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8th Nov 2018, 04:10 PM #1
Why don't we grease our Timken spindle bearings
As I work my way thru my two new to me 260 lathes, I am learning and discovering many things about these lathes, so far all good, very well built and good quality parts from what I see so far....
As I pulled out the spindle today and examined the bearings, I wondered why these aren't packed in grease, after all they are basically the same bearing type used in front end wheel bearings in cars, which have much greater load and travel 100s of thousands of miles with no grease changes, and do just fine. Our lathes present a rather light load for these bearings and certainly will never approach the "mileage" of a bearing in a car.
Just curious, as I bought some new brass elbows today to make up new oilers...as I was installing them I thought why not put in grease fittings instead.
Anyway, food for thought.
Cheers
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8th Nov 2018, 04:20 PM #2Most Valued Member
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Its a good question, I can think of a few possible answers.
Potential RPM is much higher, you average 2 foot ish wheel is only doing 800 - 1000rpm at 100kmph but more importantly grease holds grit in suspension, the loss oil system eases contaminants out, although i actually am not familliar with how the hercuses seal their spindle.
FYI there are grease lubricated spindles but they use some very fancy grease that can really make the pocket bleed.
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8th Nov 2018, 04:34 PM #3
After taking mine apart today, they are fairly well sealed, not with rubber seals, but reasonably tight caps on the outside of the bearings, and a decent aluminum shield on the inside. I would think that as long as you aren't cleaning your lathe with an air nozzle, the chances of getting debris into the bearings are slim. As an experiment for the community, I have decided to pack my bearings with grease and put a grease nipple in place of the oiler on the outside of the headstock. It may take way more years than I will be alive to know if it's better or not...on the other hand the blokes at SB as well as Hercus knew what they were doing when they built these...there must be a reason for the oil. Mine may be a poor example, but as I dismantled it today, there was virtually zero oil anywhere, bearings were dry, shafts were dry...gears dry, she will probably soak up a liter and thank me for it.
Looking forward to some discussion.
Cheers
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8th Nov 2018, 04:36 PM #4Philomath in training
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Grease will also heat up more as more work is required to move the rollers around. Oil will tend to flush things through as well.
Michael
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8th Nov 2018, 04:38 PM #5Member: Blue and white apron brigade
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I don't know about the 260 but the Hercus manual for the older model 9 with the roller bearings and the Hercus mill (which has grease nipples) says definitely DO NOT use grease or engine oil. Because the mill uses grease nipples it's very common to see these clogged with grease and they are PITA to take apart and clean out.
It's not unusual to see dry bearings in machines that have been sitting around as they oil tends to run out quite easily.
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8th Nov 2018, 04:49 PM #6Most Valued Member
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Since you have two machines, if you do grease one, make it the worse of the two!
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8th Nov 2018, 05:21 PM #7China
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From the textbook of turning P.F Hercus fourth edition 1990, Chapter 3 installation construction and maintenance of the lathe, "Grease is not a suitable lubricant for lathe work and should not be used"
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8th Nov 2018, 05:32 PM #8
Well shoot, I thought it was a good idea, but as it's darn near bedtime on this side of the planet and I am raising the walls on my new shop tomorrow, I will hold off on doing anything rash such as fitting grease nipples. I'll await further input....
Cheers
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18th Nov 2018, 07:27 AM #9Diamond Member
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Hi,
I'm pipping in a bit late but I thought the Hercus manual said the lathe bearing were greased for life?
When I get home I'll have a look.
Ben
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18th Nov 2018, 08:38 AM #10Senior Member
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Definitely no grease. If you use grease with the bearings preloaded tight enough to prevent chatter, youll end up with rapidly heating bearings which causes them to expand until they seize. Oil allows you to achieve an appropriate amount of preload to allow it to operate well while keeping temperatures in line. Oil also allows the machine to achieve the spindle speeds it is designed for, something you wont achieve with grease. Also, having a total loss oiling system keeps things cleaner, as others have said.
The previous owner of my my lathe thought they were greased for life...and now a bearing change is on my to do list. Lathes need oil, frequently!!!
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18th Nov 2018, 06:11 PM #11
I too have discovered what Scott mentioned to be the truth, oil, not grease is the way to go for all reasons mentioned. Unlike a car wheel bearing where you have 50 plus HP to power the wheel, not to mention the RPM would be way lower on a car, and there are seals to keep out the dirt and muck...
I chose to use oil, per the manual, Hydraulic 68 or 100. I haven't done anything with the lathe in 2 weeks as I am immersed in new shop construction, which is coming along well, trusses are half up, more tomorrow, then tin later in the week. As mentioned in my other thread about 2 Hercuses, the lathe spins wonderfully at 2140 RPM, and seems happy, although I haven't put a load on it yet.
Cheers
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26th Nov 2018, 09:13 AM #12australian metalworking hobbyist
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26th Nov 2018, 09:16 AM #13australian metalworking hobbyist
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- Jan 2009
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- Holbrook, NSW
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Hi Kilohertz,
Welcome to the Hercus community. Do you mind stating the machine numbers.
Mal
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27th Nov 2018, 03:50 AM #14
Hi Mal,
Lathe s/n 260AT 19996 and the original inspection report that came with it is dated 1990
lathe s/n 260ATLH 18709 guessing late 80's
See my story about these and the restoration of them here..stalled right now as I am building my new shop, in the snow and rain, bloody hell.
//metalworkforums.com/f189/t202...omorrow-hercus
Cheers
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