the trailer has been loaded, then transported some distance, which would settle and compact the mulch around the full 3m auger, it might need a huge amount of torque to get it moving. The hydraulic motor I've borrowed can deliver massive amounts of torque, but I am concerned that the auger itself may not cope with that amount of stress.

    I've got a pair of self-aligning bearings on the way to support each end of the auger. One concern is that there's a significant amount of axial thrust, as the auger is pushing quite a bit of material, so I don't know how well the bearings will hold up to that, and whether a different kind would be more appropriate.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyArc View Post
    Well I emptied it. Eventually. I ended up joining 3 of my Chinese augers together and spinning them with a cheap-arsed Chinese post hole digger. I learned a couple of things - once the mulch is under pressure, it becomes quite rigid, and the stuff I was using was quite inclined to form a cave or void and thus stop feeding. I can only hope the motion of the trailer will help cause it to collapse and feed out, otherwise I'll need to add some kind of agitator.

    The other observation is that once the ~1.5m length of auger was fully covered with mulch, the initial torque to get it to turn was substantial, and if the trailer has been loaded, then transported some distance, which would settle and compact the mulch around the full 3m auger, it might need a huge amount of torque to get it moving. The hydraulic motor I've borrowed can deliver massive amounts of torque, but I am concerned that the auger itself may not cope with that amount of stress.

    I've got a pair of self-aligning bearings on the way to support each end of the auger. One concern is that there's a significant amount of axial thrust, as the auger is pushing quite a bit of material, so I don't know how well the bearings will hold up to that, and whether a different kind would be more appropriate.

    Hi Rusty,
    Glad you managed to empty it. Has the hydraulic system got a reverse on it, that might be enough to stop it compacting while travelling to position? Just a thought.
    There used to be air operated vibrators for large hoppers (cement) that you might be able to find, to vibrate the sides loose. You might find that the small tacks on the augers will shear off, if that happens, I'd weld in some 40 heavy black pipe to assist with the torque.
    Can't help with the bearings at the moment, but if I get a chance, will try the local bearing place for an answer for you, as to what would be best.
    Have you worked out how to mount the bearings? Are they flange mount or pillow style.
    Kryn

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBs PensNmore View Post
    Hi Rusty,
    Glad you managed to empty it. Has the hydraulic system got a reverse on it, that might be enough to stop it compacting while travelling to position? Just a thought.
    There used to be air operated vibrators for large hoppers (cement) that you might be able to find, to vibrate the sides loose. You might find that the small tacks on the augers will shear off, if that happens, I'd weld in some 40 heavy black pipe to assist with the torque.
    Can't help with the bearings at the moment, but if I get a chance, will try the local bearing place for an answer for you, as to what would be best.
    Have you worked out how to mount the bearings? Are they flange mount or pillow style.
    The hydraulics I've got comprise a motor, a flow divider (to control the motor speed) and a 2-way spool valve with, importantly, an adjustable relief valve. So the motor can be reversed, but I'm not sure that will help once the mulch is settled and compacted around the the auger flights.

    With the gal pipe inside the crappy auger tube, I think it'll be strong enough...

  11. #56
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    It will decrease your hopper volume a bit, but is it worth partially covering the auger so that while it will still be full there will not be so much pressure on it from the mulch on top?

    Michael

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael G View Post
    It will decrease your hopper volume a bit, but is it worth partially covering the auger so that while it will still be full there will not be so much pressure on it from the mulch on top?
    I've been concerned the auger might tend to bow upwards in the middle by the pressure exerted by the auger on the mulch against the bottom of the floor, so had been thinking of adding the odd band over the auger to keep it down. Following on from your idea, if I added more and/or made them longer, these would cover a proportion of the auger, stopping the mulch from piling on to it, and thus reduce the load.

  13. #58
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    After issues with the U bolts coming adrift from the axle on my store bought trailer, I always fit a second nut.If u are worried about it, then that's my useless suggestion for the day.
    Frisky wife, happy life. ​Then I woke up. Oh well it was fun while it lasted.
    From an early age my father taught me to wear welding gloves . "Its not to protect your hands son, its to put out the fire when u set yourself alight".

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by jatt View Post
    I always fit a second nut.
    Not a bad idea at all - I think I'll add some lock nuts.

    Extra 2 augers arrived today which will allow me to make up the full 3m length of auger. Now just waiting for the self-aligning pillow block bearings to turn up.

    A bit concerned at the axial load that'll be on the bearing in front of the motor - it'll be seeing the load of trying to push the mulch that's in the full 3m length of auger, I'll just have to see how it copes.

    The bearings have a 25mm ID, so I'm going to weld some 25mm round bar inside the gal tube of the auger. Trying to work out how to get it axial - current plan is to weld 2 sets of 3 lumps around the part of the bar going inside the tube and file them down to fit. The other option would be to go over the road and get the local retired machinist to turn it down, but I want to save that favour once I'm past the prototype stage.

    The bits of hydraulics I stole are pretty much complete for the job except for one connection. Against my better judgement, I decided to try my local hydraulics shop, in the full knowledge that it's always eye-wateringly expensive, but I thought I was on to a cheaper (and more flexible) option by going for field attachable fittings.

    Two 9/16" female ends and 1m of 3/8" hose? $100.

    That said, if I'd got the ends crimped, it probably would have been half as much again.

    Next time? Ebay.

  15. #60
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    The moment you mention Hydraulics is like mentioning 4WDs, aircraft, etc you see $$$$$$$ in front of you. DAMHIKT
    Kryn

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