Thread: Buying your 1st Welder........where to start?

Gday all, would buying a GMC arc welder from bunnings be a god idea??? im a self constructed handyman and have done quite alot of MIG welding before and done a little bit of arc weldin. u guys reckon if i buy a GMC welder for 100 bucks, this machine will be good enough to learn and weld RHS with? cheers,

Wow what an open question with many many answers.

The only reason that I would buy a welder in this early stage of your trade is if I was going to start working for myself. Then I would go for a multiprocess unit capable of Manual Metal Arc Welding (MMAW) Stick, Gas Metal Arc Welding (GMAW) Mig, Flux Core Arc Welding (FCAW) dual shield and inner shield, Submerged Arc Welding (SAW), Gas Tungsten Arc Welding (GTAW) Tig and Carbon Arc Gouging. Lotsa $'s for a power source like this and then a good wire feeder unit to suit.

Or, a 240v inverter capable of MMAW and GTAW (mild steel and stainless), there are good uns from $1,000 to $2,000.

Are you apprenticed by someone?

Originally Posted by Stringy

Then I would go for a multiprocess unit capable of Manual Metal Arc Welding (MMAW) Stick, Gas Metal Arc Welding (GMAW) Mig, Flux Core Arc Welding (FCAW) dual shield and inner shield, Submerged Arc Welding (SAW), Gas Tungsten Arc Welding (GTAW) Tig and Carbon Arc Gouging. Lotsa $'s for a power source like this and then a good wire feeder unit to suit.

The above is a completely wrong and wildly inaccurate statement.

I hate to rain on your parade Stringy, but MMAW and GMAW just for starters are completely different power sources having vastly different operating characteristics. Do the terms constant voltage and constant current have any meaning for you?

We are a very long way from seeing such a machine by virtue of the diverse applications of these processes. If by some minuscule chance I am completely wrong, give us a example of a machine that has all of the functions you mentioned.

Please do everyone the favor of not making statements about welding processes you appear to know very little about . It tends to confuse the new guys and annoy the dickens out of those do know their stuff.

Grumpy
Grahame

Um well, for most of my trade (1980 on) I have been using various Lincoln DC 600's, Lincoln diesel SAM 400s, which have a little switch on the front to go from CC to CV and with addition of a good wire feeder and handpieces will run all of the processes listed, there is a problem that the DC 600 won't turn down lower than about 100 amps though, but there are ways to get around this! Used a couple of 500amp inverters recently as well and yep you can actually switch them from cc to cv, you can also pick them up without a crane.

Wow and to think I may be the only one blessed to have experienced this new teknonogy!

Betta go look for some examples I spose.

I have just started loaning books from the library again.
At the moment I am reading "modern welding" (1980 edition).
I thought that there were about half a dozen types of welding- what an ignorant person . In this older book there are over 20 types including explosion welding, laser beam welding, friction welding and ultrasonic welding, wierd and amazing stuff.

Originally Posted by Unit_01

would buying a GMC arc welder from bunnings be a god idea?
this machine will be good enough to learn and weld RHS with? cheers,

Hi Unit,
I agree with what BobL said.
Used within its limits this little machine will weld Rectangular hollow section sucessfully.Personally I would not ask a new guy to weld anything less than 2.4 wt and certainly not the duragal version.It your asking it to intermittently perform short welding tasks on light stock thats what it will do. If have used one of the little GMC units for half a day and found no fault with it.

For a home DIY guy it will suit for light tasks.
Don't ask it to work from a twenty meter lead and expect to weld 10mm or 12mm plate.

Most problems arise from operators not understanding the capabilities of their machines.

Grahame

"OOOh" now lets have a look at a Lincoln Idealarc DC600 multi process unit.

"Designed for high productivity applications in MIG, FCAW, MMAW, TIG, SAW and carbon arc gouging"

http://www.industrysearch.com.au/Pro...c_DC-600-17847

There is also an multi process 350amp inverter, but if one of these units is to be considered then I would'nt go below 500amp for the gouging capability.

Suprisingly the DC600 is a common machine and I have seen them sold second hand for around $2,000, so definetly not out of reach for contractor, 63amp/3phase power supply is about minimum though.

Stringy,
My aplogies
Sorry I came across a bit hard but for goodness sake its a diy board.People here are trying to get a handle on the basics .I think its our job as metals tradies to steer them on to something useful techniques and applicable equipment
They do not yet make a machine that has all of the processes you mentioned.

I may well be heading towards dinosaur status but still understand my machines.

The Miller machines came close for a while but I understand they suffered a lot of board problems and wiring problems for a while.I haven't heard if that was resolved yet
Kemppi and Fronious are the companies to watch.

Grahame

Graheme,

This thread was started with a very open question from what I understand to be a beginner mature age apprentice, realistic options were presented from both ends of the spectrum!

Still, after being presented with a list of processes which match the list given by myself in my original post you refuse to accept that one power source will perform all of these processes. The Lincoln site for starters shows several!

Oh well for some ignorance is bliss!

Anyway back to welders.

Yes, that is the problem, Lou asked a question about buying a welder suitable for use by a tradesman or someone who will be one by doing an aprrenticeship. He does not need a handyman welder, he needs a welder that will be a big step above that. I like the reply suggesting he should do an evening course to learn to weld when he is just starting an apprenticeship to do just that. Lou talk to your new workmates and tech teachers, those in the trade will advise you best. I am not convinced you need one yet at your stage of experience.

Stringy.
It obvious that you were right.You have my unreserved apology.
Grahame

Originally Posted by BobL

So are we upset about the helmet or the welder

If you look at my post I did say buy some decent PPE!

I've taken a few cheap and expensive stick welders apart in my time. There's not that much to them, they're basically a big transformer. The more expensive ones have a bigger transformer, some have added circuitry and maybe cooling (but in one way that's just more to go wrong). There is nothing inherently unsafe about the cheaper ones if they are used according to instructions. A common mistake is buying a $100 welder and expecting to weld 1/2" steel plate with it. No one starting out learning should be starting on with 1/2" steel plate - that's where and old bed frame is a better choice.

It all really depends what you want to do and your attitude to tool purchase. Unlike ww tools I have much less of an attachment to metal working tools as to me they are just a means to an end. Of course if you have a block or a farm or a business with some heavy duty action in mind then your decisions will also probably be different. But if you are a suburban home handyman just starting out you can do a sheet load of stuff with a $100 welder.

Even if you have some idea about what you're doing the $100 welder has some virtues. I had a beaut Copper Core CIG 140A welder I paid $160 for about 30 years ago (that's probably equivalent to $500 today). I used this welder to learn and then fixed up and made heaps of things with. When it finally died about 2 years ago I had to decide about what to replace it with. I already have access to all manner of welders at work and at BILs place so just needed to have something in my shed to do small things with. The $100 welder I decided on has been fine. So far I have made a portable campfire-BBQ, a pair of low saw horses, this small mill, rails and steel bits for the BIL mill, a resaw rig for a TS, and countless other big and small fixes.

Yes the $100 welder is somewhat on the flimsy side given the amount of use I have put it through but if it dies tomorrow I figure I have easily got my money's worth from it.

Cheers

No worries Bob I did say I was no expert didnt I? I will now shut up eh

Grahame,

Accepted & No problem.

One of these 500amp inverters I used recently may have been a Kempi and the other was a Buffalo. The Kempi's are a popular reliable machine, with quite a few of them around this area.

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If only everyone in the world handled themsleves like Grahame and Stringy did in this thread there'd be few serious conflicts.

My hat is especially off to you Grahame for your decent apology.

I just purchased a Weldmaster 195, and it will more than adequately suit MY needs. I do primarily automotive body fabrication, panel, chassis and customisation work. It has 12 power settings, spot timer and adjustable trim pot on circuit board for burn back adjustment. This along with a reasonable industry product name, price and support have made my decision. Differs for many.