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shedhappens
9th Jul 2018, 04:40 PM
Hi all, does anybody know of an adapter to a ethernet cable that I could use to remote mount these control panels from the VFD's ?
Or something else maybe?
I bought 2 x 3 phase 380 - 380 v and 3 x 240 1 ph - 3 ph, two different brands but they have the same 10 pin plug.
I went to the local Jaycar store but no joy there.

thanks, shed

BobL
9th Jul 2018, 05:55 PM
Ethernet cables are 8 way whereas the cables your VFD refer are 10 way so an ethernet cable is not going to be much good,

If you look at post #40 onwards you will see some options for those 10 way cables.

jhovel
9th Jul 2018, 07:15 PM
They are standard header connectors, used in older computers to connect Serial cable dockets to the motherboard. If you do a google image search for "10-pin header connectors" you eill find hundreds of versions and suppliers. They start at $1.06 on ebay.

droog
9th Jul 2018, 08:16 PM
IDC connectors, you buy the plug / sockets and the required length of ribbon cable.

https://www.jaycar.com.au/10-way-idc-line-socket/p/PS0984
if they dont have 10 core ribbon just buy wider cable and strip off the un- needed cores.
Crimp the cable in the socket with pliers or in a small vice.

BaronJ
10th Jul 2018, 03:59 AM
Hi Guys,

Based on previous experience, I would use the vise. Though I eventually bought the correct assembly tool. Unless you have dozens of cables to make, I don't recommend buying the crimp tool.

shedhappens
10th Jul 2018, 06:08 PM
Thanks fella's,
I think this is what Joe suggested https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1M-3Ft-10-Pin-Male-to-Female-USB-Header-Internal-Motherboard-Extension-Cable/161404778107?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D52547%26meid%3D03c9d91aa9d94ccb8f82bb022a65f86b%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D6%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D191306304088%26itm%3D161404778107&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851
I had a look on aliexpress and found these also, bit pricey once you add postage then gst https://www.aliexpress.com/item/VFD-extension-cable-box-for-keypad-control-panel-Huanyang-inverter-accessory/32665446676.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.9.6f4ff447pCghFP&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_5_10152_10151_10065_10344_10068_10130_10342_10547_10343_10340_10548_10341_10696_10084_10083_10618_10307_10131_10132_10133_10846_10059_100031_444_10103_524_10624_10623_10622_10621_10620,searchweb201603_32,ppcSwitch_5&algo_expid=9294eaec-7af4-4388-8f91-44f570f0b7a3-1&algo_pvid=9294eaec-7af4-4388-8f91-44f570f0b7a3&priceBeautifyAB=0

(https://www.aliexpress.com/item/VFD-extension-cable-box-for-keypad-control-panel-Huanyang-inverter-accessory/32665446676.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.9.6f4ff447pCghFP&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_5_10152_10151_10065_10344_10068_10130_10342_10547_10343_10340_10548_10341_10696_10084_10083_10618_10307_10131_10132_10133_10846_10059_100031_444_10103_524_10624_10623_10622_10621_10620,searchweb201603_32,ppcSwitch_5&algo_expid=9294eaec-7af4-4388-8f91-44f570f0b7a3-1&algo_pvid=9294eaec-7af4-4388-8f91-44f570f0b7a3&priceBeautifyAB=0)I am not sure that I like the ribbon cable for what I want?
I was going to put 2 VFD's inside the T&C grinder cabinet and mount the control panels on a adjustable arm, rethinking it today I will now mount the VFD's on the side of the cabinet in their own open fronted enclosure and try the header cables, I assume the wires will go to the right pins?



Thanks again, cheers, shed



(https://www.aliexpress.com/item/VFD-extension-cable-box-for-keypad-control-panel-Huanyang-inverter-accessory/32665446676.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.9.6f4ff447pCghFP&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_5_10152_10151_10065_10344_10068_10130_10342_10547_10343_10340_10548_10341_10696_10084_10083_10618_10307_10131_10132_10133_10846_10059_100031_444_10103_524_10624_10623_10622_10621_10620,searchweb201603_32,ppcSwitch_5&algo_expid=9294eaec-7af4-4388-8f91-44f570f0b7a3-1&algo_pvid=9294eaec-7af4-4388-8f91-44f570f0b7a3&priceBeautifyAB=0)

Com_VC
10th Jul 2018, 06:40 PM
Here is a 2 metre cable. https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2M-2-54mm-Pitch-10-Pin-Wire-IDC-Flat-Ribbon-Extension-Male-Female-Cable/252543333286?hash=item3accc173a6:g:C0IAAOxyaRZR2-So

I am surprised they don't come with a cable or at least have it available as an option. Maybe it is available just that no one has asked?

There was a 10 pin IDC cable suppled with my SAJ VFD, basically the same as the powtran. It is secured to the VFD and control panel via screws so it has no chance of coming out.

I think using the control panel all the time will eventually lead to failure of the push button tactile switches. You would be much better going with external push button switches and just using the control panel for programming.

shedhappens
10th Jul 2018, 07:00 PM
Here is a 2 metre cable. https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2M-2-54mm-Pitch-10-Pin-Wire-IDC-Flat-Ribbon-Extension-Male-Female-Cable/252543333286?hash=item3accc173a6:g:C0IAAOxyaRZR2-So

Thanks for that


basically the same as the powtran.

I have a powtran on my mill and I have an ethernet cable connected to the control/vfd.


I think using the control panel all the time will eventually lead to failure of the push button tactile switches. You would be much better going with external push button switches and just using the control panel for programming.

Could you give me link to where I could buy these?

thanks, shed

BobL
10th Jul 2018, 07:21 PM
I think using the control panel all the time will eventually lead to failure of the push button tactile switches. You would be much better going with external push button switches and just using the control panel for programming.

It does, on my SAJ the pot got s dirty that the speed would drift all over the place and i had to clean it several times. The main reason I don't like those control panels is the buttons are too damn small and its easy to hi the wrong ones especially when you are not thinking or in a hurry.


I am not sure that I like the ribbon cable for what I want?
I was going to put 2 VFD's inside the T&C grinder cabinet and mount the control panels on a adjustable arm, rethinking it today I will now mount the VFD's on the side of the cabinet in their own open fronted enclosure and try the header cables, I assume the wires will go to the right pins?

The 10 way cable easily roll into a cylinder and fit inside narrow conduit.

Here is my mil remote setup setup.
The 32mm conduit has 2 x 10 way cables, 2 x ethernet cables and VFD power all going down the same conduit.

374193
374194

BaronJ
11th Jul 2018, 06:27 AM
Hi Shed, Guys,

Those pin headers are a common USB connector inside almost every desktop computer made since USB was invented. Call in at the local computer shop, and if the guy has any new or scrap internal USB connectors. Should only cost pennies, I've taken hundreds to the scrap merchant for copper and gold scrap.

As far as Ethernet cable is concerned, there are only eight wires in there, fine if there are only eight pins in use.

The advice to use flat ribbon cable is good, but you will need to either buy the correct IDC in order to use it, or carefully extract the pins and solder them.

These are the things that you want, $0.70 ea
https://au.rs-online.com/web/p/idc-connectors/6257369/

Com_VC
11th Jul 2018, 06:44 PM
These are the things that you want, $0.70 ea
https://au.rs-online.com/web/p/idc-connectors/6257369/

That's one end of it but will need the male version as well.

malb
11th Jul 2018, 10:55 PM
The connectors used to be fairly readily available from electronics shops in male and female versions. The initial hassle that the OP had would relate to them wanting a adaptor to convert to and from ethernet cables. They simply need a pair of connectors and an appropriate length of the correct width ribbon cable, or a wider cable that can be reduced to 10 core. The colour coded cable shown in BobL's pics is not the correct cable, it has the correct spacing but thicker insulation and is intended for bundled point to point wiring rather than header interconnects. The primary issue is that the thicker insulation makes it hard to seat and lock the clamp frame into the connector proper, causing early failure in situations where vibration exists. However it can be used if nothing else is available.

The appropriate cable is a blue or silver coloured ribbon cable. Standard widths are 9, 15, 25, 37 and 50 core. The 9 core could not be guaranteed to give full functionality as one core is missing. You would be advised to use one of the wider cables and remove the excess cores. The cables from ebay that were shown two separate groups of cables and are perhaps not suitable either. In many cases where digital info is transferred via ribbon cable, there is a ground wire between each data cable to provide a degree of shielding and reduce radiation and interference between the connected items and nearby equipment. With the double group cable shown, there is no surety that the shielding will be satisfactory when used in a high RF interference environment such as with VFD's. To my mind, this renders these cables unsuitable.

BaronJ
12th Jul 2018, 03:39 AM
Hi Guys,

Both connectors are available from the same source, as is the ribbon cable, but do you want 25 metres of it ?
Again the computer shop should have both new and salvaged IDE (hard disk drive cables) usually about 500 mm long. Just rip off the ten needed cores.
Some cables have the inter shield conductor, you don't want those, it is the older type you want. If you put the cables side by side the difference is obvious.

BobL
12th Jul 2018, 05:00 AM
The connectors used to be fairly readily available from electronics shops in male and female versions. The initial hassle that the OP had would relate to them wanting a adaptor to convert to and from ethernet cables. They simply need a pair of connectors and an appropriate length of the correct width ribbon cable, or a wider cable that can be reduced to 10 core. The colour coded cable shown in BobL's pics is not the correct cable, it has the correct spacing but thicker insulation and is intended for bundled point to point wiring rather than header interconnects. The primary issue is that the thicker insulation makes it hard to seat and lock the clamp frame into the connector proper, causing early failure in situations where vibration exists. However it can be used if nothing else is available..

I know about the other wiring you refer to but had absolutely no problem putting the headers and locking clamps on the colour coded wire with a pair of pliers. In fact I was surprise at how easy they went on.

shedhappens
12th Jul 2018, 06:01 PM
I think using the control panel all the time will eventually lead to failure of the push button tactile switches. You would be much better going with external push button switches and just using the control panel for programming.

I like this idea, thanks Com.

So I have decided to make the VFD enclosure with a ventilated door, a divider between the 2 VFD's and a filtered fan for each VFD.

I will just have stop and start switches on the front of the machine, it will be easy adjust the speed of either of the motors and I like the idea of the VFD's being tucked away.

My new questions are...
1/ do I use momentary push button switches ?
2/ do I connect to RST for the stop ?

thanks, shed

BaronJ
12th Jul 2018, 08:54 PM
Hi Shed,

From the diagram all the switches look to be momentary ones.

BobL
12th Jul 2018, 09:41 PM
Hi Shed,
From the diagram all the switches look to be momentary ones.

The diagram is most likely misleading.

My experience is none of the VFDs I have will stay on or turn off using just momentary switches but maybe there is a way to program this. In fact repeated use of a momentary switch just result in a VFD error. A momentary switch has to be linked to a latching switch using another power supply and the output of the latching switch connected to the VFD.

The main reason there I haven't persued momentary switches is because its state cannot be determined by a quick glance of teh switch position ie whether it's supposed to be on or not. I like using switches that have a physical position then a quick glance will confirm if it is supposed to be on on not. I don't even like using LED backed switches as the lights could fail and colour confusions can even add the complexity. The 3 Mile Island reactor coolant system failed because of colour coded light indicator inconsistencies on pump switches.

That's why I have standardised on a 3 way toggle switch with up for forward, middle for off and down for reverse in my shed. Some say that this makes it too easy to go from forward to reverse. In the 7 years on the 4 machines that have this setup in my shed this has happened to me once. This was on my ww lathe where initially I had the switch wired the other way ie down was fwd and during a small emergency not long after I first wired it up I flipped the switch the other way and got it into reverse.

shedhappens
12th Jul 2018, 10:52 PM
The diagram is most likely misleading.
My experience is none of the VFDs I have will stay on or turn off using just momentary switches but maybe there is a way to program this. In fact repeated use of a momentary switch just result in a VFD error. A momentary switch has to be linked to a latching switch using another power supply and the output of the latching switch connected to the VFD.

I hear what you are saying Bob but I think that tomorrow I will wire a VFD up and try a momentary switch and see what happens, this part of the diagram seems to indicate that the latching circuit that you are talking about may be
included in the circuitry in the VFD?

If it does work it looks to me that one push starts and another push stops, if that does work then I would only need 2 switches, 1 for each VFD as don't need to reverse either motor.

It couldn't be that easy, surely :rolleyes:

Thanks, shed

BobL
13th Jul 2018, 12:18 AM
If it does work it looks to me that one push starts and another push stops, if that does work then I would only need 2 switches, 1 for each VFD as don't need to reverse either motor.

It couldn't be that easy, surely :rolleyes:

It could be and I notice it does say FWD/stop but I have never got that to work on the 6 brands of VFDs including the HYs I have dabbled with.
I look fwd to your result. :D

BTW what are these VFDs driving?

Com_VC
13th Jul 2018, 04:18 PM
It normally is a programming option or some VFDS require an additional relay. Otherwise the easiest way is the way that Bob has done it.

shedhappens
13th Jul 2018, 05:57 PM
I look fwd to your result. :D


Nup, it didn't work.:(
Think I might try to contact the manufacturer so I had better brush up on my chinglish :wink:



BTW what are these VFDs driving?


No 1 T & C grinder, for the wheel so I can vary the speed for different dia wheels.
No 2 is for the work head motor to slow it down, it goes too fast for larger jobs and I spend a bit of time
balancing drive dogs ect.
No 3 is for a water cooled spindle motor for internal grinding, need to make the mounting plate for this.
No 4 I put a 1hp 3ph motor on my little Centec mill, seems to work well but I still have to sort leaking oil seals
and and some other minor things.
No 5 just coz :U

BobL
13th Jul 2018, 07:16 PM
Nup, it didn't work.:(
Think I might try to contact the manufacturer so I had better brush up on my chinglish :wink:


Good luck.
For the HY VFDs I have in the past repeated scoured the e-version of the manual for a reference to momentary switches but could not find anything.


No 1 T & C grinder, for the wheel so I can vary the speed for different dia wheels.
No 2 is for the work head motor to slow it down, it goes too fast for larger jobs and I spend a bit of time
balancing drive dogs ect.
No 3 is for a water cooled spindle motor for internal grinding, need to make the mounting plate for this.
No 4 I put a 1hp 3ph motor on my little Centec mill, seems to work well but I still have to sort leaking oil seals
and and some other minor things.
No 5 just coz :U

Thanks.

It's all water under the bridge now but with such small motors these would have been prime candidates for the Powtran 130/160 series VFDs - they have an excellent manual, are fully featured (ie Vector drive) and more intelligent than standard HYs, half the physical size of the HYs, and they cost about the same as the HYs.

374219

The 1HP PI130 and the 0.5HP PI130 are the two I used on my mill. The 2HP 160 has gone onto my DP - it has a 1.5HP motor.
The 3HP PI9130 is a super piece of kit - I bought it here in Perth as never used item on ebay and then found out I could have bought it slightly cheaper direct from the Powtran factory.
I was going to use the 9130 on my dust collector but I upgraded it to a 4HP motor and already had a 4HP HY in my stash so used that - it's not like it needs a lot of low speed grunt/control/intelligence running a DC.

Com_VC
13th Jul 2018, 07:26 PM
Do you have a link for the HY manual?

BobL
13th Jul 2018, 07:39 PM
Do you have a link for the HY manual?

Sorry I don't remember where I got it - you may be able to find it faster than I can.

PM me if you get stuck.

jhovel
13th Jul 2018, 08:18 PM
Just refreshing some info for remote panel for HY VFDs:
This is the 'complete' set for two stopping settings (the really fast emergency stop will only work with an external brake resistor).
But you can use any of the switches or settings from the diagram that are convenient and just leave the others off.

374221

and a suitable switch layout:

374220

PM me for manuals if you need one.

BobL
13th Jul 2018, 08:29 PM
Thanks Joe - very helpful.

I'm slightly confused by the stop/run labels on/under the red button.
Is that like single start/stop button? push to start, push it again to stop?
Or is FWD = start and Stop is just stop?

BobL
13th Jul 2018, 08:49 PM
I have found Joe's equivalent circuit in the Manual. Easy to find when you've seen it somewhere else,

This still looks like separate buttons/swtches are needed for stop and start

374222

jhovel
15th Jul 2018, 01:03 AM
Thanks Joe - very helpful.

I'm slightly confused by the stop/run labels on/under the red button.
Is that like single start/stop button? push to start, push it again to stop?
Or is FWD = start and Stop is just stop?

Yes, I agree. It's confusing.... The bottom row indicates the 'RUN' line versus the 'JOG' line and gives directions..... ALL BUTTONS are momentary. So you touch the FWD button and it runs, touch the stop button and it stops. Touch the Jog buttons and it runs at 5Hz until you let go. Just for checking celarances and for running a dial incdicator - I us that ALL the time, I find.....
The E-Stop at the top triggers the 0.1sec braking ramp and stops my lathe from flat out at 120Hz in less than 1.5 revolutions with screeching belts. At 50Hz it just stops dead and nearly jumps of the floor! I have never used it in earnest, but test it occasionally. Always frightens the crap out of me, despite knowing what will happen.....
No relays needed at all.

jhovel
15th Jul 2018, 01:07 AM
I have found Joe's equivalent circuit in the Manual. Easy to find when you've seen it somewhere else,

This still looks like separate buttons/switches are needed for stop and start



Yes, that is correct. The other version in the manual shows the On/off switches: one for run/stop, the other for forward/reverse.
I have used both options. The motorised workhead on my cylindrical grinder seemed better suited to on/off and fwd/rev switches to me...

Horses for courses.....

russ57
15th Jul 2018, 03:35 PM
The manual may refer to 'edge' triggers or 'level' triggers -rather than momentary switches or normal on/off switches.

And there will be a setting somewhere which sets the option you want.




Russ

shedhappens
15th Jul 2018, 03:52 PM
Yup.... its not a Huanyang.

I thought it a bit odd as there is no manufacturer name on the VFD and also not obvious on or in the booklet
that came with it, the name "ISACON" (chinglish for "is a con":rolleyes:) is only to be found in a paragraph about warranty.

I thought okay.... before I hang that book on the nail in the dunny I will read it even tho I don't know what it means.

I got to "Pn 04 Source of runtime command with range, 1 - 2"

hmmmm...????...tick tick tick clunk tick tick squeal tick tick tick..???....... Ahhhh Sssooooh......maybe runtime = go????

:2tsup::2tsup::2tsup:YIPPEE :2tsup::2tsup::2tsup:

You lose the reverse button but for what I want here that is cool and I only have 2 wires for each VFD to remote stop and start.

So its a whizzer :D

:2tsup:cheers from a very happy shed :2tsup:

and, ah tho....need click click switch not momento switch.

BobL
15th Jul 2018, 03:59 PM
So much joy from such a simple thing - love it.

Nrcollar
19th Jul 2018, 01:20 PM
make the VFD enclosure

thanks, shed


Shed
You fellows seem to have a good idea of what you are doing. If I might I would like a little help on wiring a remote control panel on the mill. I have a 2 hp 3 phase on my mill and I would like to wire it up to make it more convenient when working. The Attached thumbnail is exactly the same as mine but mine is 220 single input and 3 phase output. The second picture with all the terminals needed is the same. Any help would be more than appreciated.
Nelson

shedhappens
20th Jul 2018, 06:59 AM
Hi Nelson, l dont see any pics?

jackaroo
27th Jul 2018, 11:23 PM
I bought the "ribbon" and plug from Altronics.

https://www.altronics.com.au/p/p5310-oupiin-10-pin-idc-cable-mounting-socket/
https://www.altronics.com.au/p/w2610-10-wire-idc-cable/

Nrcollar
28th Jul 2018, 05:29 AM
Hello All
I would like to wire up my VFD so I can operate it from on the machine instead of at the VFD. In this write up I've seen VFD like mine and I just need some help in what I need to do to get it done. Here are the pics of my VFD, several pages from the manual and hope I got enough to get me home.
Thanks for all the patience and help.
Nelson
374425374426374427374428

Nrcollar
29th Jul 2018, 01:11 PM
Hi Nelson, l dont see any pics?

Shed
The pic are on the forum now and if I could get some help I would be so thankful.
Thank you.
Nelson

Nrcollar
29th Jul 2018, 01:36 PM
Hello All
I would like to wire up my VFD so I can operate it from on the machine instead of at the VFD.
Nelson
374425374426374427374428

When I took the pics I got the wrong one for the wiring figure. It was this one that is posted earlier in this thread.

http://metalworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=374209&d=1531378710

This is the right picture and when using 220 volt single phase you use the "R" and "T" leads.
The VFD is in operation, I would just like to use my converter with a remote panel, not the factory panel. The buttons will fail soon or later.
HELP.
Nelson

BobL
29th Jul 2018, 04:26 PM
Nelson, the circuit diagram is self explanatory.
If you cannot work it out from the diagram that indicates to me that you may not be able to follow any advice provided through this forum either.
Perhaps you should hire someone to do it for you.

russ57
29th Jul 2018, 06:42 PM
You will need to think about what functionality you want - just run/stop? Reverse? Variable speed? Jog?



Its not complicated as such, but as Bob called out, if the diagram is not clear to you, then you probably do need someone on hand to sort it for you.
I'm sure though you can build up the actual remote console.

240v is not something to learn electronics on....




Russ

Nrcollar
30th Jul 2018, 08:52 AM
Russ
It is not the 240v I am dealing with. 5 to 12 volt is not that dangerous. I wired in the Potentiometer, it works fine and I do not see anything special about the switching. Are they just a push button switch?
Thank you
Nelson

RustyArc
30th Jul 2018, 10:33 AM
I wired in the Potentiometer, it works fine and I do not see anything special about the switching. Are they just a push button switch?

From the wiring diagram, it looks like the buttons should be momentary action.

Nrcollar
30th Jul 2018, 11:27 AM
Rusty
Thank you and I guess I just needed some conformation.
I do not understand the resistance from some. If I fry the unit it cost me, if it kills me because of my stupidity it is my fault. I did not get to be 60+ and not learned to be safe.
Thank you so very much Rusty. I get my panel together and post a pic soon.
Nelson

shedhappens
30th Jul 2018, 08:13 PM
Hi Nelson, that looks like the same inverter that i am using, you will need toggle switches and will need to change the setting"Pn 04 Source of runtime command with range, 1 - 2" to get those terminals to operate.
I will get my manual from the shed tomorrow and if you have questions i might be able to help.
cheers, shed

Nrcollar
31st Jul 2018, 03:28 AM
Shed
Thank you so very much. I have got the programming down, it was just the kind of switch to use? Now you say toggle and what I have read it is momentary? Confusing.
Nelson

shedhappens
31st Jul 2018, 10:25 AM
Hi Nelson, if you look back in the post you will see a pic of a vfd sitting on a grinder, there are 2 yellow wires conected to grd and fwd, when i touched those 2 wires together the vfd started the motor and when i took them apart the vfd stopped the motor so if it was meant to be a momentary switch then when i disconnected the wires the motor would keep running but it doesnt, it stops and starts each time l connected and disconnected those wires.
Cheers, shed

Nrcollar
31st Jul 2018, 12:09 PM
Shed Thank you I will be getting to it in the next couple of days. I have both switches toggle and momentary.
Thanks for all you do.
Nelson

shedhappens
31st Jul 2018, 01:39 PM
I have posted the finished job here to my repco thread here http://metalworkforums.com/f303/t200891-repco-grinder/latest/post1937768#post1937768

Thank you all for your input :2tsup:

cheers, shed

Stustoys
1st Aug 2018, 11:26 AM
so if it was meant to be a momentary switch then when i disconnected the wires the motor would keep running but it doesnt, it stops and starts each time l connected and disconnected those wires.
You can use either*, it just depends on how you choose to wire/setup the VSD. Though you'd need three wires and two momentary switches to replace your setup. This makes things like multiple stop buttons easier for example.

*at least on many vsds. Maybe not all

shedhappens
1st Aug 2018, 02:31 PM
*at least on many vsds. Maybe not all



Hi Stu, nice have you back to the forum m8.

My knowledge about VFD's is pretty limited and my chinglish is also a bit sad, so what I thought was that when you go to the setting and select "Pn 04 Source of runtime command with range, 1 - 2" you only get the 2 options, 1 or 2.
When on No 1 the buttons on the control all work but nothing seems to work from the control connector block, although there is power there.
When on No 2 the only buttons on the control panel that work are the frequency up and down buttons and the control connector block now functions.
I thought that if it was to operate with momentary switches that it may have needed a No 3 option for that to to be available ?

cheers, shed

BobL
1st Aug 2018, 03:26 PM
Hi Stu, nice have you back to the forum m8.
I thought that if it was to operate with momentary switches that it may have needed a No 3 option for that to to be available ?

cheers, shed

Nope - all that momentary switches need is different wiring that incorporates the RST terminal go back and look at post 25 and 27.

Stustoys
1st Aug 2018, 04:00 PM
Hi Stu, nice have you back to the forum
Thanks



Thanks Bob, I missed that it had been covered already. I bandwidth issues atm sorry lol

At no one.
I wish they hadn't labeled the input terminals the way they have. I think it can lead to confusion early on. Even the default setting for RST is Stop. For anyone that doesn't know what I mean, any of the 6 multi inputs can be set to 1 of about 32 functions. So RST can be run if you feel like it.

shedhappens
1st Aug 2018, 06:55 PM
Thanks Bob and Stu, I am not going to change it now as I am happy how it works with the toggle switches.

A question tho, does RST = reset?

DCM seems to be missing on these VFD's ?

BobL
1st Aug 2018, 07:38 PM
Thanks Bob and Stu, I am not going to change it now as I am happy how it works with the toggle switches.

A question tho, does RST = reset?

Yes it does - it restores the VFD to power up setting.
BUT
when RST is set to "closed" it allows momentary contact switches to be used for FWD and REV.
Look at the graphic on post 27 where RST is permanently wired closed (NC).
To stop the motor a secondary momentary switch (NC) is used to disconnect either FWD or REV from DCM. When this opened the motor stops.
Releasing the secondary momentary switch set the controls read to start again using FWD or REV.


DCM seems to be missing on these VFD's ?

DCM = Digital common or ground.

shedhappens
1st Aug 2018, 09:58 PM
Thanks Bob.

so DCM = GND :2tsup:

Stustoys
2nd Aug 2018, 10:04 AM
I am not going to change it now as I am happy how it works with the toggle switches.
No need to change yours if its doing what you want. Just another way to skin a cat.



A question tho, does RST = reset?
This is what I was getting at in my last post. RST can be whatever you want it to be. It can equal reset, that would be PD046=14. But the default is PD046=04 which is STOP, thats cut off the right side of the pic in post 27.

I think Bob is saying the same thing in a different way. Unless he is saying PD046=14 would work also?

BobL
2nd Aug 2018, 12:03 PM
No need to change yours if its doing what you want. Just another way to skin a cat.

This is what I was getting at in my last post. RST can be whatever you want it to be. It can equal reset, that would be PD046=14. But the default is PD046=04 which is STOP, thats cut off the right side of the pic in post 27.

I think Bob is saying the same thing in a different way. Unless he is saying PD046=14 would work also?

I agree, the diagram on post 27 (it's from the HY manual) is a bit confusing. Yes you want PD046 to be programmed as a stop ie 04. On the HYs I have used the default has been 04 which is stop.

On most VFDs, the input control terminals labelled FWD, REV, RST etc are part of the "D" (Digital input) suite of inputs. This means they all can be used for many different functions depending on what numbers the parameters are set to. All the labels FWD, REV, RST etc really mean is that the default parameters are for those functions but they can just as as easily be reprogrammed to be any of dozens of functions.

From the manual is the list of HY parameters for the multi-inputs (D) inputs
374506

Here you see multi input 1 is preprogrammed using PD044 for "02" is for "forward rotation", multi input 2 is preprogrammed for "03" is for "reverse rotation",
multi input 3 is preprogrammed for "14" which is not listed.
I believe the 14 is a mistake and should be 04 ie "stop".
To program a "reset" the number 10 should be used.

Don't assume anything with VFDs and check what the actual parameter settings are before you use them and make sure you use the list relevant to your VFD eg on Powtran VFDs STOP is number 08 and RST is 09.

Stustoys
3rd Aug 2018, 10:20 AM
I agree, the diagram on post 27 (it's from the HY manual) is a bit confusing. Yes you want PD046 to be programmed as a stop ie 04. On the HYs I have used the default has been 04 which is stop.
Its not your post. We are almost saying the same thing I think. I'm just pointing out that by while RST is short for reset, default RST is set to STOP. I thought shedhappens was asking the later? Thats what I mean about the terminal labels add confusion early on. As we've said RST can be set to be many things. I think D3 would be less confusing, but maybe thats just me lol





multi input 3 is preprogrammed for "14" which is not listed.
I believe the 14 is a mistake and should be 04 ie "stop".
To program a "reset" the number 10 should be used.

Don't assume anything with VFDs and check what the actual parameter settings are before you use them and make sure you use the list relevant to your VFD eg on Powtran VFDs STOP is number 08 and RST is 09.

To further prove your last point. 14 isn't a mistake. The manual from my HY's.

BobL
3rd Aug 2018, 10:44 AM
Yeah we're on the same page.
BTW my post from above where it shows RESET as being = 10 is a screen capture from an early version of the on-line HY manual.
It's most likely that this is where the print error lays and instead of 10 it should read 14.
There are quite a few errors in this early doc.

shedhappens
3rd Aug 2018, 06:48 PM
Stu this here is pretty much the same operating manual for my vfd's, https://cdn.hackaday.io/files/255641093730176/VFD%20ASKPOWER%20A131%20UserGuide.pdf
These vfd's appear to be more basic than the HY vfd's and the RST does not look like it can be programed.
And only 35 levels? for parameters. (thank god for that):D

cheers, shed