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Thread: Whisperings
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10th Aug 2015, 09:49 PM #826Most Valued Member
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Hi Baron,
I'm using pressure rated fittings on this job and it was a surprise to me that they are actually tapered threads in the female bores. I didn't think they came that way but these did although I am pretty sure and in fact quite confident that they are 55 deg Whitworth and not 50.
I'm not sure about the bigger diameter stuff but I do know that some sizes are different TPI on the NPT (formerly known as Briggs).
I can absolutely believe in a thread engagement of 65% but when mating two tapered threads the aim is for 100% engagement.
The job is going well at the moment and I should be able to finish the flange tomorrow...fingers crossed.
Phil
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10th Aug 2015, 10:18 PM #827Most Valued Member
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Now Pete, you know they didn't have welders back in those days and yes there are some bits that are welded and they are also well (and sometimes not so well) hidden from public view. I don't have that luxury with this job as it is stuck out front of the boiler, plus we refuse to 'modernise' a historical piece of equipment unless we really have to. If we didn't bother going the extra mile then we may as well just stand there with books and show pictures of what it used to look like.
Those rules are rules that we stand by in the interests of historical accuracy to convey a little bit of living history that can't be found in books. You can look at a picture of a boiler furnace and it will never convey what it is like to actually stand in front of one.
Just to clarify, I didn't make one the wrong size, in fact it was spot on, just for the wrong application
Phil
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11th Aug 2015, 01:54 AM #828Best Regards:
Baron J.
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11th Aug 2015, 07:21 AM #829Most Valued Member
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Phew on the 55 deg typo Baron, there are so many discrepancies on the pipe threads that I thought that may have been another one I hadn't found yet.
I had never seen a tapered bore thread either but all these ones are including the valves.
I can only guess that with CNC capabilities now it is easy.
As you can imagine I have done the odd steam pipe thread over the years and I have never come across a tapered thread on a socket, barrel union, valve, elbow, tee etc...but I also may have never looked close enough it seems.
Glad you like the pics with the notes, they are working well for provenance too.
Phil
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11th Aug 2015, 09:57 PM #830Most Valued Member
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Of course they did, they called them 'blacksmiths'......
Yah, I understand the 'historical accuracy' bit but IMO - and yes, I *am* opinionated - this can go too far.
I use as classic examples the crap that goes on with heritage listed houses. One example I know of, they had to re-roof with corrugated iron sheets of the same length as the originals. Never mind that it leaked, never mind that we know better than to pitch a roof that low with end laps, it had to be done to meet the 'heritage' standard.
The silly idiots didn't realise they were using zincalume though, so it still wasn't right.
IMO pressure fittings fall into the same category. Sorry, we know a better way of doing it, a stronger and safer way. There's a lot of things that used to be done that we no longer do, historical accuracy be damned, because they weren't safe then and aren't safe now. Difference is, now we know.
Yeah, a screwed fitting, done properly, is perfectly safe. No argument from me. I'd still have welded it.
Sitting in Echuca now. Might be near you on Friday, hard to say for sure.
PDW
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11th Aug 2015, 10:47 PM #831
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11th Aug 2015, 11:11 PM #832Most Valued Member
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11th Aug 2015, 11:40 PM #833Golden Member
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12th Aug 2015, 09:33 AM #834Most Valued Member
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13th Aug 2015, 06:59 AM #835Most Valued Member
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Well the sparge is finally finished and I am happy to say I learnt a few new things about pipe threads as well.
Of course the proof will be in the pudding but I'm pretty happy with how it fitted up.
Phil
ps In the 4th pic the bottom line reads 'alignment inside the boiler'. Dunno why it does that
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13th Aug 2015, 08:52 AM #836Most Valued Member
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Looks OK - needs to get nicely black before it looks original though.....
BTW somewhere at home I have a small box full of those boiler level glasses - you can have them if you want them, I only grabbed them to pass onto a good home one day, no use to me.
I need to have a return to my previous state before I build a boat suitable for fitting a steam engine. Not to mention building the engine itself. Though there's always this baby in the back of my mind, for when I'm really bored....
http://hasbrouck.8m.com/eng8.htm
PDW
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14th Aug 2015, 07:47 AM #837Most Valued Member
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Hi Pete
I'm sure the flange is going to get a good dose of boot polish and become like the rest of the boiler very soon.
Those gauge glasses could be very handy as we use them on the lubricators as well. For the boilers we buy them cut to length and fused on the ends, plus, with the lengths involved in the boilers, any longitudinal scratches create a weak point and the potential for cracking.
Nice little engine that one. The boss and I have on several occasions kicked around the idea of putting a paddle steamer back on Lake Wendouree. There used to be one back in the day.
As an aside, we have Klinger gauge glasses on our boilers so it pays to buy Klinger parts when we service the boilers and of course new glass rubber seals always go in.
We got the original rubbers from Klinger this year (as usual), and yesterday I threw the whole bag out. It seems that Klinger is now outsourcing some of their gear most likely from India or China as they are now too small to create a seal and are useless. We sourced after market ones yesterday and will continue to do so.
A bit sad when the aftermarket ones are actually useable and not the maker supplied ones, with their name moulded into them as well.
I'm sure the shareholders are enjoying the money they are making from the savings in amount of rubber used.
Phil
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26th Aug 2015, 12:01 AM #838Most Valued Member
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Back onto the hydrostatic lubricators, this time the one off the Ruston engine that drives the beam pump.
A couple of new bits and fresh packing for the glasses and it should be right to go.
Setting the safety valves on the Roberts boiler in the morning, hopefully all goes well.
Phil
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26th Aug 2015, 12:35 AM #839Most Valued Member
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Nice work Phil, one little problem, it doesn't match the patina of the rest of it. Needs sand blasting and some dirt rubbed into it.
Kryn
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26th Aug 2015, 07:32 AM #840Most Valued Member
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Hi Kryn
I look at it this way, my bits are correct, the rest is just old looking. Don't worry, noone else falls for it either.
There was another little valve that needed replacing as well but the handle had snapped off so I have no idea what it looked like originally. As much as I search, I can't find a pic of an original.
The lubricator is made by 'The Vacuum lubricator company' from 'The Albany' in England. If anyone has some pics...
Phil
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