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  1. #1
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    Question MULTI PROCESS WELDER - Which one ?

    Hi All I'm seeking your opinions and advice.
    I need to buy a portable welder for my business. I already have a WIA 255s Mig Welder, Unimig 315 ac/dc tig, Pilot arc welder (pie warmer). I need a welder that is capable of Mig and MMA (arc). I need to be able able to use the welder on and offsite (might like to use it at home occasionally) so I am only looking at single phase welders. I really want something that can run 0.9mm solid steel wire, 1.2mm aluminium wire and 0.9mm and even 1.2mm gasless wire.
    I would be using the welder to repair boat trailers, general repairs and some welding on aluminium boats. So far I have been looking at these welders via the internet: Bossweld MST 200, WIA weldmatic 200i, WIA weldmatic 250i, Tokentools Synergic mig Mig210S Tokentools Pulse mig Mig250P. The WIA welders have a lower duty cycle than the others which is a bit of a let down. Also the WIA's will only run 1.0mm aluminium ( I am awaiting an answer about that from them though). I like the idea of the Pulse Mig for aluminium work.
    What do you think of those welders and do you know of others that are suitable ???. Thanks in advance.
    All The Best steran50 Stewart

    The shortest way to do many things is to do only one thing at once.

  2. #2
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    Not sure if this will mdo the heavier wires you are looking for ..... But ... I have this machine, I know 3 other guys with the same machine with various badges and paint jobs ..... great little machine.

    https://www.tradetools.com/product-r...er-w-argon-reg

    there is a bigger version, more current and bigger spool capacity.

    https://www.tradetools.com/product-r...k-inverter-reg

    you can pay 50% more for the same machine with a well known badge and a different paint job.

    cheers
    Any thing with sharp teeth eats meat.
    Most powertools have sharp teeth.
    People are made of meat.
    Abrasives can be just as dangerous as a blade.....and 10 times more painfull.

  3. #3
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    I like the this one

    Uni-Mig - Suppliers of UNIMIG / Razorweld & Razorcut Mig Welders, Tig Welder, Plasma Cutters, Gas Cutting Equipment, supplies and parts for your welding machines

    Its very light weighs about 6kg but what separates it from the pack is optional spool gun for alloy,
    Have a look at it before you make your mind up I think its a lot of machine for the price a decent welding shop should be able to let you try it out
    Expect to pay $1250.00 or less and about $400.00 for the spool gun

  4. #4
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    That's a somewhat tough one.
    From my perspective, I don't think you will find an ideal solution, just numerous compromises that will affect you to varying degrees.
    As I see it, your essentials are as follows.
    Gas/gassless capability from the MIG/FCAW side of the machine.
    Ability to run 15kg (6kg ally) spool size.
    1.2mm ally capability - should only be a roller compatability issue and most are fairly generic these days.
    Reasonable duty cycle, particularly if ally is on the menu.
    Product backup and warranty and parts availability. This is your business, not a hobby, so downtime is both costly and embarrassing.

    Secondary considerations.
    Generator compatibility/ 10A power compatibility. Will you be running from the customers power supply?
    Portability of the unit will suffer when loaded with a 15kg spool and any multiprocess machine will be substantially more cumbersome than a stick inverter.
    Depending on the type of boat work enisaged, mig may not be the best process, (trying to repair leaking seams can be very challenging with a mig and tinnies are right at the lower end of the thickness range suitable for mig for example).
    Access to boats can be challenging without a separate wire feeder, although if the unit is reasonably compact, a long gas line could solve that issue.
    Looking at the various options, I'm not doing cartwheels of joy. Duty cycles aren't marvelous on any machines I've looked at.
    If I had to buy such a machine, I would personally look for a Lincoln as my local dealer is also a repairer and will bend over backwards to get you up and running again. While some of the lesser known brands are quite good machines, I wouldn't be totally comfortable entrusting my business to them unless they had proven backup and service ability in a timely fashion, then again, some very big names totally stink at the backup game.
    My choice would be to have two machines. One a quality mig with portable feeder and the other a quality stick inverter (they pretty much all have lift tig capability now). For quick outdoor jobs, a stick inverter can be unpacked, plugged in and the job done before you've carried the multi process machine halfway there and the stick inverter will play happily on either a 10A domestic supply or a reasonable gennie. Some of the multiprocess machines are asking for 13kVa continuous rated gennies and one manufacturer I noticed hints at getting prior approval before running of a gennie.
    Only you can decide, but for me, a multi process just doesn't stack up for what I think you are looking for.
    Done much onsite ally work? It's a fair bit more mucking around than steel work usually. Not saying you shouldn't, just that it may be preferable to try and bring the ally work to a more controlled environment if you can.

  5. #5
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    I have a UniMig 165 - looks the same as the Trade Tools unit that Soundman linked to, but it also has the Jasic logo who have a reputation as a half-decent Chinese manufacturer of welders. I use it on site quite a lot with either a little D size CO2 bottle or just with stick leads. It's probably about 20 Kg, so not exactly light, but not unmanageable. As for bigger machines, I like the look of the Cigweld Transmig 200i, but I don't think it'll run a spool gun. The UniMig that dubman mentioned looks like a nice machine - it weighs 12Kg, not 6, but that's still pretty light. UniMig also do a 210 multi process that costs a little more, around $1,400, that features voltage and wire controls on the MIG torch.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karl Robbers View Post
    ...My choice would be to have two machines. One a quality mig with portable feeder and the other a quality stick inverter (they pretty much all have lift tig capability now).
    Multifunction whatevers are great as they are compact than what they combine and don't have duplicate things in them - but it also means that if one bit goes down then the whole thing is pretty much out of business.
    I share Karl's view that two units could be a better move - if your stick unit fails you can still finish the job with the MIG (and the other way around)

    Michael

  7. #7
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    I do struggle a bit with the idea of a mig as a site machine unless you have an awful lot of welding to do. My reasons for this are the lack of reach a mig has, even with a portable feeder. 3-4m up, down or horizontally pulls them up unless you make arrangements to lift the wire feeder/machine aloft. Not really an issue in a workshop setting, but a royal pain on site in my opinion. If arrangements are made to handle this, then a full size mig will be no more of a handicap. A little stick inverter, outfitted with 6M leads will access anywhere you may want to go far easier, while performing far better of poor power supplies commonly found on site, while giving up very little to self shielded flux core in the performance stakes.
    Perhaps somebody installing lots of ballustrading or fencing may have a case for a little handbag mig.
    I see multi process machines as being a better option for the handyman than the professional. Having said that, somebody must like them as they keep making them.

  8. #8
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    On the matter of spool guns, pretty much any welder with standard euro connections should take a spool gun with standard euro connections ....... so this should be considered as a separate issue.

    Unless you get up into the high and heavy end I doubt that you will find a multi-process with AC/DC TIG.

    Yes the unimig mentioned Is the same machine as I have but you will pay a lot more for it with that badge.

    Personally I doubt very much that I will ever use mine for TIG ....... at the time when I baught mine they did not come with a TIG handpiece though they do now.

    Having a small capacity MIG that a healthy welder can carry in 1 hand that will also do stick for the dirty work... makes a lot of sense .... trucking it with a D bottle would be quite portable.

    pretty much all small MIG units will do gasless wire ..... if you want to torture yourself .... I'd use stick before I'd use gasless wire.

    BUT for welding on the go with better TIG one of the up market lunchbox stick /TIG units would be far more practical.

    Yeh I think the combination of Portable, MIG, TIG and stick will aways be a compromise.

    cheers
    Any thing with sharp teeth eats meat.
    Most powertools have sharp teeth.
    People are made of meat.
    Abrasives can be just as dangerous as a blade.....and 10 times more painfull.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by soundman View Post
    On the matter of spool guns, pretty much any welder with standard euro connections should take a spool gun with standard euro connections ....... so this should be considered as a separate issue.
    I was under the impression an extra socket was needed, which I assumed was to provide power to the spool gun's feed motor.

    Yeh I think the combination of Portable, MIG, TIG and stick will aways be a compromise.
    If we were talking about the old transformer-based units where they were reliant on chokes and other inductors to get the desired behaviour, that'd be correct, but pretty much all welders now are inverter, and their voltage/current behaviour all comes down the programming of the microcontroller.

    A stick versus a DC TIG welder is pretty much exactly the same machine - a constant current source, but with different current regulation algorithms. However no supply can actually control current, rather it has to vary the voltage which in turn affects the current. A MIG welder is a constant voltage source and there is no reason, with good design and programming, that a welder can't work in both mode just as well as a single-process machine.

    The outlier is AC TIG where you need extra circuitry to provide AC output, which is a significantly different function to a CC/CV DC supply. I believe the inclusion of this function is why Tokentools has a AC TIG machine that includes a plasma cutter, as the high frequency AC supply needed for TIG is pretty much what you need for a plasma cutter.

  10. #10
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    Thanks guys. I'll start from the start. The tradetools one has got a great duty, but the nearest dealer is miles away. If it broke down I would have to wait quite a while.
    The Unimig you pointed out dubman is unfortunately the duty cycle like the the WIA ones is a let down. This Unimig fits the bill, but again the duty cycle lets it down Uni-Mig - Suppliers of UNIMIG / Razorweld & Razorcut Mig Welders, Tig Welder, Plasma Cutters, Gas Cutting Equipment, supplies and parts for your welding machines

    I agree Karl it's looking like a compromise, because its hard to find one that does exactly what I want. I probably wasn't very clear when I said offsite. What I meant was I would like something portable so if I want to do some welding at home I'm not loading a full size mig. It would be pretty rare that I would be doing a job at a customers house. There is a welding shop down the road from me, so I would be leaving those sort of jobs to him.
    I was looking at possibly a 250 amp machine, but they are fairly heavy. Yes 15kg rolls would make a 200 amp portable mig weigh about the same as a 250 amp one - restricting it's portability. I would much rather use my Tig to weld a leaky tinny than try to mig it. Any ally work with the multi process welder would just be small stuff like welding brackets to support a floor or other small ally jobs.
    I agree ally work is better done indoors and most of the time the ally work would be done indoors. There is the odd times when I can't get the boat inside and will have to do it outside.
    The same goes with the boat trailers. Most of the time I can get them inside, but sometimes I'll have boats in the way or it's more convenient to do it outside. The idea of two welders is not a bad idea and it's something to consider. We use to use the pie warmer to weld outside with as it has long leads. Before I bought the business we basically stopped using it as we found it was causing havoc with certain computer programs and the telstra digital phone would go out taking out the phone and internet.
    The WIA mig that I have has a seperate wire feeder which is mounted on a boom. The boom is something I need to look at to try and make it easier to remove the wire feeder by myself or even to make the boom longer so it's more user friendly for me.
    The Tig side of the multi process welder is something that I probably wouldn't use. I don't believe that even in the high end multi process welders that there is even one with AC/DC Tig. Whenever I have seen any Mig/arc/tig they have only been DC Tig.
    The only Multi Process welders that I have looked at that are close to fitting the requirements are the : Unimig Razorweld 210, Unimig 190 and the Boss MST 200. With the Boss be the more likely contender due to its duty cycle and wire sizing. I am going to send Dynaweld an email to ask some questions about their MST 200, though I am thinking about karls idea of two welders - a Mig welder and a Arc welder.
    Thanks again for your input guys.
    All The Best steran50 Stewart

    The shortest way to do many things is to do only one thing at once.

  11. #11
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    Haven't had a reply from either WIA or Dynaweld as yet, just as well I'm not desperate to buy one.
    All The Best steran50 Stewart

    The shortest way to do many things is to do only one thing at once.

  12. #12
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    I have a Kemmpi mini arc Evo 200, best welder I've ever used, up to 10 mm steel, and 5 miniute change over for up to 3mm alloy. It is an awesome piece of gear.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by riverbuilder View Post
    I have a Kemmpi mini arc Evo 200
    Not a multi-process machine though.

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