Thread: Agroshield 54 V Argoshield Light V Speed Gas Mixgas

I'm pretty sure I'll be buying a Speed Gas Mixgas E size cylinder tomorrow. Argoshield Light and Mixgas seem to be the same blend. I currently use Agroshield 54 but I cant find out the gas blend, it only a Aus product, only use it as thats what was recommended for the best welds on thin material some 30 years ago. BOC seem to list them as pretty much the same.
http://www.bocworldofwelding.com.au/...aitfile_id/93/

http://www.bocworldofwelding.com.au/...shield-54.html
http://www.bocworldofwelding.com.au/...eld-light.html

I dont weld anything special, just car panels and general welding around the shed. Anyone think I'll notice the difference?

Stuart

p.s. just found the 54 blend. 1.5% Oxygen, 7% Carbon Dioxide in Argon
Mixgas and Argosheild light are Argon 93%Carbon Dioxide 5%Oxygen 2%

I use this chart

http://supagas.com.au/wp-content/upl...tion-Chart.pdf

then

http://supagas.com.au/safety/information-sheets/

has the actual gas mix info to get what you need, also found them to be cheaper

Good luck

I doubt you will notice much difference at all between the gasses you mention. To fully exploit the characteristics of each shielding gas requires a robot welder or other such mechanised fixture. I can recall when Argoshield 100 was in the development phase there being a cylinder being sent to my local TAFE college for trial, (complete with similar secrecy to the latest model Holden or Ford undergoing testing). It was near on impossible to rate the gas as better or worse than other mixes until the envelope was really pushed. I think much of the hype about shielding gasses is akin to fishing lures - designed to catch fishermen rather than fish, so it is with shielding gas to a large extent.
I would choose between your chosen mixes based upon price and volume per cylinder as that may be the biggest difference between them for your purposes.
A word of advice on SupaGas cylinders. I have come across quite a few - more than any other brand, that leak through the gland nut on the valve, so check with some soapy water once you hook up and turn the valve on. Don't buy into the excuse that "they have a dual seat seal and you need to turn them all the way on", that is both wrong and dangerous, particularly in the case of oxygen or acetylene cylinders.

Thanks guys.......... I almost pulled the trigger but Karls comments have me wondering, Whats MIG welding steel with Argon like? a question I've asked before as I've wanted to get a tig but needing two bottles(especially from BOC) has always stopped me. Now I was told you cant TIG with a blend with any Oxygen.
I guess I could buy a second cylinder with the money I save on the first Anyone tried it?

Off to do some googling.

Stuart

Damn, google says it will work but even worse the straight CO2. I should have gone and bought the cylinder this morning.
Still even if I do buy two cylinders it will only take 5 years to be in front.

Stuart

Originally Posted by Stustoys

Thanks guys.......... I almost pulled the trigger but Karls comments have me wondering, Whats MIG welding steel with Argon like? a question I've asked before as I've wanted to get a tig but needing two bottles(especially from BOC) has always stopped me. Now I was told you cant TIG with a blend with any Oxygen.
I guess I could buy a second cylinder with the money I save on the first Anyone tried it?

Off to do some googling.

Stuart

Definitely can't tig with anything but inert gas (i.e. argon or helium) and it can't have any CO2 or O2 like MIG mixes). The 'I' in MIG is a misnomer in popular use, it's only MIG when using an inert gas such as 100% argon, otherwise it should strictly be termed GMAW or MAG welding.
I've compared argoshield heavy and light (varying levels of CO2 mixed with Argon) and I couldn't tell the difference. I fully agree with Karl's comments.
You can MIG steel with straight argon, but it's only good for light welding and not common practice. You have to use straight argon if MIG welding aluminium. Mixing CO2 into the gas for welding steel gives a heavier arc. The oxygen in some of the mixes apparently allows the puddle to flatten out a bit and 'wet in' at the edges. Straight CO2 is supposed to give good penetration but from what I've seen tends to have a more crowned bead appearance compared to argon/co2 mix.

Originally Posted by Stustoys

Damn, google says it will work but even worse the straight CO2. I should have gone and bought the cylinder this morning.
Still even if I do buy two cylinders it will only take 5 years to be in front.

Stuart

Hope I didn't lead you too far astray. The Supagas cylinders with the leaky valves I've come across have all been rental cylinders.
Straight Argon is unsuitable for Mig welding anything other than aluminium in my experience. When purging the lines out on a welder being converted back to steel from aluminium welding they run horribly until the proper gas runs through the system. This is due to the need for an oxidising gas such as Oxygen or CO2 to stabilise the arc. Likewise, some will tell you to weld stainless with straight Argon. Having had the misfortune of doing it, I can say I hope never to again. Very spattery and the weld did not seem to wet in well either.
There are some gasses that are suitable for both Tig and Mig usage for Aluminium or Stainless, but none that I am aware of that offer the same for steel. Pretty much stuck with two cylinders if Mig and Tig are on the cards.

Thank you gentlemen. Two cylinders it is, I'll save my tightassness for something else.

Stuart

Picked up my cylinder today. Seem like nice guys.
Thinking about it a little more. 2 years and I'm in front....now just have to find out when BOC want their cylinder back by and get my MIG back from my bothers place.
Might start looking at TIGs.

Stuart