Thread: Binzel Type MIG Torches MB24 KD versus MB25 AK

I have noticed that there are two medium sized Binzel Style MIG torches commonly for sale that have similar specifications but different construction. The MB 24KD is similar to the larger MB36 KD while the MB25 AK has similar construction to the smaller MB15 AK. I have searched the WEB for a comparison without luck.

Can anyone advise
1. Why are the two made and sold
2. Is one a cheaper/simpler or more recent development
3. the advantages or disadvantages of either.
Thanks
Ron

Firstly, the 24 and 36 are similar design, as in how they it together, but the 24 is smaller in size. 36 can run M6 or M8 gear (contact tips), the 24 is M6 only.

The 25 is a bit of an odd-ball. It's duty cycle is between the MB15 and the 24.
Going off memory, the MB25 is 200A at 60% duty, MB24 is 220A @ 60%. Talking mixed gas numbers, like most would be using. CO2 improves this number, 'gasless' will drastically reduce the duty, as no chilling effect from the shielding gas.

The 25 uses the cylindrical smaller M6 contact tips, the 24 uses the stubby but larger M6 style - more thermal mass in bigger tips = less disruption to heat, less annealing and less contact tip wear.
25 has an integral contact tip holder/diffuser, these are two separate but replaceable parts in the 24, with the 24 being a ceramic style that can be replaced easily if/when clogged.

IMO MB25 is older tech, more complicated, and less duty. Never bought a 25, so can't comment on price comparison.
I run a 24 on my 180A mig, which is more than plenty, even with pulse or gasless work. I think the parts availability on the 24 series torch is better than the 25, in my experience.

Originally Posted by Commander_Keen

The 25 uses the cylindrical smaller M6 contact tips, the 24 uses the stubby but larger M6 style - more thermal mass in bigger tips = less disruption to heat, less annealing and less contact tip wear.
25 has an integral contact tip holder/diffuser, these are two separate but replaceable parts in the 24, with the 24 being a ceramic style that can be replaced easily if/when clogged.

IMO MB25 is older tech, more complicated, and less duty. Never bought a 25, so can't comment on price comparison.
I run a 24 on my 180A mig, which is more than plenty, even with pulse or gasless work. I think the parts availability on the 24 series torch is better than the 25, in my experience.

That's not correct, I've always used the conical shaped tips with the mb25 and mb24, they use the same tips.

I've never had issues with the mb25 diffuser but have replaced many broken mb24 diffusers in the past.

I prefer the mb25 as the nozzle always stays centered and is easy to remove.

With repeated on and off removal of an mb24 nozzle the surface on the torch neck eventually wears out and the nozzle become difficult to stay on center, your only option would be to replace the neck.

Also the nozzles are sometimes difficult to remove compared to the mb25. The mb25 has a spring setup which makes nozzle removal easy.

I am not not how the mb25 is old tech or how it is complicated. I've never had problems getting consumables.

I've used both for many years and prefer the mb25.




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Originally Posted by ronboult

I have noticed that there are two medium sized Binzel Style MIG torches commonly for sale that have similar specifications but different construction. The MB 24KD is similar to the larger MB36 KD while the MB25 AK has similar construction to the smaller MB15 AK. I have searched the WEB for a comparison without luck.

Can anyone advise
1. Why are the two made and sold
2. Is one a cheaper/simpler or more recent development
3. the advantages or disadvantages of either.
Thanks
Ron

From what i gather they are basically designed to run at different amps i.e the 24kd will do 220amp and mb36 will do 320amp + run different gas mixtures and higher duty cycles machines compared to the smaller machines.

Hi Iron triangle Unfortunately you seem to have misread my original post.
I understand the difference between the MB 24Kd and MB36 KD.
but what I realy was after was the differences between MB24KD and MB25AK which seem to be very minor variations on the same Torch

Thanks for the replies but I am still confused.

Both the MB24 and MB25 are referred to as Binzel style torches so presumably the were originally designed/manufactured by Binzel. Both are still listed on the Abicor/Binzel web site. but there is little information provided on there intended use.

The fact that the MB 25 AK is slightly lower rated and based on the MB15AK design suggests that it is somehow of lower quality.

I still wonder why Binzel designed both and which came first

Cheers
Ron

To simplify - and hopefully give you the answer you seek:

I am talking on Genuine Binzel specs. All bets are off when we start talking Binzel copies.

1) Intended use - the 24 and 25 are both air cooled MIG/MAG torches. That's about as deep as you need to look into it. The type of welding / material you are welding will determine how you build your gun (eg teflon liner for aluminium)
2) Duty cycle - MB25 has a lower amp rating at a 60% duty cycle (200A vs 220 for the MB24)
3) Nozzle/diffuser design differs - some may appreciate one style over another. My comment on complicated is that the price of some of the 'all in one' diffuser / contact tip adapter parts can be horrendous. I priced up some abimig (all-in-one) diffusers once, and they were north of $35 each. Lots of brass and lots of machining time goes into them, compared with the 24 style which is cheap and plentiful. replacing a caked up ceramic diffuser for a few bucks is easier than a spatter-choked brass piece.
4) which came first / why they were designed... maybe call Binzel to find out - I really don't know, and don't think it's of consequence.

Buy both and tell us what you prefer!