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  1. #16
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    It's a bit of a hike from Lismore, but I see Grays have a similar toy mill up for auction over in Botany early next week, 4th only though. More capable machines at the same auction are cheaper, at least so far, would you believe!

    Quote Originally Posted by snapatap
    The down side of CNC is cost. 2nd hand machines are non existant here and new starts at about $20000. Hard to justify for a home shop when a 2nd hand turret mill can be had for $2-3000.
    I'd say biggest cost is electrics, even a basic visit from Mr Fanuc or whathaveyou, always seems to run 4k in my experience, if there's any problems

  2. #17
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    jatt is offline Always within 10 paces from nearest stubby holder
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    Have yoù used cad/cam software before?
    Yep that in itself can take up a fair bit of time. I had to learn 2 software packages at once just to run my 2d cutter!
    One to design jobs that are any more complex than a simple rectangle/circle, the other that drives the actual table. It least I don't have to deal with CAM as well.

    A lot of the problems I encounter relate to software and dealing with the IT guy from the place I bought the unit from. Software "updates" quite often don't resolve my actual issues, and new versions seem to produce new probs that wernt there prior.
    Frisky wife, happy life. ​Then I woke up. Oh well it was fun while it lasted.
    From an early age my father taught me to wear welding gloves . "Its not to protect your hands son, its to put out the fire when u set yourself alight".

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by j3dprints View Post
    If I had to restart I might just go for a hobby machine, possibly a Syil myself, and accept its limitations but get to the making chips part sooner.
    I've been looking at the Syil website, they seem to do the whole range from hobbyist to industrial. They look promising.

    Quote Originally Posted by snapatap View Post
    I do one off and repairs at work all day and only use CNC mills and never want to go back to manual mills.. For a home shop manual lathes are better, CNC is a pain for one off.
    Interesting... great to get an opinion from someone who uses CNC for one off stuff!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hunch View Post
    I'd say biggest cost is electrics, even a basic visit from Mr Fanuc or whathaveyou, always seems to run 4k in my experience, if there's any problems
    Yeah, one thing I fear with the CNC machines is electrical or software issues. With a manual machine there wouldn't be much to go wrong, but if a CNC machine refuses to work I can imagine it would be a headache to sort out.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pumpkinate View Post
    if a CNC machine refuses to work I can imagine it would be a headache to sort out.
    Oh it is, it soooo is.

    Computer says "no". Why? Because @#%$ you, that's why.

    If you're lucky, your software package will have useful error messages that give you a good idea of what the problem is, but sometimes you'll check the manual for the error code and it says "code not used"

  5. #20
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    Hi Guys,

    A friend of mine who runs an engineering business, recently had his Denford CNC lathe decide that it wasn't going to change tools. Neither he nor I had any clue as to what the problem was. Denford put him in touch with an engineer skilled in the repair of this machine, but it was several days before he could get there. Ignoring the cost of the lost work and time involved, the actual cost of parts for the repair was just a few pounds, but £900 plus VAT in labour.

    The fault, a rubber bung missing under the rear of the tool turret ! It had allowed coolant inside the tool changer and into a micro switch that then failed open. The actual turret must have been three quarters full of cutting/cooling fluid that ran out when he cracked the rotary joint.

    Very interesting watching the machine being stripped and the tool changer being taken apart and reassembled. I had no idea that this was all done with hydraulics.
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  6. #21
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    Remember in this discussion that the CNC machines sold primarily for home use will not have all the features of a CNC machine used in an industrial setting, both in terms of physical design and software features. I've seen some amazing machines in engineering shops around the place that I would love to have if I had the space and several $100,000 but when someone asks about CNC on a forum like this, I assume that they are not that ambitious.

    I use some of the higher end CAD software at work and one of the reasons I haven't gone to 3D CAD at home is that I can't get a package with the features I'm used to at a price I can justify. At the risk of making a massive generalisation, I think it would be the same for CNC machines - you won't get all the features on a machine for home use that you will find on a commercial machine. To put it another way, make sure you compare manual apples to CNC apples and not CNC oranges...

    Michael

  7. #22
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    Michael G -- recon you just hit the nail on the head.

    BaronJ -- Yep it doesn't take much to bring a flashy CNC to its knees. Somedays I am thankful that I don't have to worry about the effects of chips and coolant running through the machine. There is enough potential issues just by having a PC run the show!
    Frisky wife, happy life. ​Then I woke up. Oh well it was fun while it lasted.
    From an early age my father taught me to wear welding gloves . "Its not to protect your hands son, its to put out the fire when u set yourself alight".

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael G View Post
    Remember in this discussion that the CNC machines sold primarily for home use will not have all the features of a CNC machine used in an industrial setting
    I hear you, but I'll watch their evolution with interest.

    j3Dprints.... if you are interested in the Syil machines, this guy in Melbourne just switched from Skyfire to Syil. He will likely review it in the coming few weeks:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQER...ature=youtu.be

  9. #24
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    DCT Teacher in Melbourne has bought a Syil X7 and shoehorned it in his garage for hobby use. His videos are excellent and you can glean a lot of info about CNC from him. https://www.youtube.com/user/DCTTeacher1

  10. #25
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    Default skyfire cnc

    [QUOTE=Pumpkinate;1939779]I hear you, but I'll watch their evolution with interest.

    j3Dprints.... if you are interested in the Syil machines, this guy in Melbourne just switched from Skyfire to Syil. He will likely review it in the coming few weeks:

    I bought the skyfire from the guy in Melbourne. Haven't used it yet but I'll let you know how it works out when I do. The machine is quite light weight, only weighs about 600kg's and has casters you can use to move it around the workshop if needs be. Apart from some strange wiring positions on the "Y" axis servo motor(which I will change) it seems quite well made. I agree the Syil at twice the weight is a much more rigid machine but for the home workshop, the Skyfire seems sufficient.
    svm-1vmcmain.jpg

  11. #26
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    When I first got into metal machining I was 'romanced" by the idea of having or converting to CNC. However the cost alone precluded me from that decision. I'm so glad I never went down that path. I have learnt so much from my manual machines and like others have said, using a CNC machine in manual mode for one-offs would be a PITA I'm thinking.

    Having said that, I think it all comes down to personal choice and if CNC really intetests you then who is anyone here to argue against it. As mentioned before, the ideal situation would be to have two mills, a manual machine and a CNC machine.

    To say that CNC machines will eventually take over manual machines in the home shop is a bit of a stretch. They have been available for about 40 years and it has not happened yet.

    I had a similar conversation with people at work. They know I do metalwork for a hobby and they suggest that 3D printing will make my lathe and mill obsolete in ten years. Maybe it will, but I doubt in to years I will be able to afford a 3D printer that can print in stainless steel, aluminium, steel, carbon steel etc. etc. to the same work envelope I have atm on my mill to within the same tolerances.

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  12. #27
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    I would say that the sensible plan for a business would be sell all your spare unused gear, buy a real machine.

    That's if this is done for profit, the time you'll sink into any kind of retrofit is just not economical. All you'll get is a slow buggy.

    If you just needed a super simple automated cutoff machine then maybe look at a PLC and pneumatics?

    I don't want to seem like a grump in these CNC threads, it's just unless it's a massive machine like a HBM you are just never going to get a penny back compared to buying a machine designed and integrated with a controller.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by caskwarrior View Post
    I would say that the sensible plan for a business would be sell all your spare unused gear, buy a real machine.

    That's if this is done for profit, the time you'll sink into any kind of retrofit is just not economical. All you'll get is a slow buggy.

    If you just needed a super simple automated cutoff machine then maybe look at a PLC and pneumatics?

    I don't want to seem like a grump in these CNC threads, it's just unless it's a massive machine like a HBM you are just never going to get a penny back compared to buying a machine designed and integrated with a controller.
    You're singing the same song as me the last time this bubbled up.

    People can build a CNC mill or lathe at home, sure. It just won't be very good or functional in comparison with even the cheapest & lightest of the commercially available machines.

    Wouldn't stop me doing it as a learning exercise knowing what I built would be a glorified toy though. Just my expectations would be low.

    Think on how you'd fit an automatic tool changer and how much less utility a CNC machine has without one as an example.....

    PDW

  14. #29
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    Since I started this thread a year ago, I ended up buying a manual mill. I'm having a ball and learning heaps.

  15. #30
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    What did you go with?

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