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15th Jun 2018, 02:44 PM #1Novice
- Join Date
- Mar 2012
- Location
- australia
- Posts
- 20
Australian tool maker to create a 1/8 inch shank router bit
No luck in other forums so I'll try here....
I need a V groove router bit for timber and cannot seem to locate a metal tool maker who is able to fabricate something or who has enough respect to reply to enquiries.
My 1/8 inch shank Dremel rotary tool works well and is light. That is why I'm avoiding the use of a 1/4 inch shank router bit which only fits my much heavier Makita trimmer.
After much internet searching and telephone calls/emails to 25 companies here in Australia I still have not located what I need.
I need a 1/8 inch shank V groove timber router bit with an included angle of 10 degrees (yes, pretty narrow). The widest part would be 4mm narrowing down to 1.5mm over a distance of about 13.5mm (that gives the 10 degrees). I'd prefer solid carbide but it can be HSS.
Anyone know of where I can buy one (anywhere in the world) or have a couple fabricated by an Australian tool maker ?
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15th Jun 2018, 11:45 PM #2
Hi Harry
Welcome to our Metal Work Forum.
I believe the reason you do not have any takers among the toolmakers is that perhaps your job looks like far too much effort for too little gain.
Being tool maker work this job appears to be one-off or low volume and specialized. The toolmakers are probably making good money doing their everyday jobs and probably not interested not wanting work outside their own comfort zone.
The exception might be a toolmaker who is also a woodworker. For that reason, it may be helpful to fully explain what the specific application is.
I may be wrong but I can't recall anyone of our members mentioning in a post that they are capable of machining carbide or even High Speed Steel. Outside of basic lathe work, I am not a machinist myself, but do understand it is specialised work.
However in the event, I am quite wrong about the topic, keep an eye out for replies for a week or two as some of us don't clock into the forum on a regular basis.
Can I suggest you place a post in the Forum welcome wagon ( //metalworkforums.com/f300) and tell us about yourself?
Our Forum is pretty different to the one you were used to in 2012.
Cheers
Grahame
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16th Jun 2018, 12:20 AM #3
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16th Jun 2018, 12:21 AM #4Most Valued Member
- Join Date
- May 2011
- Location
- Murray Bridge S Aust.
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- 71
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- 5,959
Hi Harry, found this on Ebay. https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5pc-3-17...AAAOSwPYZU2z~b
Hope this helps. By the way, would it be possible to change your location from Australia to a suburb and state, please.
It makes it easier to help you if we know your location.
KrynTo grow old is mandatory, growing up is optional.
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16th Jun 2018, 12:22 AM #5Most Valued Member
- Join Date
- Jul 2016
- Location
- Melbourne
- Age
- 35
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- 1,522
Unfortunately the tool you are describing would be very challenging to grind, are you going to be using it free hand? What tolerances do you require on that angle?
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16th Jun 2018, 02:57 AM #6
I have a feeling that what you want -- 10 degree included angle and a 13 mm cutting depth -- is not doable.
the finest commercially available bit I can find is a 1/4" shank solid carbide one with a 22.5 degree included angle -- Carb-i-tool item number TV 2208. A good sharpening service might be able to bring this down to what you want
BUT
I note that most small diameter straight bits only have a cutting depth of 6 or 7 mm, half what you're looking for.regards from Canmore
ian
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16th Jun 2018, 09:46 AM #7Novice
- Join Date
- Mar 2012
- Location
- australia
- Posts
- 20
Thanks everyone.
@KBsPensNmore.. thanks for the link. Those bits look promising so I'll investigate.
@caskwarrior.. yes I'll be using it freehand but with a guide in the groove.
@Ian.. I do in fact have that TV2208 bit (and a couple of others from Carbitool) but the 22.5 degrees (and the 1/4 inch shank) don't suit. I agree that a "good" sharpening service may be able to modify it but I haven't located a "good" one yet. Any suggestions?
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16th Jun 2018, 07:53 PM #8Senior Member
- Join Date
- Jul 2012
- Location
- Griffith NSW
- Posts
- 435
Ive used a similar bit to do some dial engraving using the mill. Super fragile bits, just sneeze wrong on the handwheels and off she dissappears. Granted, that was at 1600rpm. not 30 000rpm, and in metal, not timber.
Still, given my experiences, I just cant see such a narrow, brittle bit could dig 13mm deep in timber. I think OP is after the impossible.
Can I ask why it is youre after such a cutter? Perhaps there is another solution to the bigger problem.
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16th Jun 2018, 10:30 PM #9
Hi Harry,
the tool you are asking about needs to be a single lip cutter by necessity, because it would be too small at the sharp end to support more than one.
So the type Kryn showed you is what's available in every angle and every tip diameter.
They are ground on a single lip tool cutter and EVERY toolmaker can do that. However, NOBODY in the Western world would do it because they cost less than $2 each imported.... The starting point for a toolmaker job would be $100s....
THEY use these cutters themselves all the time and know how cheap they are - so I imagine they think you are having them on and wouldn't bother to answer. Nothing to do with respect.Cheers, Joe
retired - less energy, more time to contemplate projects and more shed time....
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16th Jun 2018, 10:52 PM #10Product designer retired
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
- Location
- Heidelberg, Victoria
- Age
- 79
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- 2,074
Harry, have a look at the Harvey Tools factory tour, I'd be surprised they couldn't help you out
Helicalsolutions nearly 58 minutes
Helical Solutions: Behind the Scenes - In The Loupe - Machinist Blog
Ken
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17th Jun 2018, 01:56 AM #11Most Valued Member
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- Jul 2016
- Location
- Melbourne
- Age
- 35
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- 1,522
I dont want to be a negative nelly, but I think he wants to use this in a handheld tool, and by the time you relieve half the carbide blank to make a D bit, it's going to want to snap harder than my waistband.
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17th Jun 2018, 09:44 AM #12Diamond Member
- Join Date
- Jun 2010
- Location
- Canberra
- Posts
- 1,322
I use those 10 degree 0.1mm engraving bits in my CNC router to mill copper PCBs. Even at 24,000 RPM and very precisely controlled, there's a reason you buy packs of 10.
In a Dremel, given their amount of runout, the tip would snap off instantly.
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18th Jun 2018, 05:26 PM #13Novice
- Join Date
- Mar 2012
- Location
- australia
- Posts
- 20
Thanks for the replies. I did, in fact, reply on Saturday but my post has not appeared. Don't know why.
To answer some questions:
I am not concerned with the strength of the router bit since I already use a 1/8 inch Dremel straight router bit and that is HSS not carbide. Unfortunately although it cuts well, it is a straight bit and not a V groove bit.
I have spoken directly (via 'phone) to many companies who invited me to email them the details of what I want and they would reply with quoted costs. None of them bothered. That's why I say they have no respect. Other companies explain they don't do that sort of work so cannot help which is fine of course. They do understand basic manners and respect.
KBsPensnMore has kindly given an ebay link to a possible solution so I have purchased those and will let you guys/gals know the results.
In the meantime I'm still keen to find an Australian company who is capable of doing the job so further suggestions are welcomed. As a last resort I may well have to use a 1/4 inch shank V groove bit but again I need to find a company who can fabricate the 10 degrees required.
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18th Jun 2018, 07:25 PM #14
Hi Harry,
I may have to refer it to our programming guru.
I did approve the post ( some new posts, especially those with pics can be moderated by the software up to the first ten posts.
Its a tweak which is meant to combat spammers)
I approved the original post so all should have been good at that point.
Something appears to be wrong, as your post count should now be 2 or possibly 3, being the original post, your (disappeared) reply post on Saturday and the one I am replying to, now.
As I type this, I can only see 1 in your post count (see top RH side). I think it may be a program fault connected with your membership on the Woodwork Side and /or low post count,but I am guessing here?. Transfer across should be be without problems, but ???
This is above my level, so I shall pass it to the programming guru.
cheers
Grahame
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28th Jun 2018, 08:23 PM #15Novice
- Join Date
- Mar 2012
- Location
- australia
- Posts
- 20
I purchased the ebay router bits that KBsPensnMore referenced. I cut the pointed end off to get a flat end of 1.5mm, made a jig to fit onto my rotary tool to act as a guide in the groove and it worked quite well. I'm using it to remove a flexible sealant from a V groove in timber. The first groove I cut was 3mm x 3mm with a straight router bit. This groove acts as a guide for the (less robust) V groove router bit that follows. The V groove router bits are cutting 95% flexible sealant and 5% timber. Anyway, it's a start.
I'm still keen to hear from anyone who can give me the contact details of a reliable machine shop who is willing and able to fabricate 1/4 inch or 1/8 inch router bits.
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