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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
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    Sunshine Coast, QLD
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    9

    Question Abicor Binzel MB Pro v's Unimig Binzel Style torches

    Hi All,

    I'm a noob so I don't have the years of product knowledge to call BS on this topic ...

    When I enquired about a second torch for my Unimig MIG welder that I'd dedicate to aluminium welding, the mob I was talking with strongly suggested that I choose the "vastly superior" Abicor torch over the Unimig torch. So identically configured torches put the Abicor version about $100 higher than the Unimig. The trouble for me is that when I look at the parts explosions in the various product brochures the units look very similar aside from the colour and shape of the plastic handle.

    I'm happy to pay the extra money for a better product but I loath being the victim of a sales pitch for a higher margin sale.

    Any thoughts will be greatly appreciated.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    NSW
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    586

    Default

    Put the $100 difference aside for a sec, and consider this:
    Abicor binzel make welding torches, and have for 75 years. There is a reason why every other torch out there copies them - they are the best.
    I've seen some shockers of knock-offs claiming to be equivalent. I've even dismantled / repaired a few. On balance, binzel gear is superior in manufacturing quality. The contact tips, tip adapters, nozzles- all have superior machining, no burrs- proper work as a craftsman would expect to do themselves. The genuine tips are proper copper alloys, particularly the CCZ range- which last MUCH longer on the gun compared to the cheap copies. Diffusers last way better as well- if you can source the binzel HD diffusers, they are the duck's nuts, will last for yonks.

    One copy torch I pulled apart has the most anaemic looking brass block and torch connection I think I've ever seen. I'ts way easier to be $100-200 cheaper, and save a heap of coin in all the internal things you cannot see than actually try to make a proper trade quality tool. FWIW - the welding power runs thru a braid in the torch cable - I can only imagine how much gets skimped on in that part- affecting voltage drop, lower duty cycles etc.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Sunshine Coast, QLD
    Posts
    9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Commander_Keen View Post
    Put the $100 difference aside for a sec, and consider this:
    Abicor binzel make welding torches, and have for 75 years. There is a reason why every other torch out there copies them - they are the best.
    I've seen some shockers of knock-offs claiming to be equivalent. I've even dismantled / repaired a few. On balance, binzel gear is superior in manufacturing quality. The contact tips, tip adapters, nozzles- all have superior machining, no burrs- proper work as a craftsman would expect to do themselves. The genuine tips are proper copper alloys, particularly the CCZ range- which last MUCH longer on the gun compared to the cheap copies. Diffusers last way better as well- if you can source the binzel HD diffusers, they are the duck's nuts, will last for yonks.

    One copy torch I pulled apart has the most anaemic looking brass block and torch connection I think I've ever seen. I'ts way easier to be $100-200 cheaper, and save a heap of coin in all the internal things you cannot see than actually try to make a proper trade quality tool. FWIW - the welding power runs thru a braid in the torch cable - I can only imagine how much gets skimped on in that part- affecting voltage drop, lower duty cycles etc.
    Thanks.

    As I said, I'm happy to pay for something that's better. I'm not trying to factor cost benefit or business efficiency into an accounting equation. I've seen so many "BINZEL" accessories and torches that I wouldn't touch with a barge pole .. that's why I was specifically asking about the Unimig stuff and not the generic rubbish (maybe you see Unimig as part of the generic rubbish - I'm still a noob and yet to decide)

    Your comments have given me at least enough confidence to try one! If you have a reliable Oz source (or other online) for Abicor Binzel consumables please share it as the seeming lack of local support and supply is probably my biggest source of hesitancy.

    Thanks

    Kev

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    NSW
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    586

    Default

    Genuine binzels can be had from most decent welding shop. I've bought mine from BOC in the past. The ones I've visited usually have a ship-load of spares for all the guns.
    If I remember correct the boxes it come in are a black box with the binzel "B" logo all over it.

    Worth mentioning different torches have a different duty cycle at different amp ratings. Make sure you are working in the right amp range, and duty for your aluminium job. Plus a bit of headroom for the extra stresses of aluminium welding. Get yourself a teflon liner for it as well. Some torches have the option for the proper aluminium specific contact tips (better lead-in angles to the back of the tip, and better machining on the tip bore so it doesn't bind).

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    33

    Thumbs up

    I was under the impression that Abicor licenses its design to other manufacturers who make their own parts to Abicor design, hence the commonly used term "Binzel style". Unimig is likely to have decent torches though?

    My Lincoln welder came with a genuine Binzel 15 torch and I have upgraded to a Binzel 24 torch with 5m cable. Can't fault em.

    Cheers
    Frank

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Sunshine Coast, QLD
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    9

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Commander_Keen View Post
    Genuine binzels can be had from most decent welding shop. I've bought mine from BOC in the past.
    Good call on BOC. There's very little near me apart from Total Tools and Trade Tools and I hadn't considered that BOC probably sold online! I'd resorted to looking at the big online welding sites but they seem to cherry pick the ranges.

    Thanks

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    33

    Default

    National Welding stocks genuine Binzel products as well. They are in western Sydney.


    Cheers
    Frank

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    NSW
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    Default

    It's funny isn't it kev. I've shopped with national welding, Silverwater welding, Hampdon's industrial, oz welding supplies, IWS, Days industrial, and probably some others I can't remember. I used to import some stuff from overseas which could be cheaper, but these days shipping times are rooted- so actual shops with shopfronts can be better in some ways. Sometimes it's good to be told what you need, rather than spending hours on the internet with analysis paralysis weighing up options which have a cost benefit difference measured in cents

    I've found the BOC shops sell good gear at a honest price, and a pretty solid range for most stuff. Your wouldn't know it looking at the place from the outside- so I know that you mean when you say you don't think of them for that kind of stuff. There's usually a store not too far from most jobs worth doing, and even some of their little independent gas distributors sell or can get their hands on BOC equipment. They probably get a discount or kickback or something, as prices from what I remember are usually about the same. There was a neat little mob in armadale that did some good gear- knew their stuff and would probably have sourced me striped paint and a long weight if I'd asked.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Sunshine Coast, QLD
    Posts
    9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Commander_Keen View Post
    It's funny isn't it kev. I've shopped with national welding, Silverwater welding, Hampdon's industrial, oz welding supplies, IWS, Days industrial, and probably some others I can't remember. I used to import some stuff from overseas which could be cheaper, but these days shipping times are rooted- so actual shops with shopfronts can be better in some ways. Sometimes it's good to be told what you need, rather than spending hours on the internet with analysis paralysis weighing up options which have a cost benefit difference measured in cents

    I've found the BOC shops sell good gear at a honest price, and a pretty solid range for most stuff. Your wouldn't know it looking at the place from the outside- so I know that you mean when you say you don't think of them for that kind of stuff. There's usually a store not too far from most jobs worth doing, and even some of their little independent gas distributors sell or can get their hands on BOC equipment. They probably get a discount or kickback or something, as prices from what I remember are usually about the same. There was a neat little mob in armadale that did some good gear- knew their stuff and would probably have sourced me striped paint and a long weight if I'd asked.
    Buddy your BOC comment just struck double gold for me. I've been struggling to find a metal supplier and searching for a nearby BOC agent took me to a metal supplier at Gympie that isn't just a fabricator with a side line of selling over priced steel and their own unused scrap!

    WINNER WINNER CHICKEN DINNER!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    NSW
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    allegedly, at some establishments, a cold six-pack on a friday arvo would grant one rights to claim their weight in offcuts out of the scrap bin...
    If you're learning, probably a good place to start for cheep.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2022
    Location
    Earth
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    Quote Originally Posted by Commander_Keen View Post
    allegedly, at some establishments, a cold six-pack on a friday arvo would grant one rights to claim their weight in offcuts out of the scrap bin...
    If you're learning, probably a good place to start for cheep.
    Love it - thank you.

    I'm probably about to be banned for the second time under a second id for calling out criminal price gouging so I'd like to say thanks for the posts I've read from you across the forum .. they've been illuminating and educational.

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