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  1. #1
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    Mar 2017
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    Default CNC'ing my mill - electrical issues

    Hi guys I'm cnc'ing my HM-46 and have some Chinese servos whose manual I'm trying to decipher. I'm currently not sure what devices I need before each servo between the wall power and the power input on the servo, or where is the best place in Australia / QLD to get them.

    Here's an image from the manual:


    The servos are 750w, normally max 3A continuous 9A peak so a 10A circuit breaker like this might work (?) -
    https://www.bunnings.com.au/deta-10a...eaker_p4430662

    Is this what it means by a median filter?
    https://www.jaycar.com.au/240v-ac-emi-filter/p/MS4001

    As for the contactor, I am not sure what to install here, is this where you put an estop? An estop is then a relay? Or are these relays that are usually installed so you can power off the motor electronically under certain conditions.

    Also the servos say 3 phase AC input but apparently they can run off single phase AC. I am not sure how to connect that up yet though.

    Thanks

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by j3dprints View Post
    Hi guys I'm cnc'ing my HM-46 and have some Chinese servos whose manual I'm trying to decipher. I'm currently not sure what devices I need before each servo between the wall power and the power input on the servo, or where is the best place in Australia / QLD to get them.

    Here's an image from the manual:
    "I'm currently not sure what devices I need before each servo, between the wall power and the power input on the servo....."

    You need help choosing Drivers for your Servos?, ie Servo Drivers?
    I've no experience with servos, just a bit with steppers.
    I thought Mr Holman might sell some but I don't see any. I'd just google you servo model and put' Best Driver' in there as well and start reading.


    Quote Originally Posted by j3dprints View Post
    The servos are 750w, normally max 3A continuous 9A peak so a 10A circuit breaker like this might work (?) -
    https://www.bunnings.com.au/deta-10a...eaker_p4430662
    If you are using 3 phase, you are best to use a 3 phase breaker. A 10A device MAY be cutting it a bit close....maybe a 16A version would be better.
    Circuit Breakers are designed to protect the WIRING, not the DEVICE, so you size them for that.

    Quote Originally Posted by j3dprints View Post
    Is this what it means by a median filter?
    https://www.jaycar.com.au/240v-ac-emi-filter/p/MS4001
    Yes...looks OK...We usually call them EMI Filters.

    [QUOTE=j3dprints;1933755]As for the contactor, I am not sure what to install here, is this where you put an estop? An estop is then a relay? Or are these relays that are usually installed so you can power off the motor electronically under certain conditions.[/QUOTE


    No, a Contactor is like a 3 phase relay...It has 3 Normally Open contacts ...sometimes more. Need one rated for the current and with correct control voltage. ( what ever you are using. )


    Quote Originally Posted by j3dprints View Post
    Also the servos say 3 phase AC input but apparently they can run off single phase AC. I am not sure how to connect that up yet though.

    Thanks
    I think they are referring to the Drivers themselves. THEY look like they can be single OR 3 phase powered. Some smaller VSD's are the same.


    Got a manual or model number for the Servo's?

    Steve

  3. #3
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    Mar 2017
    Location
    Brisbane
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    Default

    [QUOTE=Sterob;1933758]"I'm currently not sure what devices I need before each servo, between the wall power and the power input on the servo....."

    You need help choosing Drivers for your Servos?, ie Servo Drivers?
    I've no experience with servos, just a bit with steppers.
    I thought Mr Holman might sell some but I don't see any. I'd just google you servo model and put' Best Driver' in there as well and start reading.




    If you are using 3 phase, you are best to use a 3 phase breaker. A 10A device MAY be cutting it a bit close....maybe a 16A version would be better.
    Circuit Breakers are designed to protect the WIRING, not the DEVICE, so you size them for that.



    Yes...looks OK...We usually call them EMI Filters.

    Quote Originally Posted by j3dprints View Post
    As for the contactor, I am not sure what to install here, is this where you put an estop? An estop is then a relay? Or are these relays that are usually installed so you can power off the motor electronically under certain conditions.[/QUOTE


    No, a Contactor is like a 3 phase relay...It has 3 Normally Open contacts ...sometimes more. Need one rated for the current and with correct control voltage. ( what ever you are using. )




    I think they are referring to the Drivers themselves. THEY look like they can be single OR 3 phase powered. Some smaller VSD's are the same.


    Got a manual or model number for the Servo's?

    Steve
    Hey, thanks, the best English translation is - https://www.machsupport.com/forum/in...0;attach=44811
    These are "KRS" servos. This is the model I have (3 of), though I got it from another aliexpress store - https://www.aliexpress.com/store/pro...6d362360jW3HzY

    I think the servo input power can be single phase, as per the manual.

    The servos come with a drive, sorry for the confusion, I don't need one, i just need to know how to hook up the one I have I think I may have bitten off a bit more than I can chew just because it's in Chinglish... I do usually work out how to get stuff to work though, eventually. If all else fails I can perhaps get my Chinese speaking friend in a room with my electrical engineering buddy....

  4. #4
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    Sep 2006
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    Australind , WA
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    No problem....
    If the drives came with the servos, I would think that the default parameters will be ok just to get it moving.
    It will pay you to check them all before you power up though.

    Wire it up on the bench and see if you can get movement.
    All you'll need it power to the Drive , the motor wired to the drives outputs and plug the encoder in.....

    Usually, the default settings will allow you start/stop the motor via the front buttons and vary the speed, ( with a built in pot , if it has one. If not any 10k - 100k linear pot should do. )

    Once you get life, make parameter changes to enable each function as you go.

    Hope that helps.

    Steve

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    York, North Yorkshire UK
    Posts
    6,439

    Default

    Hi Guys,

    As far as I am aware there are two basic servo types ! One is simply a three phase motor with a variable frequency supply, the other is a DC motor that may or may not be brushless. Both types use a glass encoder scale driven from the motor shaft to determine both speed and position. The supplied driver should be used since motors may not be compatible with a different one.

    As far as Estop is concerned it should be wired to kill the supply voltage, usually by opening the main contacter coil feed voltage, thus stopping the entire machine.

    HTH.
    Best Regards:
    Baron J.

  6. #6
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    Mar 2017
    Location
    Brisbane
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    Default

    Any idea how I wire up the single phase power to it? There are 3 ports as it says in the manual - L1, L2, L3. I think brown goes to L1, blue goes to L2, L3 is unused, but I am not sure. Manual has nothing in there I can understand on the topic.

    Anyone know a good source for the breakers and contactors? Jaycar I'm guessing is a rip job.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Canberra
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    Unless it's marked otherwise, you can hook up active and neutral to any two of the L1 L2 L3 inputs - they all go into a bunch of diodes to turn it into DC.

    As for contactors, RS Components and Element 14 are a good start in terms of specs and price. They can be tricky to understand, as they can have different coil voltages, auxiliary contacts and overloads. For example, if you're running a 12, 24 or 48V DC supply for other parts of the machine, you might use that as the control voltage for the contactor (as it's safer to work with) in which case you might look for a 2 pole contactor with a 24VDC coil.

  8. #8
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    Agree with Rusty.
    Also, Places to buy contactors and the like, you want Electrical Wholesalers ( who sell to public as well.)
    In WA we have Auslec, M&M Electrical and others.
    Ask a local House Basher where he gets his gear from.

    Steve

  9. #9
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    Jun 2010
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    Canberra
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    I was going to mention electrical wholesalers, but experiences with them can be hit and miss. You might get someone knowledgeable and helpful and will do you a decent price, or you might get someone who knows nothing, and charges you list price or worse, which is often many times the trade price. With RS Components and Element 14, you can take your time, refine search terms, Google things you don't understand, sort by price so you're seeing the cheapest option and so on. Once you have an idea of the parameters you're after, and what the price range is, you''re far better position to see what the local wholesalers have to offer.

  10. #10
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    Sep 2006
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    Australind , WA
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyArc View Post
    I was going to mention electrical wholesalers, but experiences with them can be hit and miss. You might get someone knowledgeable and helpful and will do you a decent price, or you might get someone who knows nothing, and charges you list price or worse, which is often many times the trade price. With RS Components and Element 14, you can take your time, refine search terms, Google things you don't understand, sort by price so you're seeing the cheapest option and so on. Once you have an idea of the parameters you're after, and what the price range is, you''re far better position to see what the local wholesalers have to offer.
    Yes, makes sense. 'What Rusty says".....

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