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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    melbourne
    Posts
    341

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    I've got 8 different ER collets, from ER11 up to ER40, for lathe and on iso 30 taper now. I've bought them randomly over the last 4 years, new and cheap except one set which came in a wooden box and was a german make. Every single one, including the german one, had the same problem with the collet nut. If you look at this picture you can see the left one is a new one I haven't modified, and I think it isn't machined right - there is a ring where there shouldnt be one. Hard to see because its all black but that ring sticks out far enough to stop the collet fitting into the taper at the front of the nut. On the right one, you can see I simply machined it off, where its silver.
    1.jpg
    In the next photo you can see how the collect sits flush in modified one on the left and the collet is back a bit on the new one. The ring is actually offset as well, its not concentric to the rest.

    2.jpg
    Because this has happened for me with all 8 collect chucks, I thought I must be stupid and not know something. I couldn't understand why no-one has ever mentioned this, and just assumed I don't know something they all know - maybe there is some special reason for the extra ring in there. I know I'm unlucky enough to get every faulty one in melbourne, but maybe, just maybe, all manufacturers use the same cad file (and just scale it for the different sizes) and its wrong. Why no-one else ever mentioned it worries me, but if it works, why not remove the ring? I've had no problems with mine in use, once I removed the ring.

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Wodonga Vic
    Age
    38
    Posts
    633

    Default

    If you push the collet in on an angle it will travel past the offset ring and "snap" into place in the nut, doing the reverse will get it back out of the collet nut. the offset ring had me confused at first too

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    melbourne
    Posts
    341

    Default

    Ha ha, well that explains it, I was being stupid. I still think thw first one woildnt let the collet in and then ive juat removed them anyway. What is the purpose of thw ring?

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Wodonga Vic
    Age
    38
    Posts
    633

    Default

    I'm starting to think the main purpose of that ring is to cause frustration and sore fingers trying to get the collet back out, I like the idea of removing it altogether.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    melbourne australia
    Posts
    3,228

    Default

    I just tap the collets out of the nut with a plastic mallet.
    Chris

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Norwood-ish, Adelaide
    Age
    59
    Posts
    6,541

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sossity View Post
    What is the purpose of the ring?
    It's to help withdraw the collet so it does not stay lodged in the chuck. The collets usually come out easily but you may need to rotate the nut until you are pushing where the ring "isn't" (I suppose you could mark that spot with a dot of paint or something)

    Michael

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Wodonga Vic
    Age
    38
    Posts
    633

    Default

    Hi Michael, you wouldn't happen to use ER32 collets in your workshop?

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Far West Wimmera
    Age
    63
    Posts
    4,049

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael G View Post
    It's to help withdraw the collet so it does not stay lodged in the chuck. The collets usually come out easily but you may need to rotate the nut until you are pushing where the ring "isn't" (I suppose you could mark that spot with a dot of paint or something)

    Michael
    Getting that Déjà vu feeling yet?

    I was in the same position some years ago. Michael helped me then as well. I can tell you that the ring is a good idea. If you remove it the collet will stick inside the chuck. A light tap on the edge will release it, but it is much easier to use the ring. The collets come straight out of the nut if you push on the right side. Mark the nut on the side to push from as Michael says.

    Dean

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Far West Wimmera
    Age
    63
    Posts
    4,049

    Default

    I recently had an issue with a Chinese seller. After multiple times of asking for a return address in China I said I would just return it to the Sydney address it was sent from. "How about you just send it to the Sydney address then friend. What do you think of this?" I won't repeat my answer. The only address I had was the return address on the parcel, except for one in Chinese script on the returns page. EBay refunded me and they are going to chase the buyer. It was meant to be sent from China, but came from Sydney instead. I think they were interested in his refusal to provide an address despite multiple requests for one.

    Most times I have just been refunded tho. This was the first proper return I have done. I have found Chinese sellers to be pretty good overall.

    Just to be clear I was suggesting opening a dispute with Ebay. I know they are interlinked but not Paypal.
    Yes, this is the way to go. Paypal has nothing to do with it. There is no financial dispute. It has been a long time. Is it to late to open a dispute? EBay has always looked after me. Leaving negative feedback will not do your feedback any favours and this may affect the way sellers respond to you.

    Dean

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Vic
    Age
    48
    Posts
    544

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    I am with Michael, that "lip" on the nut is to pull the collet out of the holder when you undo. I insert on an angle with the thicker side goes into the groove first.

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    melbourne
    Posts
    341

    Default

    Thanks, now i know I can try the unmodified ones. I quite liked the way the modded ones worked though. With the er40 in the mill especially, and with a heavy cutter in it, I can loosen the nut with one hand on the brake, one on the spanner, and I know the cutter won't drop out until I tap it with a rubber hammer. Is there a risk it will drop out as I unscrew the nut and the collet opens before I have a hand free to catch the cutter?

  12. #42
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Lower Lakes SA
    Age
    58
    Posts
    2,607

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    How much runout do people think is acceptable - or realistic - from a chinese collet chuck? Say 50mm out. I'm considering returning one.

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Norwood-ish, Adelaide
    Age
    59
    Posts
    6,541

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    Quote Originally Posted by NedsHead View Post
    Hi Michael, you wouldn't happen to use ER32 collets in your workshop?
    I have a few but not the full set (enough for the cutter grinding jig).

    Quote Originally Posted by Bryan View Post
    How much runout do people think is acceptable - or realistic - from a chinese collet chuck? Say 50mm out. I'm considering returning one.
    I think if you have 50mm run out you are in trouble. This is from H&F and they are claiming 0.02 to 0.03 although I suspect the collets on ebay are a grade or two down on this again.


    I'd check the concentricity of the chuck bore - it may be that you can fix it with a little emery or a light skim.

    Michael

  14. #44
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Lower Lakes SA
    Age
    58
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    2,607

    Default

    Michael, I meant run out measured 50mm away from the collet. Where do they spec them, at the bore?

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Norwood-ish, Adelaide
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    59
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    6,541

    Default

    Yeah, I guessed that but could not resist

    From the diagram, it looks like they put a piece of ground bar stock in a collet and then check run out at distance L from the collet face.
    For checking the bore I'd just get a DTI and put it directly in there, at the front and then at the rear as it could be poorly ground. Perhaps would not hurt to blue up the bore and then do a contact test with a collet, see if there are any lumps and bumps that are kicking things out.

    Michael

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