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meadow street
23rd Sep 2015, 10:48 PM
anyone want to take on a restoration job and get paid for it ?

suit semi retired/retired mechanically/engineering/ electrically minded person.

1946 Lincoln shorthood petrol driven welder with continental f162 four cylinder engine.

this machine needs visual inspection/tear down, machining if necessary. magneto overhaul, radiator test, fuel tank clean out, fuel lines and filter, carb tear down and rebuild probably, check key components like the idler, governor, water pump etc

these are legendary machines, prized by U.S. pipe welder a for their great arc and simplicity.

the continental were used in forklifts and tractors, pumps and compressors up until the 1970s.

dividec into two sections, there is the motor/engine side and the generator side.
i have lots of literature on this if anyone wants to get involved.

renumeration negotiable.....east Coast Australia preferably.

share this info with mates.

i can't do the work myself, but would love to see this machine restored and welding.

KBs PensNmore
25th Sep 2015, 10:59 PM
Hi MS
Looks like no one is interested in doing your restoration project, maybe they are too busy doing their own projects.
Pity I wasn't closer to do it for you.
Kryn

meadow street
25th Sep 2015, 11:33 PM
Kryn, i just might drive it down, if you are serious about it?

without the trailer attached it could be skidded to you.

what do ya reckon?

wanna have a dig at it?

Weldingweb in USA have lots of info as well as the manuals and things I already have.

I could send 1k$ as starters: )

check out out these guys

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NAq8w9Rlhdo


chris

KBs PensNmore
25th Sep 2015, 11:56 PM
Hi Chris,
If you can't get anybody closer to do it, I'm prepared to have a go at it. I have a mate who is a mechanic (old school), did his apprenticeship on the FX/Js if I have a problem. Have another crowd here in town that specialise in generators/electrics if there is a major problem with it. Would you want the fancy Lincoln sticker on it??? At least parts are still available for the motor.:2tsup:

meadow street
26th Sep 2015, 02:53 AM
yes Kryn, your the man! as they say.

let me do some research on how to get it to you.

regards

meadow

KBs PensNmore
26th Sep 2015, 12:55 PM
Hi Chris,
If it was on the trailer it would be easier to move around as I don't have any lifting devices only brawn and a little bit of brain, enough to know, that to carry that is a bit toooooo much. LOL. I'll put the billy on for when you get here.
Regards
Kryn

Michael G
26th Sep 2015, 04:08 PM
Kryn, I have a little bit of sheet metal gear here so if I can fab up some components as part of the effort let me know.

Michael

meadow street
26th Sep 2015, 07:45 PM
yes, just looking to fit another hilux tyre to the mags.

if you have a bankment near by it will help rolling it off the ramps.

i drove to Adelaide once before looking at Wolmeley's marsupial/environmental parks/reserves.

cc

KBs PensNmore
26th Sep 2015, 08:11 PM
Thanks Michael, will keep that in mind.:2tsup:
Chris because it's got those fancy rims on it, would you like flames painted on the sides:D
We can find a place to unload it, there is a proper loading ramp about 3 km's away, will it be on a trailer or tray top?
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
26th Sep 2015, 09:31 PM
I reckon it'll be on my truck (1100mm tray height).........there are two schools of thought on these sa200 welders: restore to factory or personalise.

originally it would have had a decal saying "shield arc welder" on the side doors (missing)

michael -doors

KBs PensNmore
27th Sep 2015, 12:47 AM
Hi Chris, would you have a decent copy of the sticker, idea of size, so we could look at getting two made.
Would you want to go factory, or custom/personalised, plenty of time to think about it.
Found this on Ebay, and thought it would suit you. http://thumbs.ebaystatic.com/images/m/m-EfkHaylKKlnHN4Ut40blg/s-l225.jpg (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1-Pair-Of-Lincoln-Welders-Shield-Arc-Red-Black-Decal-/311078430063?hash=item486db8256f)

1-Pair Of Lincoln Welders Shield Arc Red & Black Decal (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1-Pair-Of-Lincoln-Welders-Shield-Arc-Red-Black-Decal-/311078430063?hash=item486db8256f)

AU $24.21

+AU $22.80 postage
​Kryn

meadow street
27th Sep 2015, 11:53 AM
I think we can customise it a little don't you think?

that chrome exciter and stator cover looks good I reckon. any electroplaters in Adelaide?

the doors ( missing) could have some graphics on them too?

Michael G
27th Sep 2015, 03:15 PM
Not flamed like this one?
http://billswelderrepair.com/SA-200.html

Michael

DSEL74
27th Sep 2015, 05:22 PM
If you want help creating the decals, I may be able to do the file for the lettering.

KBs PensNmore
27th Sep 2015, 06:18 PM
There are several electro platers in Adelaide.
The Lincoln shield arc welder stickers, can be gotten from the states for $47.00 if you'd like them on the doors, otherwise see what Dale can design.
How's this for an idea, I was getting someone to design a business card for me, where I operated a metal lathe with one hand, a wood lathe with the other, one foot using the MIG and a broom shoved somewhere....... sweeping the floor, would that do for the doors?????
Kryn

jhovel
27th Sep 2015, 07:24 PM
That shop also as decals and faceplates. The decals are only US$6.50 - seems better value to me than making some up....

Watching this thread with great interest! Keep the photos opf propgress coming Kryn.

meadow street
27th Sep 2015, 11:58 PM
Good to hear there is some interest in this project. The machine might need to be the flagship for the welding section on metalwork forums.com.

There's a guy in Canada who tigs like a demon with his lincoln gas (petrol ) welder. You can also run a cc wire feeder and fluxcore from this unit. Mig might be limited but could do?


It was last used by a chap in Berpengary Qld and surrounds during his career as a structural steel and welding expert.

Before that, unknown heritage.

The magneto is a Lucas, as apposed to the American Bosch and xxxxmorse? ( Fairbanks morse) brands common in the states.

Do you know about magnetos Kryn? https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BhbtyuRmSWE

Cosmetics are going to have to wait guys, but nice to have a goal and ideal to work towards eh?

Engine side.
Generator side.

they are the two forks in the road.

YBAF
28th Sep 2015, 01:22 PM
Engine welders.. aaaaahhhhhhhhhh.

I built a couple of stock crates with a single cylinder Lombardini diesel powered lincoln. 25 odd years later my hearings still not right.
I recall the cane toads in a nearby dam took up the same rhythm as the idling welder. So even when the welder were shut off it'd be tuk, tuk, tuk, from the toads. :U

KBs PensNmore
28th Sep 2015, 08:14 PM
Hi Chris,
One way or another, we'll get it operational, CAN'T is not in my vocabulary. One thing I know about magneto's, they give a helluva boot, DAMHIKT.
Kryn

meadow street
28th Sep 2015, 11:11 PM
that's the spirit Kryn.

im thinking end of October .......would that suit ?

KBs PensNmore
28th Sep 2015, 11:56 PM
That should be fine Chris, hopefully have the extension on the shed done by then.

meadow street
29th Sep 2015, 11:11 AM
I'm happy to fit in with you : )

KBs PensNmore
29th Sep 2015, 01:14 PM
Hi Chris,
Will let you know when shed done.:2tsup:
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
30th Sep 2015, 01:25 AM
cool.

as mentioned the engine is an f162.

I might post you the info I have on the engine side of things, as well as gather up the info on generator to pass on to sparkies.

hang on http://www.stumpfweldingsupplies.com/files/Continental_Overhaul_Manual.pdf

for those interested in sa200 Lincolns, here is a link :

http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?10817-We-Need-An-SA-200-Info-FAQ-Sticky

regards

KBs PensNmore
30th Sep 2015, 10:38 PM
Thanks for that Chris, I'll print off the manual, as it will be very useful. The other link will be handy also. This should make for good reading when it's finished, must remember to keep the camera handy and plenty of batteries.
Kryn

meadow street
1st Oct 2015, 08:55 AM
hope so Kryn,

these sort sort of threads can be inspiring and very educational.

ill send you a little tripod for your camera : )

KBs PensNmore
1st Oct 2015, 02:03 PM
Hi Chris,
Tripods I have, thanks. A little one about 100 mm high and another that goes to about 1.5 metres high.
Amazing what can be found on the net, it's opened up a whole new world. 30 years ago you wanted information,you had to spend a lot of time in libraries, on the phone, waiting for postal deliveries of books etc only to find that it hasn't got that particular section, so back chasing more information.
I used to collect catalogues for ideas on bits/parts to use, but it's all on the net now days. I waste a lot of time looking for components to use / adapt for what I want to do.
Regards,
Kryn

meadow street
1st Oct 2015, 11:39 PM
Yeah I hadn't heard of marvel schebler carb before:

http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?131041-marvel-schebler-sa-200-carb-moval-(-how-to-)

Had you?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-4IAOyY4O_I

KBs PensNmore
2nd Oct 2015, 12:39 PM
Hi Chris,
Thanks for those, they'll come in handy, when it's time to strip and rebuild it.
I've not heard of that brand of carb before, probably like a lot of things in days gone by, swallowed up by opposition companies.
Kryn

meadow street
2nd Oct 2015, 01:20 PM
Funny, the company makes aeroplane carbs ...hahaha

KBs PensNmore
2nd Oct 2015, 02:47 PM
Hi Chris,
At least parts for the carby are to be found easily, not like some other now obscure components. Do you want to look at getting some of the parts now? Like the carby kit and magneto kit, as I think these wouldn't go astray, also with the Au $ dropping?
That way there'd be no waiting on those sort of parts, and any other parts you might think of you'll want to replace, switch panel, hoses, spark plugs, etc.
That way, it won't hopefully, take as long to overhaul/restore.
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
2nd Oct 2015, 07:09 PM
yes, I think the carby kit is a good idea.as well as radiator hoses. Leeds to the mag and spark plugs.

upon tear down, inspection and measurement the key engine parts can be ordered with confidence.

surplus parts in Melb might be able to help us but need measurements and types of components to be sure.


we won't know until we open 'er up what type bearings (journaled or not journaled ) , rings, etc we might need, if any.

these engines are robust, but be prepared for stuck valves, stuck Pistons, seizures : )

the things of concern to me are the magneto, water pump, the idler system which is a bellows type, and the governor.

i think tear down Kryn and reassemble : )

the electronic idler might be a real option if we can't figure out the vacuum operated system which allows the engine to fire up/down upon striking arc and snapping out of bead.

perhaps a casual chat with the sparkies about generator side of things might be worthwhile. I'll try and get specs...

KBs PensNmore
2nd Oct 2015, 10:48 PM
Hi Chris,
The mate who's a mechanic, is also a member of the local Auto Collectors Club, so there will be a wealth of knowledge among the members there as some have vehicles running on magnetos. I already have a sparky in mind, who I hope will be prepared to look at it, as to save full rate payment, $90 P/H???? Had him in to check my mini mill, decent sort of bloke, also a member of the Auto Club. I also have a contact in Adelaide that can do the cylinders, head re work etc. if required. Do you know if there is water in the oil? As that would give an indication if a major problem exists, seized pistons etc.
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
3rd Oct 2015, 09:38 PM
the oil is fresh as a daisy !

great to hear you have some contacts.

im having fun mapping my journey and visiting every junk shop fro here to there / haha

meadow street
3rd Oct 2015, 10:06 PM
http://www.stumpfweldingsupplies.com/files/IM142.pdf

the closest version of the manual with schematics

KBs PensNmore
3rd Oct 2015, 10:24 PM
Hi Chris, Thanks for the schematics certainly will help a lot, printing it off now to read up on it. Sounds good that the oil is fresh, minimising the chance of seized workings hopefully. Have a couple of junk shops in the town, Gems N Junk and Eastside Secondhand, plus Trash/Crime Converters
Looking forward to meeting you and the beast.
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
4th Oct 2015, 10:46 AM
do you have sandblasting/spray painting gear?

the hood needs to come off to get to the engine etc, and the radiator cover and radiator perhaps ( the radiator actually looks quite good) , also the stator/exciter covers need to come off to get into that side of it.

while led they are off it would be great to blast/spray ?

here's a YouTube of an old guy doing up a newer machine for his son.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cjb6qbnIF7o

plus
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3-0bVcGc1s8

meadow street
4th Oct 2015, 02:38 PM
358841

KBs PensNmore
4th Oct 2015, 04:17 PM
Hi Chris,
I do have a sand blasting unit, but it's only a small thing like a paint spray gun. If it's to small, there are several in the town so no problems there. Was planning on doing that anyway, it's pointless going to all that trouble and only half doing the job. I do have spray equipment, plus I know someone who is a Vehicle spray painter and does a bit of work from home, so that side is covered also.
Thanks for the contact for magneto repairs, will keep that in mind, if we come to a problem. Are you looking at doing similar to the video clip, up dating to alternator, gauges, oil filter, re wire, etc?
Do you plan on putting an oxy set or/and tool box on the trailer side of it, and will you be planning on towing it on the road? As it will need lights, mudguards etc if you are? Just thinking of ideas that might be incorporated into it while it's here, no point in thinking about other bits n pieces to tack on later and spoiling the paintwork etc.
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
4th Oct 2015, 09:57 PM
g'day Kryn,

unfortunately there is is no provision for electric start. although some later 1940s models did have a hole which allowed access to the ring gear ( to connect a starter to).

this will be a crank start machine.

a kill switch on the magneto might be a good idea.

on the trailer idea- no it's probably not a highway worthy set up ( albeit original). the restored machine will go on a stand alone trailer and also have option to ride on the back of a vehicle.

i reckon your car club guys will come up trumps with magneto testing and overhaul.

just emailed b&w parts to see if their shipping price for thermostat, carb kit, decals, sediment bowl, gasket set, plugs, magneto leads, ec will stack up.

there is an oil filter they offer but I reckon a generic type might be sourced locally. their air filter is again possibly locally sourced ( k and n) springs to mind)

again, the bellows idler is something you will need to assess as to wether it will function.....

the videos show a pretty complete external resto, which looks good in my mind.

KBs PensNmore
4th Oct 2015, 10:59 PM
The after market oil filter shown is available locally, a lot were put on the Holden grey motors, I think they're used in hydraulics also.
Air filter can be made up to suit, as long as it's for a similar sized motor shouldn't be a problem, 10 litre paint can body?????
I suppose putting it on another trailer, you're not having to pay more rego for a trailer that might see road use once or twice a year.
Kryn

meadow street
5th Oct 2015, 11:37 AM
good points Kryn,

KBs PensNmore
5th Oct 2015, 11:59 AM
With regards to the image, that's a good point, doing it properly. Having to do a job once is bad enough, let alone having to do it again, because of wanting to save a few bucks!!!!! Will it be mainly used on a farm or more as a preservation project???
Hopefully, picking up the shed on the weekend. I reckon I've the perfect trailer to fit the welder in, plus a heap of other equipment you might want to carry. You'll see it when you get here.
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
5th Oct 2015, 01:21 PM
there is quite a few field days in this part off the country which would be happy to display something like this. you just don't see too many sa200.

i will use the welder as my machine when away from power sources and by the anecdotes, any stick welding where I can get away with the noise aspect. they weld very very well!!!

KBs PensNmore
5th Oct 2015, 01:44 PM
I use to have a 3 phase Miller, it whined more than my first Mrs did. Great for welding as you say. Did you know aluminium can be welded with them, using electrodes? In years gone by, about 40 of them, the concrete agitator bowls were powered by Holden engines and they drove a right angled gearbox to rotate the bowl. The gearbox, had a bad habit of breaking off the mounting lugs, one of my jobs was to weld them back on.
Kryn

meadow street
6th Oct 2015, 06:50 PM
358874

This is is the mag numbers Kryn

sr4 mk11a 3 63
422900

oh, and guess what? The motor rotated or turns by rotating the fan :D

KBs PensNmore
6th Oct 2015, 09:32 PM
That's great that it turns, one less thing to worry about. It makes it a lot easier to dismantle, ever tried to remove rusted pistons????
Did it feel as if there was much compression, resistance???
I sent the photo to Paul for a quote, got a reply asking what make it was???? I sent a reply asking if he got the photo, with the details that were on it, so we'll see what comes of it.
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
6th Oct 2015, 09:56 PM
not being all that "mechanical" I would say 6 or 7 :1 haha

it felt pretty firm, and the mag gave a nice big click.

i heard an expulsion from the muffler.

the generator moved freely - don't know whether the brushes are moving freely in their holder though, nor the state of the commutators.

here's the info on the bellows ( or did I send it already?)

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/assets/servicenavigator-public/lincoln3/im117.pdf

Michael G
6th Oct 2015, 10:33 PM
If it is hand start you would not want your compression ratio too high or you would risk injury when starting. Be interesting to pop the plugs out and see what the cylinder pressure on each was. If you have decent compression it might run with minimal extra effort.
Michael

meadow street
6th Oct 2015, 10:43 PM
hoping so michael.

found this pic:

this is is what the original air cleaner looked like (from another machine)



358884

KBs PensNmore
7th Oct 2015, 06:53 PM
Hi Chris,
Thanks Michael, we will be giving it a compression test before it's stripped down completely, might find maybe a set of rings required and that's it, hopefully no bearings to replace.
As the maggy gave a nice click that sounds good, same with the exhaust. What ever you do don't try turning it by the fan, if it should fire, welllll you'll know?
It appears to be of the oil bath variety, would you want one similar or a dry filtered unit? If you'd like the std wet filter, will start looking around for one now.
Is the cranky handle with it or do we need to make/find one?
You do realise that there is a right and wrong way of using a crank handle? The right way starts the motor and the wrong way gives a broken thumb joint :oo:.
Regards
Kryn

meadow street
7th Oct 2015, 10:33 PM
yes fingers and thumbs could definitely be in the firing line if one wasn't careful.

none of the leads from mag to spark plugs were in place. the old champion plugs will need gapping haha

as far as the air filter goes, something small and efficient would be my preference. perhaps one with a solid construction, even something a little retro looking? modern, dry are the easiest aren't they? blow the element out every 50 hrs or so.......

there's no crank unfortunately, despite me searching the place for it, as well as for the two sheet metal doors which would have been on the original unit.

i was welding with a generator and an inverter today ..... wish I had the shorthood Lincoln instead : )

meadow street
17th Oct 2015, 10:24 AM
no pressure Kryn, but the guys over at Weldingweb would like to see pics of tear down when it happens.

might have to up the budget for the extra photography.

could be a really important resource for owners into the future.

chris

ps : it'll ride on one of these 359050

KBs PensNmore
17th Oct 2015, 06:05 PM
Hi Chris, will take as many pics as needed. Is that a J2 Bedford? Very nice vehicle, one of your restorations?
Regards
Kryn

wheelinround
17th Oct 2015, 06:12 PM
:2tsup: nice to see

meadow street
17th Oct 2015, 10:41 PM
359062mines a white J1 .........30cwt 3000lb 1.3 T

359063

KBs PensNmore
17th Oct 2015, 11:20 PM
Nice looking rig, did you do it? Your alarm system doesn't look to bad either, is it friendly? Is the welder coming over on this?
Kryn

meadow street
18th Oct 2015, 08:12 PM
the old man did the restoration on the Bedford.

sounds like it's only on 3 cylinders right now?

i should truck it and the welder to you haha

KBs PensNmore
18th Oct 2015, 08:19 PM
Hi Chris, Sorry, only got room for one project at a time. Shed is only 4 m wide.
Kryn

meadow street
21st Oct 2015, 08:21 AM
well, I just put an order in for some parts from the U.S.

gonna be interesting to get the shipping price back :?

KBs PensNmore
21st Oct 2015, 09:01 AM
Hi Chris,
Hope you don't faint at the price, I went to order a shaft for my lathe 12mm diam and 120 long, $25 just fo posting:oo:.
Kryn

meadow street
21st Oct 2015, 05:19 PM
I'm sitting down

KBs PensNmore
18th Nov 2015, 10:08 PM
Hi Chris, have you got the parts you ordered yet??? Hopefully will have the shed up by the end of November.

meadow street
19th Nov 2015, 10:14 PM
just wrote a big response and the battery failed on my device:

-yes got marvel schebler rebuild kit
-points and condensor fir mag coming ( the sr4 is pretty reliable unit apparently)
- fuel filter available near you
- oil bath on machine may be salvageable ( if another doesn't turn up )
- spark plugs available near you
- sediment shutoff bowl probably from a fergie will suffice in that department
- 7mm copper spark plug w ire near you I reckon (boots as well)
- --

untill tear down rings, etc will need measuring /inspection. then gaskets and parts to suit: )

psyching myself up for the drive is the biggest hurdle ( apart from shipping costs from United States )

good luck with the shed mate : )

KBs PensNmore
19th Nov 2015, 10:51 PM
Thanks for the update, will chase up the 7mm copper spark plug wire, boots also see availability of spark plugs and fittings. Will look up plug type, hopefully find it in the listing.

meadow street
20th Nov 2015, 06:51 AM
cool man :cool:

359642

also - champion d-16 plugs 0.025 gap

meadow street
18th Feb 2016, 08:50 PM
yeah sorry about pics!

361052361053well Kryn, the curiosity has killed the cat.

i took the fuel tank off today and am going to get it cleaned etc.

opened the magneto to have a look, and it looks pretty good really.

took the carby off and am soaking it in fuel then getting the guy down the road to install the kit.

sorry you weren't closer to see the action here today!

361051

jhovel
18th Feb 2016, 10:10 PM
You are doing it all the wrong way up! :doh:

KBs PensNmore
18th Feb 2016, 11:08 PM
:doh:It's supposed to be viewed from the other side of the world, it would then be the right way up.:D