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  1. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    Again this is where the government needs to step in and help Australian Business' out. All these 'Free Postage' offers overseas companies are offering shouldn't be aloud, make them (The Overseas seller) pay a tax.. we do.

    I find it rather funny that I see Australia Post Employees waltzing around delivering 'Free Postage' parcels. Who's paying for this? Who gets the postage cost? Oh that's right the Government.

    On CTC, I'm fairly sure they are branched over China and have affiliates which all share the same data and images etc they just use different names. But that's what I'm here for to compare other companies.

    Anyhow happy times
    Look, 'free postage' is rubbish and everyone should know it. If you don't, then I don't think much of your business acumen quite frankly.

    For anything weighing under 5 kg, you could add $17.00 to your price and say it came with 'free postage' because that's the cost of a 5kg satchel from Australia Post. All that term really means is the postage is bundled into the price, which is exactly what the overseas sellers do. We all know that there's no such thing as a free lunch....

    As for the Government getting the postage revenue, I totally fail to understand your point. The Government OWNS Australia Post. Who ELSE should get the revenue?

    And, FWIW, there are a whole raft of international postage rates agreements that specify what proportion of postage goes where. This long predating the internet sales boom.

    So no, the Australian Government shouldn't step in and restrict trade, which is really what you want without saying so.

    The only valid point you have is GST and that's 10%. Any time an Australian seller has goods priced within 15 to 20% of the best Ebay price, I'll buy locally. As has been noted, the margin is usually more like 100% difference and sorry but I'll buy from overseas at that margin. It's not like 99% of Australian Ebay sellers actually *make* anything here after all, they're basically middlemen taking a profit cut via markup on goods they import. The whole selling chain is flattening out and this is not going to stop regardless of what effect it has on various businesses.

    I don't really want this to degenerate into a vendor bashing exercise but you *have* to realise that you are now selling into a global market and that is just how it is. Complaining about it and saying the Government should 'do something' cuts no ice at all.

    PDW

  2. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Shed View Post
    Just to illustrate the disparity the Australian consumer faces:

    You list an ER32-MT3 chuck with 9 ER32 collets (about half a full set) for about $260 + postage say $275

    A quick flick to Ebay, without trying to find the cheapest seller

    ER32-MT3 chuck with a full set (19) of ER32 collets $150
    (and I have deliberately taken listings where I pay for item and pay for postage)

    Brand NEW ER32 MT3 M12 Morse Taper 3 ER Collet Chuck Holder CNC Milling Lathe | eBay

    NEW 19 PCS ER32 Spring Collets SET Range 2mm 20mm ER32 Collet Chuck CNC MILL | eBay

    that is almost half the price.

    I know that you will say that your items are better quality than the Ebay items, but I actually have those Ebay collets and they came in the same little boxes shown on your (vey small) picture and they are excellent.

    Now, I assume your reference to "our lacks government" refers to the vexed issue of GST on overseas buying, so let's add the 10% GST to the Ebay order.

    That makes it $175, I would still be $100 better off, and I would have a full set of ER32 collets as against a half set.
    I'm not going to get into a slanging match, but our sets offer a mixture of both Metric and Imperial Collets whereas the ones you have pointed out are all in metric. I can't comment on their quality because I haven't purchased them. Adding to that, does it mention where these collets are made along with the Chuck? Ours are made in Taiwan.

    Which brings me to my point when you want to ask a question on these items or (Say you are unaware of this forum) who do you turn too? What about the technical aspect of things regarding the item you brought? We are a phone call away, they are email which god knows how long it will take to reply, plus a costly return freight and time factor away if a problem arises. This is quite common and disturbing and we hear it first hand on the phone almost everyday, ask that seller a techncal question regarding the stuff hes selling I can almost guarantee he won't know the answer.

  3. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post

    I'm interested in what you consider unfair in terms of our prices RC.

    Sorry, I meant quite fair.... I worded it badly..... I have looked at your prices before and thought they were high, but I see now that they seem quite respectable...
    Light red, the colour of choice for the discerning man.

  4. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDW View Post
    Look, 'free postage' is rubbish and everyone should know it. If you don't, then I don't think much of your business acumen quite frankly.

    For anything weighing under 5 kg, you could add $17.00 to your price and say it came with 'free postage' because that's the cost of a 5kg satchel from Australia Post. All that term really means is the postage is bundled into the price, which is exactly what the overseas sellers do. We all know that there's no such thing as a free lunch....
    Rather harsh and demanding words from yourself there regarding my business acumen. You run your own business do you?

    So items that are under 500 grams that costs us $6.95 to send at our post office is ok and fair, yet a seller from China can send the same item marked at half the cost to our customer 'Post Free'. Go have a look at all the .99c items that post free from China...

    So by an Australian adding $17.00 to our price is going to go down well when everyone in Australia is complaining about the prices we sell our items at.. right

    As for the Government getting the postage revenue, I totally fail to understand your point. The Government OWNS Australia Post. Who ELSE should get the revenue?

    And, FWIW, there are a whole raft of international postage rates agreements that specify what proportion of postage goes where. This long predating the internet sales boom.

    So no, the Australian Government shouldn't step in and restrict trade, which is really what you want without saying so.
    My point... dear god. The Government should be putting Australian Sellers FIRST... I never said restrict trade, they need to make it fair.

    Complaining about it and saying the Government should 'do something' cuts no ice at all.
    Yes and letting people on this site state my prices are unfair is going to sit well for me. Right

    Thanks for your insights.

  5. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Shed View Post
    I know that you will say that your items are better quality than the Ebay items, but I actually have those Ebay collets and they came in the same little boxes shown on your (vey small) picture and they are excellent.

    Now, I assume your reference to "our lacks government" refers to the vexed issue of GST on overseas buying, so let's add the 10% GST to the Ebay order.

    That makes it $175, I would still be $100 better off, and I would have a full set of ER32 collets as against a half set.


    The problem is just cost once goods hit AU shores.... Anyone had anything to do with importing goods knows what goes on, on the waterfront... People just do not give a #### about efficiency or reducing costs, they have no need to, as they just pass it on down the line..I will give you an example.... Last week I was booked up to assist with the berthing of a ship, the agent gave a time and day, looking up the pilot board (the list of ships being berthed for the day) and it was not on the list, so they knew it was not coming in, but they did not cancel our booking (I am not even sure they even bothered to contact us to cancel it), as such the company I work for hit them with a cancellation fee (and I got paid 1/2 rate for having a good nights sleep rather then being awoken at 00:30 to berth the ship), which they could have avoided by cancelling us 8 hours before our booking time.. Why they did not cancel us I do not know as we knew 12 hours before the ship was not going to be berthed....... They just pass the cost on, so no skin off their noses...

    When you are shown the invoice the importer has to pay, as I was shown with the surface plate I purchased from a local business, you can see where their costs are.... The cost once it hit AU waters to the time if left the wharf area cost more then the freight from China to AU waters....

    This idea is charging GST is just off on some wild tangent and will not change a thing... Because the GST is but a puny cost of the goods....

    In any case, I look at Gerry Harvey going on about losing AU jobs to people bringing in goods themselves GST free, and I ask myself, how many even crocodile tears did he shed when back decades ago he was importing cheaper goods that were also made in Australia and forcing Australian manufacturing to go bust and factory workers to lose their jobs.... I have no sympathy for him... And I will continue to bring in goods myself for the simple reason our market is that small we have an extremely small range of goods to choose from of which most of them are not what I want... Where in Australia can I buy canode marking compound? Just late last year I was after a 16dp 14.5PA gear cutter that does 14 teeth... All to cut one gear.... I am not going to buy one at a great price to cut one gear.... I got burnt buying two gears in Australia from a "reputable" seller and one appeared second hand yet I paid more for it then the price of the gear cutter to cut it had I cut it myself....
    Light red, the colour of choice for the discerning man.

  6. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    I'm not going to get into a slanging match, but our sets offer a mixture of both Metric and Imperial Collets whereas the ones you have pointed out are all in metric. I can't comment on their quality because I haven't purchased them. Adding to that, does it mention where these collets are made along with the Chuck? Ours are made in Taiwan.

    Which brings me to my point when you want to ask a question on these items or (Say you are unaware of this forum) who do you turn too? What about the technical aspect of things regarding the item you brought? We are a phone call away, they are email which god knows how long it will take to reply, plus a costly return freight and time factor away if a problem arises. This is quite common and disturbing and we hear it first hand on the phone almost everyday, ask that seller a techncal question regarding the stuff hes selling I can almost guarantee he won't know the answer.
    I wasn't aware I had "entered into a slanging match" I was merely responding to your posts and showing how things are from the consumers' perspective.

    I neither judged your business nor your prices. You are perfectly free to sell whatever you like at whatever price takes your fancy, just as I am perfectly free to buy whatever from wherever.

    Difference being I am not asking the "government" for assistance in protecting me from the big bad world out there.

    On this very hot day I would say, if you can't stand the heat stay out of the kitchen.

  7. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Shed View Post
    I wasn't aware I had "entered into a slanging match" I was merely responding to your posts and showing how things are from the consumers' perspective.

    I neither judged your business nor your prices. You are perfectly free to sell whatever you like at whatever price takes your fancy, just as I am perfectly free to buy whatever from wherever.
    Now your choosing which parts of my reply to answer clever but whatever floats your boat and gets you by. I also said 'I'm not going to get into a slanging match' never said there was one .

    Remember I was just backing up my business, I have my reasons and you do with yours about buying and selling from overseas. I understand the benefits for you guys to buy from overseas but the lack of awareness for Australian businesses is


    Difference being I am not asking the "government" for assistance in protecting me from the big bad world out there.

    On this very hot day I would say, if you can't stand the heat stay out of the kitchen.
    Difference is again your a buyer and I'm a seller. I'm looking to protect our business which has been running for 30 years if there is something wrong me then shoot me.

    Damn, shes a hot one day aye

  8. #143
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    Lower Lakes SA
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    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    Thanks for your reply. They seem to work fine for me on my end? Just to let you know, the links you have provided are not the correct links they lead to nowhere.
    That's where my browser goes when I click on the small pictures. What should I be clicking on?

    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    Ours are made in Taiwan.
    Is all your stuff Taiwanese Len?

  9. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    Rather harsh and demanding words from yourself there regarding my business acumen. You run your own business do you?
    Actually - I do. However it's not a business trying to sell imported products so it's not at all comparable. It is quite profitable, however.

    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    So items that are under 500 grams that costs us $6.95 to send at our post office is ok and fair, yet a seller from China can send the same item marked at half the cost to our customer 'Post Free'. Go have a look at all the .99c items that post free from China...

    So by an Australian adding $17.00 to our price is going to go down well when everyone in Australia is complaining about the prices we sell our items at.. right
    The point *is* that THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS FREE POSTAGE! Got it? It's merely a marketing ploy. Chinese postage rates are cheaper than Australian ones, so what, UK postal rates are cheaper than Aussie ones too. I buy stuff from the UK rather than the USA because of the postage if that's the difference, it's called the best bang for my buck.

    What you're saying is that your total cost to make a sale is higher than someone in China has to pay and that you think that's unfair, and you'd like someone to do something about it. I understand that, I simply don't agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    My point... dear god. The Government should be putting Australian Sellers FIRST... I never said restrict trade, they need to make it fair.
    Why should the Government put Aussie SELLERS first rather than Aussie BUYERS? Which is the current situation.... I'm serious here. Give me a single reason why the Government should put your interests, as an importer/retailer, higher than my interests as a purchaser, and make me pay more money for something.

    And it's a funny thing, but whenever I hear someone say that they want to make something 'fair' they generally mean that they want the current arrangement changed to favour their interests.

    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    Yes and letting people on this site state my prices are unfair is going to sit well for me. Right

    Thanks for your insights.
    I haven't criticised your prices. Fact is, if you are for example selling a Taiwanese collet chuck & collets for 2X the price of a no-name Chinese set, you've got a good case for arguing that your price is fully justified because of the higher quality. Quality always sells. However when I look at your Web site for say a keyless drill chuck I don't find a specification, manufacturer, country of origin etc. All I see is for the 0-13mm chuck the max TIR is indicated. I recently bought a Cat 40 keyless chuck 0-13mm from a vendor in the USA, designed & balanced for CNC mills at some insane max RPM, with a full specification, country of origin (Taiwan if it matters) cheaper than your price. So - what am I to assume here? If I can find the exact same item on Fleabay from some other seller *regardless of location on the planet* for a substantially lesser price, then the 'quality' argument goes away. That leaves selling on fast delivery and quality of service. I personally *will* pay a premium for both of those non-cash items. All things being equal, I'd buy off of you if your prices are within say 20% higher than overseas but I have to know in detail what I'm going to get for my money.

    I lived through this with exclusive distribution systems for software back in the 1980's and 1990's. No high speed internet, no easy download of tens to hundreds of megabytes of data files. Physical product locked up by distributors with exclusive geographical territory.

    All those businesses are DEAD. My insight for you is, you will be dead too unless you offer something that can't be commoditised and done cheaper from a warehouse somewhere in a 3rd World country.

    PDW

  10. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by LPR Toolmakers View Post
    I'm not going to get into a slanging match, but our sets offer a mixture of both Metric and Imperial Collets whereas the ones you have pointed out are all in metric. I can't comment on their quality because I haven't purchased them. Adding to that, does it mention where these collets are made along with the Chuck? Ours are made in Taiwan.

    Which brings me to my point when you want to ask a question on these items or (Say you are unaware of this forum) who do you turn too? What about the technical aspect of things regarding the item you brought? We are a phone call away, they are email which god knows how long it will take to reply, plus a costly return freight and time factor away if a problem arises. This is quite common and disturbing and we hear it first hand on the phone almost everyday, ask that seller a techncal question regarding the stuff hes selling I can almost guarantee he won't know the answer.
    Why a mix of metric and imperial collets? I would not buy a mix myself as it is pointless. I have a full set of ER32 collets and it covers all sizes throughout the range. The lack of detail about your products is one thing that concerned me. I like to know exactly what I am buying and I have seen far too many cases of high prices being charged for the same cheap Chinese made product. If you are selling better quality gear you need to get this information across to your customers.

    Dean

  11. #146
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    Ozmestore ozmestore1 on eBay must be doing OK...

    It is all about meeting the market and what market are you aiming for..

    It is no good selling expensive Taiwanese ER collet chucks when the market wants cheaper Chinese made ones....

    I dare say I expect the GST free allowance to be reduced later in the year.... I do not know how low they will make it though...

    But as an example of costs for a comparable country...

    RDG tools in the UK angle plate 8 x 6 x 5 AU$65 including 20% UK GST Angle Plates

    LPR toolmakers for same size no webs $122... 8" Open Ended Angle Plate - LPR Toolmakers

    It is twice the price as what someone in the UK would pay, and it is also expensive to do business in the UK like here...

    If I saw both side by side, which one would I buy? The cheaper one of course...

    RDG must be doing something right... They probably have a bigger market as well though.... Although with the internet stores should be getting smaller but the back mail order side getting bigger...

    I will continue to shop for goods made overseas from a worldwide perspective.... Just as deregulation and better and faster transportation means Qld is no longer self sufficient in milk (resulting in the decimation of the Qld dairy industry) but instead relies on dairy farms in Victoria, retail shops in Australia that are just resellers of overseas made goods need to understand that due to the ease of bringing in small goods into the country it is now just as easy to buy from a low cost retailer close to the manufacturer...

    You can no longer rely on a captive market.... Just waiting now for it to be made easier for individuals to bring big items into the country...
    Light red, the colour of choice for the discerning man.

  12. #147
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    May 2012
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    Default Import costs.

    Seems people in our cities and populous areas think they have a problem with import and distribution costs. A business in the East Kimberley recently imported a 40 ft container of fragile goods. Cost from China to Fremantle was $2000. Cost from Fremantle to the Kimberley was another $7000. Still some room to streamline our distribution systems. Our WA and NT (contract) coastal shipping service has just closed so it won't improve soon. Combustor.
    Old iron in the Outback, Kimberley WA.

  13. #148
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    Thanks all for investigating and comparing our prices to the world market, just remember all I did was stick a link up to our site like so many others have done in the past. It wasn't intended to be used as a form of comparing or justification for buying overseas. In saying that I will take note that we need to add more information to the products we sell and add better images also.

    I will leave you all alone now take it easy.

  14. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combustor View Post
    Seems people in our cities and populous areas think they have a problem with import and distribution costs. A business in the East Kimberley recently imported a 40 ft container of fragile goods. Cost from China to Fremantle was $2000. Cost from Fremantle to the Kimberley was another $7000. Still some room to streamline our distribution systems. Our WA and NT (contract) coastal shipping service has just closed so it won't improve soon. Combustor.
    The problem with costs in Australia is that we employ 4 people to do the work of 2 and only actually get the work of 1 done.!!
    Shane

    Got the square peg in the round hole, now can't get it out !!

  15. #150
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    I'm curious,

    I purchased some Aprica branded slitting saws not long ago, from ebay I think? They perform very well, and up there with more expensive Controx for tracking and cut quality...

    Just today I got some bits and pieces from LPR toolmakers, and I notice that it's Aprica Pty Ltd on the paypal invoice.... is this the same company? What other Aprica branded tools are there?

    Ray

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