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Thread: Your latest project
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14th Aug 2017, 11:10 PM #1876Philomath in training
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I'm trying to make up one of these for a gauge. The bottom will screw into a pot magnet and the top fastens onto a bracket behind the gauge. The two pieces are not that difficult - ball turner to round the end,then a slitting saw to make the slots/ flats and a drill to make the hole. The trickier bit is the domed pivot. To put that part in perspective, the main pieces are 10mm in diameter, the thread on the bottom is M6 and that dome is 8mm diameter on the end of a 4mm shaft (I think - I'm scaling and guessing layout/ function from this picture).
Joint.jpg
To add a degree of difficulty, the 4mm shaft has a M3 internal thread in it so that the joint can be clamped together, so the question becomes how to produce a small part of this size. I started with shaping the dome with a file and then turning down the shank. That effectively gave me this -
P1040225.JPG
I could have parted off, made up a split bush to hold the pin and then drilled and tapped to suit. However, the finished part will be just under 6mm long under the head so not much to hold, and the exact length will be determined on assembly, so I would really like to wait until the other bits are together to get the length spot on. Another way may be to hang onto the head some how, but the edges converge to a line (so it sits flat on the joint), so not much to hang onto and lots of possibilities to damage.
Instead I did it this way - parted off so there was a length of stock larger diameter than the head diameter, then reversed it in the chuck. A clearance hole was drilled almost to the start of the pin then a 2.5mm through to the head/ shaft intersection. M3 taps (lead and bottoming) were then used to tap the hollow shaft. Lots of backing out and clearing chips from the hole and the taps.
P1040226.JPG
Once I have the other parts assembled, I will then part to length. Debating whether to put a M3x3 grubscrew or similar in there before parting so that I can wind that out, smoothing the thread before trying to use it. I have not been able to find a picture of the other side of that joint, so I'm not sure what style of head the screw will have. Probably similar but with a slot but that will be (relatively) easy as that will be made up with a pilot shaft on it so that the screwdriver slot can just screw it into a die (good theory anyway...).
Michael
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15th Aug 2017, 01:11 AM #1877.
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15th Aug 2017, 08:32 AM #1878Philomath in training
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Joint.jpg
A good spot, but I'm not sure it is original - key differences seem to be the groove around the spigot in the original vs a longitudinal gash in the copy and the rebate for the pivot pin in the original vs none in the copy. The roll pin and screw arrangement in the copy is one way of making that joint but if it were original I can't see why a domed head would be on the other end.
The basic shape is there though but while the joint may be an easier way to do things, the longitudinal gash seems to be a more complicated way of getting that locating/ non-rotational feature than just grooving in the lathe.
Interesting.
Michael
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15th Aug 2017, 10:19 AM #1879Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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Not that much metal work involved but here it is anyway.
IMG_2449.jpg
More details here Solder fume extraction.
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15th Aug 2017, 10:36 AM #1880.
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Hi Michael,
While some of the parts are obviously poor ring-ins I'm not sure about the hinged connector. The vee groove is the same as that on the grooved rod that came with my indicator and the groove in the eBay photo does align with the centreline of the pin and screw. A fair amount of careful effort that is not evident on the other parts. Adolf Sulger's design of the angle indicator was patented nearly 70 years ago and I imagine during that time there have been numerous permutations. Image below from nielsmachines.com
Bob
reglus.JPG
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15th Aug 2017, 09:30 PM #1881Philomath in training
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This is the bit that makes me think it is not Swiss made - I can't imagine any self respecting Swiss machinist saying 'Well, yes, the cutter over ran, but it does not matter'
7.jpg
(This coming from from someone now doing a second remake because the deburring was not symmetrical side to side )
From a design point of view it is worth thinking about the function too. The grooves on the rods need to be vertical so that the fittings can slide up and down. However, on this piece a vertical groove means that the dial could slide off if the screw was not tight. With a magnetic base and the possibility that the assembly could be inverted, something less than desirable. A circumferential groove on the other hand captures the dial so that even if the screw is loose it will not slide off. Not conclusive but I'd be voting for circumferential.
Michael
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16th Aug 2017, 12:48 PM #1882.
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That's suggesting that if you wanted to mount the indicator upside down you would really need to acquire the mag base with its radially grooved hinged rod. My indicator, tightened in position with its thumbscrew engaging the rod's vee slot, stays put when inverted. If I wanted to pursue insurance I could simply centre drill a hole in the vee, enabling the thumbscrew's point to be securely positioned. My indicator is plastic and devoid of its needle dampening oil filling. It's light as a consequence and probably the reason why there is less incentive for it to slide off. But, in defence of your groove argument, the indicator could easily be delicately rotated when mag base mounted in position. Definitely not the case with a rigidly mounted indicator.
I have wired off a question to Reglus about the eBay base's originality, or lack of. It will be interesting to see if they respond.
On to more important stuff....... How will you prevent the domed "nut'' from rotating. A flat engaging the shoulder of the 10mm bar?
I have a 0.016" thick 1" bored slitting saw if you need to borrow it for the screw head.
BT
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16th Aug 2017, 03:50 PM #1883Philomath in training
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Haven't got to the screw yet - although I think I need to pretty soon
P1040232.JPG
The thread is longer than it needs to be and is pretty rough anyway (and that is with the base diameter being slightly undersize, split die right open and Trefolex), so that might get drilled out and replaced with a pre made thread once the magnet arrives. (The mystery metal used takes a polish really well but a thread is another matter it seems)
The angle indicator part of Reglus was sold off in 2012 to another company. I have a query in myself but was thinking of asking that when I got a response...
I have a thin slitting saw somewhere here myself but will let you know if I need something finer. (On edit - found a 28 thou cutter which did the job)
MichaelLast edited by Michael G; 16th Aug 2017 at 06:27 PM. Reason: added a bit
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16th Aug 2017, 08:44 PM #1884.
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I hadn't seen the photo of the progress so far. Outstanding work Michael!!
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17th Aug 2017, 04:00 PM #1885Most Valued Member
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This isn't my idea. I guess you'd call it an outrigger. Helps stop long lengths of stock from flailing when turning in the lathe.
An old brake disc, a 1200 long 20mm gal water pipe and flange, two 28mm bearings (35mm would be better) a Delrin bush tapped 12mm and a lump of Ali.
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18th Aug 2017, 03:14 AM #1886
Hello Jack,
I would definitely add a hook to drop over the rotating bar, especially if it was relatively thin.
I once saw a length of 1/4" inch brass rod curl up and whip on an auto lathe because the operator failed to put the tube back on when feeding a new bar. He got his arm broken trying to grab it instead of hitting the stop button.Best Regards:
Baron J.
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18th Aug 2017, 11:01 AM #1887Banned
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I have one of those fandangle outrigger things. I didn't make mine I found it about 35 years ago and have been using it for all sorts of jobs since then - very handy item to have in the workshop. Mine's a little different in design though: it's mounted on legs, has two movable arms to support the work and is height adjustable. Instead of bearings to hold the work, the outrigger has clamps on the end of each arm, they're infinitely and auto adjusting and envelope the entire circumference of the work. I wrap a bit of rag around the work first before bringing the clamps into play as the clamps get a little hot, particularly at high RPMs. If the work does get too hot the outrigger complains a bit, dirt and grease don't seem to agree with it either. After the jobs done, being a multi use workshop item I can usually put it to work on another job. Some might call it an outrigger, or a multi tool, I just call it the wife.
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18th Aug 2017, 11:02 AM #1888Most Valued Member
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Hi Baron,
I was considering adding a third bearing which screws down onto the top of the rod, creating something like a mini-steady. Can you elaborate on your hook idea? Is it just a weighted hook that hangs on the bar, or fixed to the Ali block to capture the bar if it tries to escape?
Chris
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18th Aug 2017, 11:08 AM #1889Most Valued Member
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18th Aug 2017, 02:07 PM #1890Home Hobbist
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I too obtained and at considerable ongoing expense anout-rigger/multitool 32 years ago. Used it once and it refused to operate inthe workshop ever since.
It is a fancy model that as warning sounds, some of which isway too graphic to bestow on the readers here gentle ears and it gets shrillerand louder as it ages.
It’s a non-refundable model and has a whole family of othermodels as backing.
I recommend careful operation of similar units to the Forumas it could become hazardous to ones wellbeing.
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