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clear out
25th Sep 2021, 03:18 PM
A mate who’s doing it a bit tough has bought a Toyota Lightace and possibly started down a rabbit hole.
Its a grey import, which he didn’t realise till he went to buy bits for it.

Anyhu latest drama some clown has used a cold chisel to try and remove a mag wheel nut.
They are normally undone with a 12mm Allen head adapter for a wheel brace.
Studs seam a bit long so 12mm Allen head doesn’t get much grip, probably the start of the problem.
I’ve suggested welding something onto the damaged area but that will only give a quarter turn at best. Or a Allen driver into the nut.
This plus the heat from the welding may enable the nut to be started.
Any thoughts?
He is talking about drilling the stud out in situ but this seems like hard work to me?
I’ve given it a swirt of reuducter bolt buster which I use for frozen stuff myself.
H.
Photos show new nut and Allen driver,
Damaged nut on wheel.
Driver in undamaged nut for depth of engagement.

China
25th Sep 2021, 03:31 PM
Just split the nut length wise with a cold chisel or if you have access a air hammer, stud is most likely damaged and will need to be replaced

BRADFORD
25th Sep 2021, 04:35 PM
Just split the nut length wise with a cold chisel or if you have access a air hammer, stud is most likely damaged and will need to be replaced

I think that this would be very difficult without damaging the wheel.

I would weld a bolt that just fits into the socket ,12mm? , as stated above the heat may well loosen the nut and hopefully it should be able to be undone using a spanner on the head of the bolt.
Whatever you do will require care not to damage the wheel.
Good luck.

Ropetangler
25th Sep 2021, 04:50 PM
With the limited access available, it might be difficult to split the nut with a cold chisel, I think that I would go with welding something onto the nut. If the nut was ground out with a rotary burr in the weld area, it should be possible to weld a 12mm bolt to the nut, and if the bolt was ground out with a U or V shape for the weld, it should be possible to get a full turn on the bolt, without running into clearance issues. After a partial turn, more weld could be added to the newly exposed section. Any lumps could be ground down or even left there if not too bad, although they would scratch the wheel a bit. A tig welder might be pretty handy here if you have one available and have the necessary expertise to use it. Good luck
Edit: Bradford well and truly beat me to it.:)

SurfinNev
25th Sep 2021, 06:06 PM
If you let me know what the Model and Frame numbers are for the vehicle, I can help with part number searches.

droog
25th Sep 2021, 06:50 PM
There are wheel nut removers but they need space to go over the nut which you do not have. If the intent is to reuse the wheels then I would probably drill the stud as well.

Handyjack
25th Sep 2021, 08:44 PM
What ever method you use, I would suggest that the other wheel nuts, or at least the adjoining ones are on and done up tight. This might relieve a fraction of tension on the problem nut.

wheelinround
26th Sep 2021, 08:50 AM
Not sure pne will fit but a stud removal tool might be worth giiving a try

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/174804936149?chn=ps&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1wp0LoVRkSVS3gdZKZQZd6A87&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=705-139619-5960-0&mkcid=2&itemid=174804936149&targetid=1395287513209&device=t&mktype=pla&googleloc=9068943&poi=&campaignid=14473186233&mkgroupid=132282299491&rlsatarget=pla-1395287513209&abcId=9300654&merchantid=7364522&gclid=Cj0KCQjwkbuKBhDRARIsAALysV7wUtEV08tbq2WOhygG0BP9D-szCC4zl1_Wbhs3xoxvIuK-V9tRQOAaAjd2EALw_wcB
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clear out
26th Sep 2021, 12:42 PM
Thanks Ray and everyone else for your input.
I guess we’ll be having a go at this next week.
That stud remover will probably be needed as we’re sure to mangle the stud getting the nut off.
H.

droog
26th Sep 2021, 12:58 PM
Thanks Ray and everyone else for your input.
I guess we’ll be having a go at this next week.
That stud remover will probably be needed as we’re sure to mangle the stud getting the nut off.
H.


Most wheel studs are interference push fit with splines and a head on the backside, you press them in and out. Do not use a stud remover to attempt to unscrew it.

394151

Simplicity
26th Sep 2021, 01:12 PM
Most wheel studs are interference push fit with splines and a head on the backside, you press them in and out. Do not use a stud remover to attempt to unscrew it.

394151

Droog,

Is right on the money, I would be trying to use a cold chisel to split the nut.
I’ve done this many times in a past career(Panel Beater).
Granted it’s not easy,you do need to be careful especially if your trying to safe the wheel.
And the chisel needs to be sharp, an it can be difficult.
Once the wheel is removed you can then knock the stud through, from the front with a heavy punch an hammer.

Cheers Matt.

Chas
26th Sep 2021, 06:30 PM
Droog,

Is right on the money, I would be trying to use a cold chisel to split the nut.
I’ve done this many times in a past career(Panel Beater).
Granted it’s not easy,you do need to be careful especially if your trying to safe the wheel.
And the chisel needs to be sharp, an it can be difficult.
Once the wheel is removed you can then knock the stud through, from the front with a heavy punch an hammer.

Cheers Matt.

I totally agree, except that a slightly blunt chisel will be better if you are trying to undo the nut rather than split it. Another way, provided that you can remove the brake caliper with the wheel in place, is to undo the axle nut and remove the hub and wheel from the axle as a unit. You will then have access to the flange of the wheel stud which can be drilled or ground away, allowing the body of the stud to be punched forward thru the hub. This may not work if the brake rotor is fastened to the hub with screws.

Chas.

wheelinround
27th Sep 2021, 05:32 PM
Sorry henry I meant to use the stud remove on the nut. As has been said studs for wheels are spline fitted.

Dremel grind or similar 2 sides of the nut as far through as possible then split it.

droog
27th Sep 2021, 08:38 PM
Sorry henry I meant to use the stud remove on the nut.


The nut is located well below the surface of the wheel for more than 50% of its circumference, there are specific tools just for this purpose but if the aim is to reuse the wheel none of them will work in this case.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/311505369471

Chas
28th Sep 2021, 06:25 PM
The nut is located well below the surface of the wheel for more than 50% of its circumference, there are specific tools just for this purpose but if the aim is to reuse the wheel none of them will work in this case.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/311505369471

It might be possible to cut the stud out of the centre of the nut by using an end-mill of the same size as the stud and held in an electric drill. As the stud is heat treated, this will not be easy. Another thought is to use a carbide drill in the same manner.

Chas.

Ropetangler
28th Sep 2021, 06:57 PM
Easier to just weld a bolt to the nut and then just undo it. Plenty of my old boiler making mates would have it out in no time. The stud would most likely be good to go again, but shortening it a bit may be prudent if being too long was the cause of a lack of engagement with a hex key.

wheelinround
7th Oct 2021, 08:13 AM
Left hand drill, easy out impact driver

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clear out
7th Oct 2021, 12:11 PM
Hi Ray,
If we did that, it would be drilling the nut I guess, so would need to be a drill bigger than 1/2”.
My mate hasn’t got back to me but he has read all your suggestions and says thanks.:2tsup:

I’m not chasing him on this as it could turn out to be ‘interesting’.:D

H.

racingtadpole
13th Oct 2021, 07:10 PM
Bit late to the party but..
Id be grinding the head off the stud and belting it out from the back with a punch

LexD
13th Oct 2021, 08:25 PM
Bit late to the party but..
Id be grinding the head off the stud and belting it out from the back with a punch


How would you get to it?

racingtadpole
13th Oct 2021, 08:50 PM
Die grinder and long burr if necessary
Yeah my punch it out from the back idea needs a bit more sophistication, a small threaded expansion jack placed between the disc and the stud. If that’s not possible drill and tap it from the front and put a bolt into it and get a slide hammer onto it.

If you can get the head off the stud getting it out is somewhat less problematic.

Depending on how worn the rotors were I’d consider just drilling through it to get a drift in :o

LexD
13th Oct 2021, 10:23 PM
Die grinder and long burr if necessary
Yeah my punch it out from the back idea needs a bit more sophistication, a small threaded expansion jack placed between the disc and the stud. If that’s not possible drill and tap it from the front and put a bolt into it and get a slide hammer onto it.

If you can get the head off the stud getting it out is somewhat less problematic.

Depending on how worn the rotors were I’d consider just drilling through it to get a drift in :o

Easier said than done.

AndrewOC
18th Oct 2021, 12:56 PM
G'day HB,
My F.I.L.'s latest adventures reminded me of your struggles, in this thread...!
We went to service the front brakes on his (~3 y.o.) Triton.
On the RHS, one stud snapped clean off, another is SPINNING in the hub/rotor.
Bit of a pickle...
Gorilla tyre fitters to blame, being lazy about selecting rattle gun settings.

Good luck!
A.

jack620
18th Oct 2021, 08:35 PM
Gorilla tyre fitters to blame, being lazy about selecting rattle gun settings.

where do they get those apes? How hard can it be to correctly torque a nut when you’re doing it all day? I don’t expect them to get an accurate torque setting with a rattle gun, but why wrench it up to the point of damaging the studs?

droog
18th Oct 2021, 09:14 PM
where do they get those apes? How hard can it be to correctly torque a nut when you’re doing it all day? I don’t expect them to get an accurate torque setting with a rattle gun, but why wrench it up to the point of damaging the studs?


Because more ugga dugga’s are always better !
There is quite a reputation of tyre shops doing exactly this.

clear out
19th Oct 2021, 07:05 AM
I’ve always carried a decent wheel brace and piece of pipe.
If I’m there when tyre fitters etc are finishing I’ll do it myself.( with just the brace).
The pipe is for when I’m not and getting older it’s easier to stand on the extension than do the back in.
H.

Ropetangler
19th Oct 2021, 08:06 AM
where do they get those apes? How hard can it be to correctly torque a nut when you’re doing it all day? I don’t expect them to get an accurate torque setting with a rattle gun, but why wrench it up to the point of damaging the studs?
It probably boils down to a lack of training and supervision, more than anything else. The average tyre fitter would most likely have started out as an unskilled manual labourer. It's not too often that they might have had a trade background, they probably got the job because they were strong young blokes, who could handle a truck or grader wheel if necessary. If training is sparse, and the importance of correct torquing up is not explained, checked regularly and reinforced, over tightening will occur possibly because under tightening might have a more spectacular and immediate result.:o