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Thread: Spool guns

  1. #1
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    Default Spool guns

    https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Mig-Spoo...from=R40&rt=nc

    Thoughts on this gun gents. Yep it's cheap, yep it's Chinese, what isn't? Very, very occasional use for ally. There are a number on eBay, some with leads, some with plugs and so on.

  2. #2
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    where abouts do you live? i note the ad says Suitable for high altitude operation - so unless you live on Mt Kosciusko it may not be suitable...(i also note it doesnt show the weight - never used one, but i suspect a heavy gun would not help...


  3. #3
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    More information required. What sort of welder are you intending to put this on? How thick is the Aluminium you want to work with? What size wire can you run?
    It seems that a lot of people believe that you need a spool gun to tackle Ally. Nothing could be further from the truth and in many cases, a spool gun is far from the best solution.
    For $70 odd dollars you won't be buying much. When you consider there is a motor, a feed mechanism, copper cable and drive rollers in this device, all will be very cheap and probably not work at all well.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karl Robbers View Post
    It seems that a lot of people believe that you need a spool gun to tackle Ally. Nothing could be further from the truth and in many cases, a spool gun is far from the best solution.
    Hi Karl
    I was considering a spool gun as most reports say they are better for Ally. If this is not the case then that's the best news I have heard in a long time. I have never MIG welded Ally before but need to do a job for myself in the near future.
    As I have no idea what I am doing in this area I might have a few questions on how to set up for MIG gun for Ally without using a spool gun.

    Phil

  5. #5
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    I'm starting to look around at MIG machines to replace my UniMIG, and one of the things I was considering is a spool gun option, not because you absolutely need it to run aluminium, but more the convenience of being able to swap between it and steel quickly and easily.

  6. #6
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    I've read on various groups and forums that you can do without a spool gun, instead paying attention to keeping the gun lead straight, making sure the lining is in good condition, some even have very short leads. All sounds good until of course you have problems. Personally I'd like to avoid any problems and start of right using a spool gun.

    As for what thickness material will I be welding, who knows, I'll bet there aren't too many people who don't go beyond what they initially thought they'd use the welder for.

    I have a 180 Unimig, hardly ever use it as I haven't found anything I can weld with a mig that I can't weld with a DC, aluminium being the obvious exception of course. I was thinking of selling it, but as with most, I prefer buying tools to selling them so I thought I may as well set the mig up for aluminium. No idea what I'd use it for, but something will come along I'm sure.

  7. #7
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    Just having a little smile at the internet wisdom. The internet as a collective may indicate that a Spool gun is absolutely necessary because they tried ali welding without one and got birdsnests.
    What the internet experts also did not have in some cases was a larger than normal contact tip.

    Bear in mind that that the cross-sectional size of the Ali wire expands quite a bit when its near welding heat.

    Consequently, the expanded wire plugs the contact tip orifice and the wire speed motor keeps on pumping wire - bingo bird nests.

    Spend a dollar or to on a proper contact tip and let us all know what happens.

    Nearly forgot the wire diameter and alloy type itself play a big part. Skinny weak wire does< EDIT> NOT lend itself well, to being pushed along a longer gun cable. Short length gun cables help here too.

    Grahame
    Last edited by Grahame Collins; 7th Aug 2018 at 10:04 PM. Reason: The King of the Typos has struck again. EDITED

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grahame Collins View Post
    Just having a little smile at the internet wisdom. The internet as a collective may indicate that a Spool gun is absolutely necessary because they tried ali welding without one and got birdsnests.
    What the internet experts also did not have in some cases was a larger than normal contact tip.

    Bear in mind that that the cross-sectional size of the Ali wire expands quite a bit when its near welding heat.

    Consequently, the expanded wire plugs the contact tip orifice and the wire speed motor keeps on pumping wire - bingo bird nests.

    Spend a dollar or to on a proper contact tip and let us all know what happens.

    Nearly forgot the wire diameter and alloy type itself play a big part. Skinny weak wire does lend itself well, to being pushed along a longer gun cable. Short length gun cables help here too.

    Grahame
    Dead right in everything you've said.
    Spool guns I feel are often used to compensate for poor set up and welders too small to do the job properly. A spool gun will run thin wire more successfully than a standard push setup, albeit at the expense of a heavier, bulkier gun and extortionately priced wire.
    If you can run 1.2mm wire, that will minimise feed difficulties, however if circumstances dictate .9mm, then provided you keep basic maintenance up (clean wire, clean and correct liner, correct tips, correct U groove feed rollers and a straightish gun lead, you should be okay. Choose 5183 wire if possible as it is harder and feeds better.
    Your welder is at the lower end amperage wise of desirable, but should do the job up to 5mm (more with decent pre heat).
    As Grahame said tips make a big difference as we often hear the story that "it starts okay and then keeps sticking", which is a textbook symptom of wire expanding inside the tip (or arcing caused by dirty wire or badly worn tips).

  9. #9
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    The real benefit of a spool gun is running a longer lead for thin wire. So it depends on what you are doing. For instance: try climbing around inside a boat with a short lead, keeping it "as straight as possible" as you will see recommended - it's just not going to happen. If you're welding at a bench then a spool gun is a waste of money.
    I run 1.2m wire (5356) through a normal mig setup (teflon liner 4m cable) and have never had a problem. I run a spool gun for thinner material (0.8 or 0.9mm wire) when working inside boats. This is mine: https://weldingstore.tokentools.com....8-metre-cable/
    Cheers
    Mick

  10. #10
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    In the time before spool guns, I worked for a boss who thought nothing of hanging a wire feeder unit off a gantry.He did this on two boats. One steel and the second aluminium.He never had a problem with either.

    I can see WelderMicks point though as sometimes there is just no option.

    The other thing not mentioned is the cost per kilo of the mini spool.
    But for most of us a spool gun will not be needed. Do the simple things first.

    Grahame

  11. #11
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    I've been keen to set up a hanging wire feeder for a while now, but a swing arm system doesn't really suit my situation - I'd need it on a sliding rail, but easily removable.
    I saw a miller suitcase wirefeeder on auction a few weeks back, but I forgot to put in a bid before the auction closed! Would've been ideal for what I was thinking.
    Even with that I reckon I'd still use my spoolgun a fair bit - very versatile.
    Mick

  12. #12
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    I wired up one of these cheap Chinese spool guns to my old ESAB MIG Caddy 150-155amp machine it was pretty strait forward you have 4 wires, 2 for the trigger and 2 for the solenoid you than have a main power cable and a gas hose

    i started off by using a multi meter on the wires working out what was controlling the trigger and working out which wires of the two were + and - once sorted mark the wires

    than u need to work out the solenoid wires

    with the main power cable i think from memory i just used a lug terminal for small 12 volt batteries

    i entirely removed my ESAB feed rollers than removed my complete torch and cable this left me with my two solenoid wires, two trigger wires, one male hose connection from the solenoid and one main power delivery cable lug

    it was pretty strait forward in wiring up but these Chinese spool gun motors operate at a slightly lower voltage than our welders from memory our welders feed roller motors are 24-26v the Chinese spool gun motors are 20-22v so when using it u need to crank your wire speed up an extra bit to compensate

    to get the right settings it takes some tinkering and testing also u need the right tip i found GasWeld.com.au sold the right tips or this spool gun but they were a tiny bit shorter than the one that came with the spool gun but they still worked

  13. #13
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    [QUOTE=WelderMick;1938151]I've been keen to set up a hanging wire feeder for a while now, but a swing arm system doesn't really suit my situation - I'd need it on a sliding rail, but easily removable.

    Mick, I can highly recommend setting up a sliding rail for your wire feeder. A couple of years ago, I acquired a compactus track which was being scrapped (used in heavy mobile shelving). As usual some time passed before I got a Round Tuit, installation was surprisingly fiddly in alignments and probably would have been quicker to use angle iron. I utilised the original roller bearings and their assemblies, machined deeper grooves in the track wheels, the mounting arm was an old wall-mounted tv bracket, pivot post I machined and fitted with a roller bearing. Total track length is 8 metres.

    It’s been fantastic and I regret my initial tardiness in installing it. The wire feeder is above the clutter, easily removable off its pivot if required, its switches & dials always within reach, the handpiece cable is above and clear of the current job. I also have cable support on a roller system back to the power unit but haven’t yet fitted this.

    bench01.jpgbench02.jpgbench03.jpgbench04.jpg

    My main welding bench has lifting castors as I often need 360 degree access or to move it around. Its 3m x 1m x 10mm top is braced with a 50 x 50 angle lattice (originally suggested by Grahame Collins) & weighs 250 kgs. Before original bracing I levelled the plate carefully and now with a 3m straight edge and shims under the feet, I can set it up perfectly level in under 5 minutes after moving it. Its screw lifting castors are now design #2.

    bench05.jpgbench06.jpgbench07.jpgbench08.jpg
    Last edited by peterbilt; 19th Aug 2018 at 09:08 PM. Reason: tried to rotate horizontal pic to vertical

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