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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Mid North Coast NSW
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    45
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    177

    Default Bitten the bullet

    And after about 7 years of 'gonna' I have bought a AC/DC tig... I was looking at the pro units, ie Transtig, Kemppi, BOC etc but ultimately I can't justify spending 5-8 times more for similar features. And the 'made in China' hype doesn't worry me either due to practically everything being made in China, don't see people whinging that their $2500 LCD tv is made in China...

    I bought a Token Tools unit, just the standard 200Amp job also marketed by Unimig, Weldmaster, BOC et al. Delivered price comes in at just under $880 makes it pretty affordable for most blokes.

    As someone who tigs all day every day I look forward to giving some thoughts from that perspective as to how this unit goes.

    On a side note - I welded a 80NB 316L pipe to plate today using some of the Cigweld 316L-17 2.5mm electrodes. Damn sweet! Wish I had been doing the stick thing a bit more!!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    Mid North Coast NSW
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    45
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    177

    Default

    Well the auction ended Tuesday night, I paid Wednesday morning and today a big box arrived. The welder was very well packed and taped to the unit itself was a 'test certificate' not the usual chinese test certificate but one done up by Arc Industry, the seller of the Token Tools welders. Haven't switched it on yet as haven't had a chance.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Mackay North Qld
    Posts
    6,446

    Default

    Photos Ben, We want photos.
    Cheers

    Grahame

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    Mid North Coast NSW
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    45
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    Default

    Pics to come.

    However today I took the welder to work to show my boss and I ended up using it for all my welding jobs today.

    Suffice to say, I am very happy with the machine. The service from Peter at Token Tools has been fantastic.

    Two things I would change though (and probably will after warranty has expired) - The pot that controls the current is too sensitive, small movements can result in big current changes. So I would change that for a multi-turn pot. Secondly the pot that changes the Pulse Frequency seems to be 'off'. Today I had an arc going whilst I turned the pot. I turned it nearly fully clockwise and could still see the flashes of the pulse before the frequency suddenly took off to the 300Hz max. If you can still perceive the flashes then it is under 25Hz, so a big frequency change for very small movement. I would replace that pot with a multi-turn logarithmic model with a locking collar, that way you can set the frequency accurately using a multimeter then lock it down. Higher pulse frequencies can be used to help shape the arc for certain types of welds.

    Other than that, yes very happy with my purchase.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Mid North Coast NSW
    Age
    45
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    177

    Default

    Here is the machine sitting on my bench at work

    Attachment 139069

    A couple of examples of tacks, the first is using the scratch start tig we are provided at work

    Attachment 139070

    and now using the cheap as chips tig that also has HF start

    Attachment 139071

    And a quick example of something 'typical' of what I do. It is all 316L, a piece of 76mm tube with a disc of 1.6mm fused to it with a very small weld. Around 1mm leg length. Then the tub is chucked in the lathe and the centre machined out. This gives a welded on flange with very little distortion. Usually this is used as a spacer before a electrical terminal box. The job has been sandblasted as per customer requirement in this case.

    Attachment 139072

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Silverdale
    Age
    67
    Posts
    26

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BenM78 View Post
    Pics to come.


    Two things I would change though (and probably will after warranty has expired) - The pot that controls the current is too sensitive, small movements can result in big current changes. So I would change that for a multi-turn pot. Secondly the pot that changes the Pulse Frequency seems to be 'off'. Today I had an arc going whilst I turned the pot. I turned it nearly fully clockwise and could still see the flashes of the pulse before the frequency suddenly took off to the 300Hz max. If you can still perceive the flashes then it is under 25Hz, so a big frequency change for very small movement. I would replace that pot with a multi-turn logarithmic model with a locking collar, that way you can set the frequency accurately using a multimeter then lock it down. Higher pulse frequencies can be used to help shape the arc for certain types of welds.

    Other than that, yes very happy with my purchase.
    I'm interested in this thread as I'd like to purchase a Tig but didn't think I'd get one worth having for under a grand. Problem I have is I'd be learning on it so I wouldn't have picked up on the problems you just mentioned. Do you think that they're reliable enough to learn on (reliable is probably a poor choice of words but you know what I mean). Also how much will those modifications add to the cost??

    Tx
    Bob
    __________________________________________
    A closed mouth gathers no feet. Anon 2009

  7. #7
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    Oct 2008
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    Mid North Coast NSW
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by notenoughtoys View Post
    I'm interested in this thread as I'd like to purchase a Tig but didn't think I'd get one worth having for under a grand. Problem I have is I'd be learning on it so I wouldn't have picked up on the problems you just mentioned.

    I wouldn't regard the knob sensitivity as a 'problem' just something that I feel could be better - in no way affects the function of the machine

    Do you think that they're reliable enough to learn on (reliable is probably a poor choice of words but you know what I mean).

    Bit hard to comment on reliability after a week of ownership - but I'd be interested if you could find a forum post stating that the poster's own machine of this type had died.


    Also how much will those modifications add to the cost??

    I would change the pots myself, maybe a max of $5 and a bit of time - but again not really necessary unless you are previously spoiled by using big name brand welders.


    Tx
    Bob
    These machines are aimed at blokes in the shed wanting to learn or just to increase their home capability without spending a fortune. Treat them as an industrial machine and I am sure you'll have problems - eg the little Esseti inverters we use at work - every few months a blast with the airgun reveals just how much grinding dust and other crap collects inside them. I will be making up a cover for my machine so the long periods of inactivity in the shed won't result in future problems.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Silverdale
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BenM78 View Post
    These machines are aimed at blokes in the shed wanting to learn or just to increase their home capability without spending a fortune. Treat them as an industrial machine and I am sure you'll have problems - eg the little Esseti inverters we use at work - every few months a blast with the airgun reveals just how much grinding dust and other crap collects inside them. I will be making up a cover for my machine so the long periods of inactivity in the shed won't result in future problems.
    Tx, that's what I was wondering. When I said reliability, I meant user friendly, ie could an amatuer use it as he learned.

    Bob
    __________________________________________
    A closed mouth gathers no feet. Anon 2009

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Ballina, NSW
    Posts
    900

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by notenoughtoys View Post
    Tx, that's what I was wondering. When I said reliability, I meant user friendly, ie could an amatuer use it as he learned.
    Bob
    As a complete amateur with TIG - I was more than happy with my TT machine - the manual won't help much at all, but with a couple of hours reading/watching on the internet and some tips from the good folks on this forum I had no trouble working out what dials do what, starting settings, appropriate adjustments, etc.

    I agree with BenM re the sensitivity of some of the adjustments, but it hasn't really been an issue for me. Once adjusted, the settings seem stable.
    I also agree regarding the excellent customer service provided by Peter at TT.

    I thought I'd thow in a couple of photos. My welds aren't the prettiest but good enough and shows that you can be a novice with a cheap machine and still make stuff. The monkey bars were my first project - Probably after an hour (ever) of tig practice. The close up is covered by powdercoat, but you can see the weld does the job, although there's a bit of undercutting (I found the tight radius welds particularly challenging). The other photo is more recent (after 1 bottle of gas = 7 hours welding) - again far from perfect but I wasn't particularly trying to be either. So notenoughtoys - go for it I reckon.

    Cheers

    - Mick

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Mid North Coast NSW
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    45
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    177

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WelderMick View Post
    As a complete amateur with TIG - I was more than happy with my TT machine - the manual won't help much at all, but with a couple of hours reading/watching on the internet and some tips from the good folks on this forum I had no trouble working out what dials do what, starting settings, appropriate adjustments, etc.

    I agree with BenM re the sensitivity of some of the adjustments, but it hasn't really been an issue for me. Once adjusted, the settings seem stable.
    I also agree regarding the excellent customer service provided by Peter at TT.

    I thought I'd thow in a couple of photos. My welds aren't the prettiest but good enough and shows that you can be a novice with a cheap machine and still make stuff. The monkey bars were my first project - Probably after an hour (ever) of tig practice. The close up is covered by powdercoat, but you can see the weld does the job, although there's a bit of undercutting (I found the tight radius welds particularly challenging). The other photo is more recent (after 1 bottle of gas = 7 hours welding) - again far from perfect but I wasn't particularly trying to be either. So notenoughtoys - go for it I reckon.

    Cheers

    - Mick
    It's funny, those welds are just fine compared with some of the crap I have seen on metal 'joins' I have seen coming out of china on kids toys!

    Mild Steel does tend to undercut more as it seems to pull quickly towards the bead centre of the weld area. Just need to jam more filler in there and turn the amps down a little. That said, undercut is my current little demon trying to get 2G welds done for Advanced Tig at Tech. Welding MS is a little different to what I am used to!

    As for the manual, don't expect it to teach you how to weld. Even the Tafe module books don't do a particularly good job of that - It's a case of "weld a little, change settings, weld a little" then when you have done a couple of kilometres of welds you'll ask yourself what the fuss was about!

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    Default

    Just discovered that pulse mode works in MMA, not sure if this is of benefit, but may be of interest to some!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    805

    Default

    Nice one Ben, I too am a happy Token Tools TIG owner. There are a few of us on this forum now. Ive put an E sized bottle of gas through mine and it has performed very well....hasnt missed a beat.

  13. #13
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    Aug 2007
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    Silverdale
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BenM78 View Post

    I bought a Token Tools unit, just the standard 200Amp job also marketed by Unimig, Weldmaster, BOC et al. Delivered price comes in at just under $880 makes it pretty affordable for most blokes.
    Where did you get it at that price?? The only AC DC Tigs on token tools site start at $2350 and I can't find them on Ebay???

    Thanks
    Bob
    __________________________________________
    A closed mouth gathers no feet. Anon 2009

  14. #14
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    Oct 2008
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by notenoughtoys View Post
    Where did you get it at that price?? The only AC DC Tigs on token tools site start at $2350 and I can't find them on Ebay???

    Thanks
    Bob
    eBay Australia Shop - Arcindustry Welding Equipment: DC TIG Welders, AC DC TIG Welders, Welding Carts

    As with any repetitive item on ebay, bide your time and don't get caught up in bidding wars. Would probably be able to get it cheaper than what I did eg one sold on June 14 for $713 plus delivery of $68 so another hundred cheaper than I got it for.

  15. #15
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    Aug 2007
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BenM78 View Post
    eBay Australia Shop - Arcindustry Welding Equipment: DC TIG Welders, AC DC TIG Welders, Welding Carts

    As with any repetitive item on ebay, bide your time and don't get caught up in bidding wars. Would probably be able to get it cheaper than what I did eg one sold on June 14 for $713 plus delivery of $68 so another hundred cheaper than I got it for.
    Tx mate, currently $33, wouldn't that be nice .

    I'll see how I go.
    __________________________________________
    A closed mouth gathers no feet. Anon 2009

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